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  1. #76
    Ultimate Member JKtheMac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by numberthirty View Post
    On "That White Violin Scene...", there some sort of a more specific question there?
    Well it has already been discussed in the tread so not really. It was an element of confusion and from what has been said here I suspect it will branch in its own direction. I have theories about where it might go but not having read how the comics develop they are probably not worth talking about until I go back and read the source material.

    On Hazel/Cha Cha, along with a few other elements of this show they are almost completely a "For Television" creation.
    So they essentially copied The Preacher TV series? That’s odd, and a little disappointing.

  2. #77
    Ultimate Member numberthirty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JKtheMac View Post
    ...

    So they essentially copied The Preacher TV series? That’s odd, and a little disappointing.
    I'd disagree.

    They are honestly better than anything in Preacher, let alone the two characters you mentioned.

  3. #78
    Ultimate Member numberthirty's Avatar
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    One other thing...

    Number Seven/Vanya/The White Violin?

    Pretty huge departure from the :The Apocalypse Suite. I wouldn't really get any hopes up for some sort of "Comics" versus "Television" comparison and contrast.

  4. #79
    Ultimate Member JKtheMac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by numberthirty View Post
    I'd disagree.

    They are honestly better than anything in Preacher, let alone the two characters you mentioned.
    Oh I think I may have given you the impression I didn’t like them. They were indeed brilliant characters, acted wonderfully, and if anything much more interesting than their counterparts, who were also great fun. I am that guy that prefers the tv series of Preacher to the comics because I didn’t read them when I was into Tarantino etc. You know, a heretic.

    I was kind of hoping they were not inspired by The Preacher but the other way around, because they felt so close.

  5. #80
    Ultimate Member JKtheMac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by numberthirty View Post
    One other thing...

    Number Seven/Vanya/The White Violin?

    Pretty huge departure from the :The Apocalypse Suite. I wouldn't really get any hopes up for some sort of "Comics" versus "Television" comparison and contrast.

    Well because this is the wonderful modern world where everything is available at the touch of a finger and the wonders of digital commerce, I have just read Volume One. Wow. No wonder everyone raved about it. Also I can see the Doom Patrol element now. Still very X-Men though.

  6. #81

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    I wouldn't say Hazel and Cha-cha are carbon copies of LeBlanc and Fiore. In the comics, Hazel and Cha-cha were more one-note so I think they used that buddy-cop archetype to fleshed them and the Time commision out.

    So the similiarities don't have to be intentional.

  7. #82
    Ultimate Member JKtheMac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by the illustrious mr. kenway View Post
    I wouldn't say Hazel and Cha-cha are carbon copies of LeBlanc and Fiore. In the comics, Hazel and Cha-cha were more one-note so I think they used that buddy-cop archetype to fleshed them and the Time commision out.

    So the similiarities don't have to be intentional.
    No, not carbon copies but clearly inspired and not particularly well hidden. The briefcase, the hotel room, the detached view of the world, the idea that they get orders from an initially mysterious place which has a similar story function. The similarities are too similar, which makes them feel unoriginal. Again, it’s a minor quibble because they are realised so well. The Hazel / Agnes relationship is just spellbinding, and I had no idea Mary J. Blige was such a good actress.
    Last edited by JKtheMac; 02-23-2019 at 08:05 AM.

  8. #83
    Extraordinary Member j9ac9k's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CRaymond View Post
    Only one episode more to go and I can honestly say I donít need another Dark Phoenix Story for the rest of my life.
    That was my only real gripe for what was otherwise, a great season. They spent so much time developing Vanya and Page does such a great job with the character, it felt like they just stopped writing and let the story fall into the tired old "girls can't handle their power" trope. Who knows what she was even thinking at that point - he eyes glaze over and she stops acting like a person.

    And I am also surprised anyone would still listen to #1 - he was the only one who insisted on locking up Vanya rather than help her and look how that turned out...

    Someone else mentioned it, but as I was watching it, I thought this show felt like, "X-Men meets Royal Tennenbaums" (especially with the indoors tent and the "brother/sister" romance)

  9. #84
    Ultimate Member JKtheMac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by j9ac9k View Post
    That was my only real gripe for what was otherwise, a great season. They spent so much time developing Vanya and Page does such a great job with the character, it felt like they just stopped writing and let the story fall into the tired old "girls can't handle their power" trope. Who knows what she was even thinking at that point - he eyes glaze over and she stops acting like a person.

    And I am also surprised anyone would still listen to #1 - he was the only one who insisted on locking up Vanya rather than help her and look how that turned out...

    Someone else mentioned it, but as I was watching it, I thought this show felt like, "X-Men meets Royal Tennenbaums" (especially with the indoors tent and the "brother/sister" romance)
    Interesting take. I didn’t see it like that.
    Feel like we are getting in spoiler territory here so I will put this in spoil tags.
    spoilers:

    I did notice it was a take on Dark Phoenix, but it was done properly in that we actually see an involved and believable backstory that gives her a compelling reason to go there. It certainly doesn’t feel like she can’t handle her power. Instead it feels like she has good reason to conflate her enemies and her friends. She is a very sympathetic character in a way that Dark Phoenix is not always shown on screen.
    end of spoilers

    Obviously I agree with the Wes Anderson comparison because I suggested it. But now that I have read the trade and the attached editorial it would seem that was partly there right at the beginning of the creation of this property, so the TV show was probably pointed in that direction.
    Last edited by JKtheMac; 02-25-2019 at 11:33 AM.

  10. #85
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    Decided to give it a chance and have watched 7 episodes. Have been more enjoying it than not, but they flattened a lot of what made the comic unique in the first place.

    It actually made me want to re-read "Dallas" but can't find my copy.



    Oh, also I had a problem with spoilers:
    The scene where Number 5 and Klaus get info from the doctor by threatening to beat themselves up and blame the doctor. And the dr gives in.
    end of spoilers

    It's straight out of Fight Club and it didn't make sense there either.
    Last edited by ed2962; 03-10-2019 at 07:24 PM.

  11. #86
    Extraordinary Member Divine Spark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CRaymond View Post
    Only one episode more to go and I can honestly say I don’t need another Dark Phoenix Story for the rest of my life.
    Just finished watching this and got serious Wolverine & The X-Men vibes.
    Last edited by Divine Spark; 03-10-2019 at 08:29 PM.

  12. #87
    Extraordinary Member Divine Spark's Avatar
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    Spoiler warning.


  13. #88
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    Finished it. There was more good than bad. Stuff I would have wanted to see probably just wouldn't work on a TV budget. However, with it ending the way it did, I imagine we might gets some "flashbacks" of the kids having adventures. We might even get the Eiffel Tower scene. Also I agree with what a few people have said about the "Dark Pheonix"end. It was well done, but we probably don't need to see to again in another superhero movie.

  14. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by j9ac9k View Post
    That was my only real gripe for what was otherwise, a great season. They spent so much time developing Vanya and Page does such a great job with the character, it felt like they just stopped writing and let the story fall into the tired old "girls can't handle their power" trope. Who knows what she was even thinking at that point - he eyes glaze over and she stops acting like a person.
    I have to disagree. After her rampage at the mansion, it was clear IMO that Vanya was simply going through the motions, determined to perform as first chair no matter what, because what else did she have left at that point? Everyone in her personal life had pretty much betrayed her

  15. #90
    Ultimate Member JKtheMac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Cool Thatguy View Post
    I have to disagree. After her rampage at the mansion, it was clear IMO that Vanya was simply going through the motions, determined to perform as first chair no matter what, because what else did she have left at that point? Everyone in her personal life had pretty much betrayed her
    Indeed if anything the TV series is much more character driven for her and everyone else, than the comics. That isn’t a criticism of the comics. Despite reading them second I probably prefer the comics which is not always the case for me.

    Vanya is more than just a spurned and ignored sibling in the TV show.

    The issue is that the comics are deliberately playing with comic tropes, so we are supposed to make links with X-Men stories or Doom Patrol characters. We are supposed to see subtle nods to The Prisoner, Doctor Who, Wes Anderson, Watchmen and so much more. The comics are a glorious explosion of fandom. The setting and much of the story is downplayed forcing us to read between the lines to glean them. It tells you to ‘keep up and pay attention’ even as it leads you through the beautiful chaos.

    It would perhaps have been possible to make a TV series like that, but I am not sure there would be much of an audience for it.
    Last edited by JKtheMac; 03-12-2019 at 07:43 AM.

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