The Gifted #6 'iMprint' Discussion (Spoilers)

[CGAR]

This episode definitely is better than the last episode. I think that the Strucker storyline and Mutant Underground is losing steam. And the promo for next week has me on team HFC.

Im calling this now: Twist will attack Lauren and that will make Andy realize she's batshit crazy and maybe HFC isn't for him.

And does anyone else think that Esme should be Sophie. Her characteristics are so not Esme from the comics. But they literally just had to call her Sophie and it would make more sense.

[AbnormallyNormal]

This episode definitely is better than the last episode. I think that the Strucker storyline and Mutant Underground is losing steam. And the promo for next week has me on team HFC.

Im calling this now: Twist will attack Lauren and that will make Andy realize she's batshit crazy and maybe HFC isn't for him.

And does anyone else think that Esme should be Sophie. Her characteristics are so not Esme from the comics. But they literally just had to call her Sophie and it would make more sense.

Welcome aboard, brother

The stuff with Twist is definitely setting up something awful I'm not sure it'll be as you describe but maybe. I am liking how Andy is pulling Lauren over though, I want that to continue. Maybe Lauren protects Andy from Twist but other things happen at the same time, or Lauren joins with Andy to try to help him or moderate the IC's behavior or something.

A lot of folks have pointed out this show's Esme is the "rational balanced" Cuckoo which is in pretty stark contrast to the Esme of the comics. But the commonality is basically being the lead personality. At this point it's too late for them to change it even if they've become aware of the aberration from the canon. I think TV show Phoebe is closer to comics Esme

[SpiderClops]

Good episode. But Shatter's death felt really really unnecessary. It barely even registered.

So 'Q.M.'. Any clue anyone?

[ExodusCloak]

Irma is the balanced Cuckoo.

SPICE that's the spectrum from good to evil

[Killerbee911]

Solid episode ,we finally past the setup phase in the show so we are getting better mixes of action and drama. I really like this episode not surprising it had very few scenes of Andy which is my key to show be being good. It also had the right amount of Catlin and Reed enough to be effective but not enough too annoying.

Quick Thoughts

- So the big question is who is Q.M. in the texts from Reeva

- I am holding out hope for Shatter not being dead. The exact words used was "that guy you cracked open" when talking to Jace. Until you see a body a character isn't dead

- We all know the Struckers are the weak point of the show. I was jokingly doing a death watch every time I talk in recap but truth until one of them dies it won't get any better because imo my opinion it is only to give their family drama real weight

- I am really like the original character of Twist, I hope she shows up in the comics. Great Villain power and now that someone said it I think the X-men could do with a "Joker" like character who doesn't care about peaceful existence or mutant superiority but just chaos.

Inner Circle next week

gifted.jpg

[Elden]

This show just keeps getting better. The Frost Sisters backstory was handled so well and Polaris' confrontation with them for getting in her daughter's head. Damn that was awesome!

[Grey]

I have a question for you guys.

If someone was raised from childhood by their parents to hate gay people and people of color... to spit on them or assault them on signt when they saw them. To what extent would this be understandable due to how they were raised vs unacceptable due to the fact that they are now adults with their own thoughts and actions?

I’m having trouble figuring out how to perceive the cuckoos here.

[Rivka]

I'm finally caught up! Great episode! Lots of psychological under-currents here. I think this show has really done a great job balancing action sequences and the quiet interpersonal moments.

Not enough Lorna, though. I love the Cuckoos and I thought their backstory was extremely well done, but I need to see more Polaris.

Some very interesting, intense "mommy" moments. I was squirming while watching Lorna leave baby Dawn in the bassinet while she goes to practice. *No no no, don't leave the baby unattended*-- LOL! Speaking of which, those of you who are saying Lorna overreacted to Esme's mental manipulations of her baby, no she didn't. Has anyone here had a baby? Can you imagine someone getting into your baby's brain? Given it was Esme, who has put on an act of aggressive disdain, how was Lorna to know Esme meant no harm? Look at all the "mommy" stuff going on--Esme seems to have latched on to Lorna as a "mother figure" but Lorna is very insecure as a new mom, she didn't have a great childhood either. Also, Lorna has huge trust problems. She is convinced to trust Esme, then she finds out Esme was messing with her baby's mind. The lullaby thing wasn't an overreaction from a macro-writing point of view (like the show made a mistake), but a telling reaction by Lorna to Esme "stealing" her private relationship with her child. Lorna has very little to grab on to, very few good memories, and she was connecting with her baby in a very private way with that lullaby. Esme "stealing" it and then humming it casually in the elevator, really must have seemed like a fundamental violation to Lorna.

But Lorna is basically a good person, who has generous heart, and once she realized where Esme was coming from, and heard Esme's story, she was able to forgive her.

The show also does that dance between civil liberties and law and order, civil disobedience and anarchy--I think THE GIFTED handles these political/social themes quite well. You have the X-Men Underground led by Thunderbird and Blink; they're not exactly heroes, but tend more to the Xavierite point of view. Then the group of mutants like Polaris who are currently allied with the Inner Circle, who feel it's time to take more violent and direct action to save mutants--not exactly heroes, not "villains" either. They work with Reeva from their point of view, not *for* her. Reeva is more like the classic Hell Fire Club Inner Circle from the 1980s; her goals seem noble, but you wonder what she's really up to, what she's really after. Personal gain? Wealth? Power? Characters like Jace Turner provide another point of view--we can understand where he's coming from, he even seems reasonable when compared to the Purifiers. He also has a personal, emotional reason for hating mutants; but he is unequivocally the antagonist in THE GIFTED. The way he subtly gets control of the Purifiers, makes them seem more civilized and rational, is chilling.

I really like this show, as I've said many times. I appreciate very much the world-view of Marvel television, shows like DAREDEVIL and JESSICA JONES. I give credit to Joe Quesada and Jeph Loeb for this, as well as the Fox producers. I like that there are no simple answers, simplistic divisions like "heroes" and "villains." I'm worried about the future of THE GIFTED and Marvel television once Disney fully takes over Fox properties in a few months. Disney is definitely going to do their own streaming/original programming using their vast array of characters. I hope Disney leaves Marvel television alone to produce their shows the way they want. I don't want to see all live-action Marvel productions looking like the goofus GUARDIANS OF THE GALAXY. The X-Men deserve a more nuanced, complex treatment.

Anyway, Ep. 6 was great. Looking forward to more Lorna in upcoming episodes!

[Rivka]

I have a question for you guys.

If someone was raised from childhood by their parents to hate gay people and people of color... to spit on them or assault them on signt when they saw them. To what extent would this be understandable due to how they were raised vs unacceptable due to the fact that they are now adults with their own thoughts and actions?

I’m having trouble figuring out how to perceive the cuckoos here.

That's an excellent question. And then there's the specific situation of child telepaths. They are bombarded by the thoughts of millions of people; if they have no guidance, how do they even keep their sanity? (Jean had Xavier to help her, for example.) I gather Reeva found the Cuckoos when they were still 13 or 14 years old and helped guide them, teach them to control their powers.

To answer your question, some people when exposed to influences outside their home, get woke, so to speak. It sets up a huge emotional disaster because if this is a young person who has learned a new way of thinking, they have to confront their bigoted families and can be punished for deviating from the family culture. (One of the reasons the far right likes home-schooling; they want to control their kids' belief system for as long as they can, to indoctrinate them.) But I think with a good teacher, a mentor, a great leader, a person can wake up, the scales fall from their eyes so to speak. The Cuckoos have another particular existential problem--they'retest tube babies, clones. It's a nature vs. nurture debate, I think. (1) Esme is clearly delineated from her sisters--yet they're clones. Is this because of outside influence then? Nurture? What influences did Esme have that were different from her sisters'? (2) There is a core of good in all three sisters--they're not anti-social, not narcissistic, even if Reeva has taught them to behave like they are.

I guess you have to believe the original--Emma Frost--has a heart of gold, and her daughters/clones would be potentially empathetic, sympathetic, life-affirming if given the chance. How much of an influence has the Hell Fire Club, Reeva, and the Inner Circle had on the Cuckoos, as well as their early years as lab-rats?

[AbnormallyNormal]

I have a question for you guys.

If someone was raised from childhood by their parents to hate gay people and people of color... to spit on them or assault them on signt when they saw them. To what extent would this be understandable due to how they were raised vs unacceptable due to the fact that they are now adults with their own thoughts and actions?

I’m having trouble figuring out how to perceive the cuckoos here.

Well I think in general people assume that most bigots were indeed brought up that way. That's probably usually what happens. And they just haven't had wide enough experiences with different kinds of folks to kind of realize how wrong it is.

There is a reason people who live in urban centers tend to be more open minded socially - it ties into the whole "people fear what they don't understand, and then fear turns to hate". But if you are actually placed in situations where you experience different kinds of people and can interact with them and find out they are actually... very similar to you fundamentally... it helps to remove the entire inclination to viciously stereotype. Whereas if you grow up on an isolated small town/farm/etc it's a LOT easier to get these vague threatening ideas about entire groups of folks.

I don't really equate your question to the Cuckoos though, since they were if anything being trained to kind of hurt their own kind for the benefit of humans who were using them as lab experiments and not treating them like real people in any way.

We don't know their transition after escaping from Creed International to the present.

But it seems clear they all have some sort of a conscience, "even" Sophie and Phoebe. The impression I received is Sophie and Phoebe are just eager to be "followers" and get "guided" by some kind of an authority or parental stand-in which is how they view Reeva seemingly. But when Esme says things in contradiction to Reeva sometimes Sophie and Phoebe are given pause and sort of take Esme's side, and go back and forth that way. So I think it's entirely possible Esme's example as a role model of siding with Lorna (if Lorna ever does overthrow Reeva) could lead to Sophie and Phoebe going with Esme and not necessarily battling against her. Although there might be a temporary struggle.

I'm finally caught up! Great episode! Lots of psychological under-currents here. I think this show has really done a great job balancing action sequences and the quiet interpersonal moments.

Not enough Lorna, though. I love the Cuckoos and I thought their backstory was extremely well done, but I need to see more Polaris.

Some very interesting, intense "mommy" moments. I was squirming while watching Lorna leave baby Dawn in the bassinet while she goes to practice. *No no no, don't leave the baby unattended*-- LOL! Speaking of which, those of you who are saying Lorna overreacted to Esme's mental manipulations of her baby, no she didn't. Has anyone here had a baby? Can you imagine someone getting into your baby's brain? Given it was Esme, who has put on an act of aggressive disdain, how was Lorna to know Esme meant no harm? Look at all the "mommy" stuff going on--Esme seems to have latched on to Lorna as a "mother figure" but Lorna is very insecure as a new mom, she didn't have a great childhood either. Also, Lorna has huge trust problems. She is convinced to trust Esme, then she finds out Esme was messing with her baby's mind. The lullaby thing wasn't an overreaction from a macro-writing point of view (like the show made a mistake), but a telling reaction by Lorna to Esme "stealing" her private relationship with her child. Lorna has very little to grab on to, very few good memories, and she was connecting with her baby in a very private way with that lullaby. Esme "stealing" it and then humming it casually in the elevator, really must have seemed like a fundamental violation to Lorna.

But Lorna is basically a good person, who has generous heart, and once she realized where Esme was coming from, and heard Esme's story, she was able to forgive her.

The show also does that dance between civil liberties and law and order, civil disobedience and anarchy--I think THE GIFTED handles these political/social themes quite well. You have the X-Men Underground led by Thunderbird and Blink; they're not exactly heroes, but tend more to the Xavierite point of view. Then the group of mutants like Polaris who are currently allied with the Inner Circle, who feel it's time to take more violent and direct action to save mutants--not exactly heroes, not "villains" either. They work with Reeva from their point of view, not *for* her. Reeva is more like the classic Hell Fire Club Inner Circle from the 1980s; her goals seem noble, but you wonder what she's really up to, what she's really after. Personal gain? Wealth? Power? Characters like Jace Turner provide another point of view--we can understand where he's coming from, he even seems reasonable when compared to the Purifiers. He also has a personal, emotional reason for hating mutants; but he is unequivocally the antagonist in THE GIFTED. The way he subtly gets control of the Purifiers, makes them seem more civilized and rational, is chilling.

I really like this show, as I've said many times. I appreciate very much the world-view of Marvel television, shows like DAREDEVIL and JESSICA JONES. I give credit to Joe Quesada and Jeph Loeb for this, as well as the Fox producers. I like that there are no simple answers, simplistic divisions like "heroes" and "villains." I'm worried about the future of THE GIFTED and Marvel television once Disney fully takes over Fox properties in a few months. Disney is definitely going to do their own streaming/original programming using their vast array of characters. I hope Disney leaves Marvel television alone to produce their shows the way they want. I don't want to see all live-action Marvel productions looking like the goofus GUARDIANS OF THE GALAXY. The X-Men deserve a more nuanced, complex treatment.

Anyway, Ep. 6 was great. Looking forward to more Lorna in upcoming episodes!

I hear what you say about how Lorna was suspicious about the Cuckoos. Like I said I blame Marcos for his whole nonsense "they're in your head, don't let them tear apart our family" speech he gave. I think that left Lorna a bit "shook" to use the vernacular.

So yes I *understand* why Lorna erupted in rage. I'm just saying, factually speaking, as the audience, we should be able to recognize it as a wildly misplaced overreaction. Because it was. And once Esme explained things Lorna realized her own mistake...

And yeah I agree with everything else you said too

[WallStreeter]

I'm finally caught up! Great episode! Lots of psychological under-currents here. I think this show has really done a great job balancing action sequences and the quiet interpersonal moments.

Not enough Lorna, though. I love the Cuckoos and I thought their backstory was extremely well done, but I need to see more Polaris.

Some very interesting, intense "mommy" moments. I was squirming while watching Lorna leave baby Dawn in the bassinet while she goes to practice. *No no no, don't leave the baby unattended*-- LOL! Speaking of which, those of you who are saying Lorna overreacted to Esme's mental manipulations of her baby, no she didn't. Has anyone here had a baby? Can you imagine someone getting into your baby's brain? Given it was Esme, who has put on an act of aggressive disdain, how was Lorna to know Esme meant no harm? Look at all the "mommy" stuff going on--Esme seems to have latched on to Lorna as a "mother figure" but Lorna is very insecure as a new mom, she didn't have a great childhood either. Also, Lorna has huge trust problems. She is convinced to trust Esme, then she finds out Esme was messing with her baby's mind. The lullaby thing wasn't an overreaction from a macro-writing point of view (like the show made a mistake), but a telling reaction by Lorna to Esme "stealing" her private relationship with her child. Lorna has very little to grab on to, very few good memories, and she was connecting with her baby in a very private way with that lullaby. Esme "stealing" it and then humming it casually in the elevator, really must have seemed like a fundamental violation to Lorna.

But Lorna is basically a good person, who has generous heart, and once she realized where Esme was coming from, and heard Esme's story, she was able to forgive her.



I really like this show, as I've said many times. I appreciate very much the world-view of Marvel television, shows like DAREDEVIL and JESSICA JONES. I give credit to Joe Quesada and Jeph Loeb for this, as well as the Fox producers. I like that there are no simple answers, simplistic divisions like "heroes" and "villains." I'm worried about the future of THE GIFTED and Marvel television once Disney fully takes over Fox properties in a few months. Disney is definitely going to do their own streaming/original programming using their vast array of characters. I hope Disney leaves Marvel television alone to produce their shows the way they want. I don't want to see all live-action Marvel productions looking like the goofus GUARDIANS OF THE GALAXY. The X-Men deserve a more nuanced, complex treatment.

Anyway, Ep. 6 was great. Looking forward to more Lorna in upcoming episodes!

Esme when she gave the full story was full of emotion, which the Cuckoos rarely display. And what happened with Celeste and Mindee is the kind of horror Polaris wants to stop. But even before she heard the full story, in the comments she made to Esme in her room she essentially told her just because those who created you want you to be a certain way does not mean you have to be that way.