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  1. #1246
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    Quote Originally Posted by Immortal Hulk View Post
    Yeah, it's a small event, if anything. WotR should be compared to Heroes in Crisis (which was terrible), Doomsday Clock (in a sense, because of the many delays) and even DCeased (not even in continuity!). All these are kicking its ass. And wasn't WotR sold as the biggest event Secret Wars, the one who would change the MU? It was. Really poor performance.
    I saw it went to around 75000 at issue two iirc

    That's decent but not major

    Anyone know what numbers it ended on?

  2. #1247
    Man or Monster? Immortal Hulk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kilderkin View Post
    I saw it went to around 75000 at issue two iirc

    That's decent but not major

    Anyone know what numbers it ended on?
    Around 69,000 for issue #6 and 67,000 for issue #5, kilderkin.

    https://www.comichron.com/monthlycom...9/2019-06.html

  3. #1248
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    Quote Originally Posted by Immortal Hulk View Post
    Around 69,000 for issue #6 and 67,000 for issue #5, kilderkin.

    https://www.comichron.com/monthlycom...9/2019-06.html
    Thanks

    Those are lower than I thought

    Not really good at all

  4. #1249
    Mighty Member Biclopcicle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GrandEleven View Post
    Pretty close estimation. Id only put a few disagreements in that list:

    1. Beyonder's more than any other beings have fluxed in power level. From the singular Beyonder, to it being a race of Beyonders, to the Beyonder tribunal that was in Secret Wars that killed TLT, they are probably the most plot-convenient power in all of Marvel Comics. The ultimate McGuffin. That said, in their last big outing it took multiple Beyonders to take down TLT (simultaneously from multiple universes), so I would put them on abstract level when individually measured, though as a "force" they are always just as strong as they need to be. Full disclosure: I don't like them as they really just feel redundant to the Celestials (which fill that role that the titans fill in Greek mythology) and would really prefer they were forgotten.

    2. Odin is no more powerful than the all fathers of other pantheons. IIRC, he's mentioned Zeus may even be more powerful then himself, but I don't remember where I read that from so I could be wrong. Elder Gods would be in that same ballpark (to the point where Odin himself may merely count as an elder god). They all may fight among each other from comic to comic on who's the most powerful ... but none of them rise to the abstracts who re clearly a level above.

    3. Watchers are an odd case. They seem to be merely like eternals on one hand, have immense power like celestial on another, but are so passive by nature that ranking them is near impossible. I like to personally think of them as more eternal like, as it fits their concept better (some unknowable race watching the universe unfold), but I get why people would rank them higher.

    Cool old-school power structure:



    Newer Image that just shows the pantheon ... ranking isn't really set this time.


    Oh and mandatory verbal annoyance that I think by and large most of the Marvel Pantheon is mishandled. Way too much focus on power levels, not nearly enough on sphere of influence and purpose in the universe (multiverse). I don't even like the _idea_ that something can fight The Living Tribunal. It goes against it's very concept of judge/juror of the Laws of the Universe. It should literally simply pass the verdict of "nope" and said conflict ends, but much like it was allowed to continue in the Infinity Gauntlet story, we can't really understand how/why he passes judgement. It's simply beyond our feeble minds.
    Awesome post!

    I think the first one is from Starlin and his Thanos series...not sure about the second one.

    But yeah the Celestials used to be "Space Gods" above basically everything, kind of like what the Beyonders were. But with the growth of Cosmic Marvel, they've kind of fallen...

    But the Beyonders are gone for good (as gone as you can be in comics, that is). You can thank Doom and Owen Reece.

  5. #1250
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    Quote Originally Posted by Biclopcicle View Post
    Awesome post!

    I think the first one is from Starlin and his Thanos series...not sure about the second one.
    I think the second image is from Marvel Universe: The End, where its showing Thor as a skyfather on par with Zeus.

  6. #1251
    Incredible Member GrandEleven's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Biclopcicle View Post
    But the Beyonders are gone for good (as gone as you can be in comics, that is). You can thank Doom and Owen Reece.
    You know ... I never really put together that Doom collecting their power essentially means he wiped them all out. That is a comforting thought ... I think Ill run with that (until someone brings them back of course).

    The 2nd image really didn't add all that much to the conversation except to perhaps imply that Zeus and All Father Thor were at the same level ... I actually thought I was posting a different image at first but meh ... I love the Marvel Pantheon so I left it up

    I'd be perfectly fine with the Celestials being placed back up as that "outside threat from beyond". They really have been nerfed pretty hard as of late. They went from this ancient race of beings that even Odin feared enough to have the Destroyer created, to things that could be entirely wiped out by one scream from Black Bolt (as long as he was gutted open by Thanos, of course).

    Another angle I'd be fine wit his if they were treated more like the beings in the movie Prometheus. Creators of life as we know it for reasons we really don't get. Feared and respected by those who know of them ... but again: less focus on who powerful they are and more a mere acceptance that some things are "beyond comprehension" like space faring Cthulhu. Can that being take on Zeus? Do we really need that defined? Would we even understand the answer/battle if we saw it?

  7. #1252

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    so is the mini series over now? When will it be collected? How many spinoff minis will get collected?

  8. #1253
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    Quote Originally Posted by Digifiend View Post
    lol at Event Leviathan. It was only ONE place above the WOTR issues. And that was issue 1, so it's only going to get worse. Marvel 1-0 DC.

    WOTR itself might have sold low for an event, but it could be worse. And there is a silver lining - the event actually gave Squirrel Girl of all things a major boost - when did it last sell 10k for a single issue? Also, New Agents of Atlas #1, in it's second month, outsold issues 3 and 4, which tells me a lot of retailers underordered and had to order more copies (over 24k). Demand must've seriously outstripped supply there.
    Lol at event comics in general. We have finally hit peak event fatigue. And it's good ! Maybe good comics (like Venom) will not lose his momentum because of mandatory tie-ins. And maybe Dc and Marvel will work more on their events, don't make two events per year but only make them when they have a really good idea. War of the realm was a decent Thor story who could have been told in it's own comics. Streching it on a 6 issues event with multiple tie-ins cheapened it's impact; it was clear after the second issue that the rest was just fill-in with gorgeous actions until the last issue.
    I try to improve my english, feel free to correct me by DM if you see some mistakes !

  9. #1254
    Mighty Member Biclopcicle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GrandEleven View Post
    You know ... I never really put together that Doom collecting their power essentially means he wiped them all out. That is a comforting thought ... I think Ill run with that (until someone brings them back of course).

    The 2nd image really didn't add all that much to the conversation except to perhaps imply that Zeus and All Father Thor were at the same level ... I actually thought I was posting a different image at first but meh ... I love the Marvel Pantheon so I left it up

    I'd be perfectly fine with the Celestials being placed back up as that "outside threat from beyond". They really have been nerfed pretty hard as of late. They went from this ancient race of beings that even Odin feared enough to have the Destroyer created, to things that could be entirely wiped out by one scream from Black Bolt (as long as he was gutted open by Thanos, of course).

    Another angle I'd be fine wit his if they were treated more like the beings in the movie Prometheus. Creators of life as we know it for reasons we really don't get. Feared and respected by those who know of them ... but again: less focus on who powerful they are and more a mere acceptance that some things are "beyond comprehension" like space faring Cthulhu. Can that being take on Zeus? Do we really need that defined? Would we even understand the answer/battle if we saw it?
    I like what Ewing did with them in Ultimates. Similar to what you describe and what place they've held throughout all the iterations of the multiverse

  10. #1255
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ravin' Ray View Post
    It should be noted that Tom DeFalco wrote Sue's powers as being specifically effective against Celestials because her father-in-law Nathaniel theorized that her force fields originate from the same hyperspace dimension from which the Celestials' armor derive from, and thus she can achieve the proper harmonic vibration that can shatter them.
    Mmmmm.

    As usual, anyone with the last name “Richards” is more powerful than absolutely ANYBODY simply by talking. They define the nature of reality simply by stating what it is.
    If ten years of recording The Young and the Restless for my mother have taught me anything, it's that characters in serial dramas are always happily in love...until they're not

    “The very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in common. Instead of altering their views to fit the facts, they alter the facts to fit their views...which can be very uncomfortable if you happen to be one of the facts that needs altering.” - the 4th Doctor

  11. #1256
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charlie_1981 View Post
    If the Enchantress appears here, I hope and pray that Aaron will do something decent with her, because otherwise I will never read a Thor comic written by him, I am tired of humiliations and trash that can not be read and Aaron will show that he can not write any Asgardian character, not even Thor and Odin.

    Only I care for Amora, the rest means nothing for me.
    I hear ya! I mean I would like to see the return of the Young Masters version of Enchantress. She would've been a perfect villain for Jane Foster but oh well. I always wanted to see what happened to her when Amora banished her and where she is. I would have her return with a new set of powers.

  12. #1257

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    Which tie-ins dealt with the defeat of Malekith’s allies? And what became of Dario Agger?

  13. #1258
    Mighty Member GodThor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AgentOrange626 View Post
    And what became of Dario Agger?
    he got wrekted by human Jane and human Roz LoL.

  14. #1259

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    Lol how depressing. But expected at this point. Was this in the main event? Must have missed that..

  15. #1260
    Mighty Member GodThor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AgentOrange626 View Post
    Lol how depressing. But expected at this point. Was this in the main event? Must have missed that..
    there was only one panel of that in WotR main comic.

    chapter 4 or 5.

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