1. #28696
    Astonishing Member Ulfhammer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ButterRum View Post
    Im not even counting on the movies to get the Dark Phoenix Saga right. The current comics can't even get it right. Everything has been misinterpreted, and the Phoenix Force's purpose has been retconned too much. It's a mess.
    Agreed. If it happens to be a good movie, I'll be happy. I have zero faith in it representing the DPS well, especially given that the last movie will have to function as the PS and it certainly didn't do that in my mind.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RLAAMJR. View Post
    If adult Cyclops will be gone as long as how long Jean was gone, i think it's ok for as long as he comes back as the new Phoenix.
    I don't know, Jean just dropped out of the show. She just gave up the Phoenix Force. Well, it's clear it wasn't an accident.
    Do you remember this?







    ...and this...





    I'm sure we'll soon have The Phoenix back in an aura of splendour and glory, but in The Avengers' books... or maybe a new female character for the new Thor book.

    Forget The Phoenix Force in the X-books. At least for the next few years.
    Last edited by CuteClops; 02-05-2018 at 07:43 AM.

  3. #28698
    Astonishing Member Ulfhammer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ladyofthelake View Post
    Which is why I said I loved the *idea* of it. We've seen that the Phoenix was obsessed with Scott, and maybe it was because of Jean, maybe not, even in Endsong it's not made clear since the first few issues imply something, and the last few issues imply something else. The *idea* is interesting to me. There's certainty enough of a connection between the Phoenix and Scott that it makes for an intriguing thought. After all, AvX was not the first time the Phoenix used Scott as a host.

    There's some weird stuff that has gone on with the Phoenix and retconned so many times, but what intrigues me is that, the first few times Hope manifested the Phoenix before it was anywhere near earth, Scott was physically there.
    Fair enough. Sorry to misunderstand your meaning. The PF lore is confusing enough where at some point I just needed to pick an interpretation and go with it. I see everything PF related through that lens now. Maybe not the most forward thinking approach but it works for me.

    If we consider for a moment that the PF has it's own desires and agenda then yes, I think there's enough history there to suggest that the PF has a thing for Scott and I could certainly see this being explored, but personally I hope it's explored in FF not on panel. I think after Rachel, Hope, the P5 and the junk in Thor, Jean's special connection to the PF was massively diluted and I don't like that *idea*.

  4. #28699
    Astonishing Member ladyofthelake's Avatar
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    Okay, so I went ahead and put the photos I had found from the X-Men Dark Phoenix movie on my deviant art account in case anyone wants to check them out and grab them.

    Here's the link:

    https://watersoter.deviantart.com/gallery/

  5. #28700
    Astonishing Member ladyofthelake's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by maxi_miceli View Post
    The spoilers they already gave us about the movie said that Scott is going to go above and beyond to defend Jean, the quotes are:

    "The one mutant who never wavers from Team Jean is Scott (Tye Sheridan), a.k.a. Cyclops."

    "that relationship, his being willing to kill or die for her, is a huge part of the emotional core of the movie. It also makes Scott start to have to become a leader."

    The mention of "team Jean" alongside the picture of her apparently breaking down, and of course, the already established Phoenix in previous films makes me think that Jean is going to have serious problems with the Phoenix, with the two personalities colliding (or if by a mirecle they decide to make the Phoenix an entity like in the comics with the Phoenix itself) and that not all the team is going to side with Jean, kinda like in the original Phoenix saga with Scott trying to reach out to Jean when she went Dark Phoenix and Xavier attacking her

    The thing that, if done well, will be amazing is having the last Fox X-men movie/s focusing on Scott/Jean and having Scott as the leader, that should influence what people will expect after the merge, and what happens in the movies influences a lot what happens in the comics, several characters were changed in the comics after the original movies. And having Scott as one of the two main characters in the movies and dead in the comics wouldn't make much sense, Marvel loves movies synergy
    Oh nice!! Thanks for sharing!!! Like many here I'm not holding my breath but I hope that they do a good job. With the kind of talent they have, I hope they do justice to the film. I do hope they finally off JLow. Her character has outlived her usefulness in the franchise and frankly, the actress has become poison for the box office. She used to be such a cool actress, then she opened her mouth and like G. Paltrow, the rest is history.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ulfhammer View Post
    Fair enough. Sorry to misunderstand your meaning. The PF lore is confusing enough where at some point I just needed to pick an interpretation and go with it. I see everything PF related through that lens now. Maybe not the most forward thinking approach but it works for me.

    If we consider for a moment that the PF has it's own desires and agenda then yes, I think there's enough history there to suggest that the PF has a thing for Scott and I could certainly see this being explored, but personally I hope it's explored in FF not on panel. I think after Rachel, Hope, the P5 and the junk in Thor, Jean's special connection to the PF was massively diluted and I don't like that *idea*.
    No worries. I was finally able to get into writing mode so everything sounds like an interesting idea to be right now, lol!! I think at this point anyone could write the PF anyway they want to and it wouldn't matter. Sigh. I like that they finally went back to the basics with the PF and Jean being two separate entities. I never liked the idea that they were somehow predestined or part of each other. They did that in the other trilogy and looked like they were headed that way in X-Men Evolution, but it didn't work then and I hope they dump it now. The fact that they split Jean and PF now and made sure they reaffirmed that they are two separate entities, might either be Disney's last backslap at Fox before the merger (please somebody stop it!!), or a preview of what we can expect for the film.

    I have some of the early photos of how Lilandra is going to look. Let's just say if they went over the top the Apocalypse, they went the complete opposite with her. She looks alien, and that's the nicest thing I can say about it. Bleh. Check it out at my deviant art account. I would love to hear your opinions.

  6. #28701

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    with a new team in Blue book what will happen with Tyke and brats? if tyke goes back we will not have cyclops at all. (representative of our cyclops). Okay this sucks. Everything is getting political. Video games, comic books, sports, like seriously leave **** alone.
    It made Jean the leader because trendy “strong female character” while shitting on Cyclops at every turn. Seriously, why do all the X-Men books need to have female leaders? Teen Jean, Kitty Pryde, Polaris and now Old Jean. When are we going to get Rightclops back? My irritation with Blue is Cyclops being a total spineless WEAK bitch and letting Jean lead. **** Marvel for doing it just for trendy strong female kicking ass points. They killed Adult Cyclops now they had to rip out what was remaining of Tyke’s balls?
    Everything sucks.
    Rant
    Jean really is the worst character in Marvel, isn't she?
    Scemma forever Triangle never.
    Scott needs an alpha female like Bettsy.
    What woman wouldn't be attracted to Scott? He's 100% alpha male who tells the Avengers to go f*#& themselves.
    I want cyclops back free from any ginger women to be his own man.
    Logically..
    TeenClops should have lusted for Emma & Cuckoos. Especially Stepford Cuckoos! They're teenage triplet clones of his hottest ex, how could he not be?
    End of rant

  8. #28703
    Mighty Member maxi_miceli's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ladyofthelake View Post
    Oh nice!! Thanks for sharing!!! Like many here I'm not holding my breath but I hope that they do a good job. With the kind of talent they have, I hope they do justice to the film. I do hope they finally off JLow. Her character has outlived her usefulness in the franchise and frankly, the actress has become poison for the box office. She used to be such a cool actress, then she opened her mouth and like G. Paltrow, the rest is history.
    It seems to me like the most likely scenario is that Mystique will be the one killed, the character was widely changed from her role in the original movies, there's no way to make her like that again, it would provide a pretty good reason for Xavier to act like he did in the Phoenix saga and be hostile to Jean, in the movies she is basically his sister after all, since in the movies he isn't as much of a jerk as comics Xavier and he wouldn't attack Jean just because he couldn't control her (like he insulted Scott when Jean first got her powers and he refused to leave the hospital to help the rest of the team who were too far away to even reach in time), and IMO it's very likely that he will basically lead the anti-Jean team, because if Scott s going to be showing leadership skills he will have to face the current leadership, otherwise he would just be following. She seemed to be the field leader of the X-men in the last movie, role which we know will be Scott's, and let's not forget that she is the one actress/actor that has been constantly saying how much she wants out of the movies because of how much she hates the makeup (which for what they tell is quite hellish).
    Is either that or Quicksilver, because even though Beast also is missing from the funeral picture he appears in the last scenes of DoFP, and they seem to be respecting at least the end of it, but they would be quite dumb to kill a character that without trying much can create a very good comic relief.

    I do have to say that I do fear the director, not because of anything in particular he did, but because even though he has a long list of credits as writer and producer, including being the co-creator of Star Wars rebels, which I love, it's his first film as a director, he has been involved in the new direction the movies took since the reboot so he isn't completely new, but I would prefer someone with more experience or at least someone behind him good enough to prevent mistakes, even the greats like George Lucas wouldn't be anything if it wasn't for his wife's editions to the first SW

  9. #28704
    Mighty Member maxi_miceli's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldscottsummers View Post
    with a new team in Blue book what will happen with Tyke and brats? if tyke goes back we will not have cyclops at all. (representative of our cyclops). Okay this sucks. Everything is getting political. Video games, comic books, sports, like seriously leave **** alone.
    It made Jean the leader because trendy “strong female character” while shitting on Cyclops at every turn. Seriously, why do all the X-Men books need to have female leaders? Teen Jean, Kitty Pryde, Polaris and now Old Jean. When are we going to get Rightclops back? My irritation with Blue is Cyclops being a total spineless WEAK bitch and letting Jean lead. **** Marvel for doing it just for trendy strong female kicking ass points. They killed Adult Cyclops now they had to rip out what was remaining of Tyke’s balls?
    Everything sucks.
    Dude, if you start with the outlook that everything sucks everything will, no matter how good it is.
    The new team in Blue is a secondary team because the main team is lost in space, and is coming back the same month the new team arrives, Bunn has been wanting to write more of Lorna and Magneto for a while, and he took the chance of doing so while the main team is having their big event with Venom in a separate comic, event in which Tyke is front and center, he is the focus on the X-men side of the story and Bunn said that he will even become friend with Venom after this, so that expands the posibilities of him appearing elsewhere.

    There are all female leaders because, one the X-men had for a long time a very good amount of females in the team and two, because the male leader is dead, and I really hope they don't make Wolverine a leader when he comes back, not because of hating him, I don't, because it was awful for him, he is the loner of the team, other than Cyclops what other men can lead? on the other hand Storm is a natural leader, and is one of the old leaders, Kitty had been gaining that role for a while, not that she has been writen well doing it, Jean had always had the potential to be a leader and only rarely put in that role, people forget that she was basically the original rightclops, she was the one that pushed everyone from the original team so that they would form X-factor, the same speech of not standing by while the mutant race is Persecuted that was Cyclops's mantra is the one Jean gave there.
    Also Tyke, since he came to the present, has been much less interested in leading, while Jean was more interested in doing so, he has developed into much more of a loner, from leaving the team in the first issues of ANXM to going awol in between ANXM vol1 and vol2 to hunt mutant radicals who attacked humans, and it's important to notice that Cyke hadn't always been the leader he is, a lot of him being a leader in the origianl run was just trying to please Xavier, he even left once to try to get rid of his mutation, he started to develop into the leader he is now with the ANAD, where he had to learn how to deal with people like Wolverine and Storm, and mostly when he left Xavier's shadow, when they went back with Xavier they even had a lot of troubles with him. And all of this is him at least two years older than what he is now, he was already an adult by the time he truly became a leader, before he was just a field leader. On the other hand Jeen when she came to the present she saw what was an awful future and decided to change it, Tyke seems more resigned, which leads me to believe that they won't go back until Cyclops comes back to life, otherwise Tyke would basically be accepting to die and that is just too depressing

    And the X-men were always political, since the very beginning, it can even be argued that the least political they got the more boring they were, Claremont's original run is highly political, even attacked for using racial slurs to showcase it's political messege like the classic scene of Kitty calling a guy the n word after he called her a mutie (which today is constantly called racist, showing how little people understand that scene, Claremont is using it to show that the two words have the same impact in the marvel universe). The X-men have always been about racism, xenophobia, bigotry in general, usage of religion to justify and spread bigotry and the dangers of inaction against injustice (among other things), DoFP like 80% of the stories that showcase civilians in the X-men can easily be read as being built around Martin Niemöller's poem First they came ... (it isn't really the title but it's the first part of the poem version of the lecture).
    One can even argue that every act is in itself political, the attempt of showing no political inclination is a political inclination in on itself, it's the old Panem et circenses, a distraction from reality

    Long story short, The team is coming back, Tyke isn't weak for not being the leader, being a leader doesn't show strenght, it's just one more role, very good times are up ahead for Tyke (just as a character, because Bunn said he was about to face "the worst thing he can imagine" which thinking about it he could just be talking about his dad being abducted, and not that the Starjammers will die, either that or he is talking about the poisons, and seeing his Tumblr he loves mosnters and Eldritch abominations, so it's possible, also anything related to the romantic triangle, or square as it's now, it's impossible now, thankfully since both outsiders have stayed on Earth, and in the annual Scott and Jean seemed to be more on sync, the best thing ever would be if the so call "worst thing" since they are in space would be Vileena, but since it won't last that long I doubt it) and the X-men have lot's of Strong female leaders because the X-men since Claremont's original run have had a lot of strong females. (that wasn't as short as I wanted)

  10. #28705
    Extraordinary Member Badou's Avatar
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    Honestly, Tyke and the rest of the O5 should just **** off. They are so irrelevant at this point. Just get rid of Tyke and start the clock ticking on Cyclops being gone from all the books so he can come back sooner. Tyke has always been a poor replacement and maybe if he was gone it would get the ball rolling on the actual Cyclops coming back.

  11. #28706

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    Quote Originally Posted by maxi_miceli View Post
    Also Tyke, since he came to the present, has been much less interested in leading, while Jean was more interested in doing so, he has developed into much more of a loner
    they had already committed Tyke's character assassination in favor of jeen. tyke was only a formal leader. since 2012 jeen steals a spotlight, everything about jeen or for jeen. Bendis made Jeen a center and a front.
    Rant
    Jean really is the worst character in Marvel, isn't she?
    Scemma forever Triangle never.
    Scott needs an alpha female like Bettsy.
    What woman wouldn't be attracted to Scott? He's 100% alpha male who tells the Avengers to go f*#& themselves.
    I want cyclops back free from any ginger women to be his own man.
    Logically..
    TeenClops should have lusted for Emma & Cuckoos. Especially Stepford Cuckoos! They're teenage triplet clones of his hottest ex, how could he not be?
    End of rant

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ulfhammer View Post
    I didn't mean I agreed with it, only that I see Jean doing it. I think you make a very good point. It would come down to whether or not Scott would be leaving Jean alone because he wants to or he thinks she wants him to. Of course being a whizzbang telepath Jean would be able to tell the difference. Regardless if Jean caught wind of Scott being brought back and he didn't seek her out, she would seek him out. She wouldn't just leave it alone whether Scott has a right to make that decision or not. Again this is consistent with her characterization over the years.

    I actually think Jean's association with Scott could be the reason the mutant community opens their eyes and recognizes what Scott has done for them. As much of a great partner as Emma was capable of being, she was never going to help Scott build that bridge but Jean can. Let the healing begin.
    I don't know. At the very least, Logan and his clique shouldn't be cool with the fact that the woman he named his school after has enlisted both his clone and his clone's underaged clone into an X-Squad. I mean-- think of the children! /sarcasm
    Let your wallet talk.
    Never forget, Cyke fans~ https://twitter.com/i/status/1246248602768486402
    Jean had more presence in death than Cyke in Hickman's entire run.
    Hickman succeeded where 2010s Marvel didn't: make the X-Men villainous and irrelevant.
    Hilariously, the X-Men have now fully embraced mutant supremacy and racism against humans.
    For other Cyke-centered stories by a Cyclops fan: https://www.fanfiction.net/s/1008144...ffle-or-Boogie

  13. #28708
    Mighty Member maxi_miceli's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldscottsummers View Post
    they had already committed Tyke's character assassination in favor of jeen. tyke was only a formal leader. since 2012 jeen steals a spotlight, everything about jeen or for jeen. Bendis made Jeen a center and a front.
    The character assasination was on Cyke, not on Tyke, he just recieved some of the effects of it, because of it it made no sense for him to be the leader when the first arc was all about them believing his older self to be the new magneto, and his best times were even when he got away from the team, like with his solo, he developed quite better outside the X-men to the point where he, for the first time, went to a team outisde the X-men, I really hope they add that to Cyclops when he comes back, I hope he goes solo at first and doesn't join the X-men for at least a year, perhaps visiting them from time to time but not being part of the team either that or joining Cable on his solo

  14. #28709
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    Ultimately Tyke was never supposed to be Cyke or replace him, he just got caught into that position with no direction whatsoever

  15. #28710
    Astonishing Member ladyofthelake's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by maxi_miceli View Post
    It seems to me like the most likely scenario is that Mystique will be the one killed, the character was widely changed from her role in the original movies, there's no way to make her like that again, it would provide a pretty good reason for Xavier to act like he did in the Phoenix saga and be hostile to Jean, in the movies she is basically his sister after all, since in the movies he isn't as much of a jerk as comics Xavier and he wouldn't attack Jean just because he couldn't control her (like he insulted Scott when Jean first got her powers and he refused to leave the hospital to help the rest of the team who were too far away to even reach in time), and IMO it's very likely that he will basically lead the anti-Jean team, because if Scott s going to be showing leadership skills he will have to face the current leadership, otherwise he would just be following. She seemed to be the field leader of the X-men in the last movie, role which we know will be Scott's, and let's not forget that she is the one actress/actor that has been constantly saying how much she wants out of the movies because of how much she hates the makeup (which for what they tell is quite hellish).
    Is either that or Quicksilver, because even though Beast also is missing from the funeral picture he appears in the last scenes of DoFP, and they seem to be respecting at least the end of it, but they would be quite dumb to kill a character that without trying much can create a very good comic relief.
    Are you sure Hank's missing? He seemed to be the guy with his back to the camera . . . hmm. I do hope JLow is finally given the ax. Her character is obsolete and should have been killed last movie. JLow also has lost a lot of fans because of her mouth. Too bad since she's a really excellent actress but I just can't stand her anymore.

    Thanks for the info. It would make sense about Charles, but I also think that Charles would do it with deep regret because he sees that Jean can't control the power. Remember, he's the only one who actually knows how that went last time and would color how he reacts to the situation. Others would follow his lead because they believe in him and Jean would probably scare the bejesus out of them. :-D

    I do have to say that I do fear the director, not because of anything in particular he did, but because even though he has a long list of credits as writer and producer, including being the co-creator of Star Wars rebels, which I love, it's his first film as a director, he has been involved in the new direction the movies took since the reboot so he isn't completely new, but I would prefer someone with more experience or at least someone behind him good enough to prevent mistakes, even the greats like George Lucas wouldn't be anything if it wasn't for his wife's editions to the first SW
    Say what??? Now I really have lost all hope for this movie being anything worth watching. Those new SW movies sucked so hard, well, not the FA so much as the LJ. That one was beyond terrible. Right up there with the Prequels. Bleh.

    I would never have chose this guy for the films but I guess this was a token given to Disney in view of their merger. It's not enough that they ruined the MCU, Marvel Comics, Star Wars Movies, Rogue One is the exception of exceptions, now they are going to destroy our last change of having a decent X-Men Movieverse and Cyclops . . .






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