Marvel History will be "Destroyed!" March 2019

[John Ossie]

You make a good point. They don't, but you do

It's pretty much the same for most (if not all) arcs I find personally.

[Daniel22]

About what though? One might as well get angry that Punisher actually Killed the Marvel Universe!

That's a great question, one I don't have an answer to. Let's meet back here in a few months when the next big teaser images come out, hysteria ensues and everyone quits Marvel forever again, and it all turns out to be a Weapon WD40 mini series.

On another note I'm really looking forward to the mini. Donny Cates is one of my favorite writers. He brings an incredible mix of uncontrolled imagination (I get that a mashup isn't the most creative thing, but all his other stuff is very fresh and innovative imo) and exciting plots while managing good character work at the same time. His sense of humor clicks with me too.

[cranger]

About what though? One might as well get angry that Punisher actually Killed the Marvel Universe!

People are barely even talking about it anymore. The people who thought the possible event sounded bad moved on. The people who for some reason hate Cosmic Ghost rider came and went. And a few other people decided to do what some comic book readers do and lament the good old days when "comics were good." None of which was really connected anyway, just the typical thread creep boosted by the bait-and-switch that has become the new Marvel Method.

[JKtheMac]

People are barely even talking about it anymore. The people who thought the possible event sounded bad moved on. The people who for some reason hate Cosmic Ghost rider came and went. And a few other people decided to do what some comic book readers do and lament the good old days when "comics were good." None of which was really connected anyway, just the typical thread creep boosted by the bait-and-switch that has become the new Marvel Method.

That's just marketing in general. Nothing new and nothing uniquely Marvel about it. Goes back decades. Look at all of the front covers of all your old comics.

[JKtheMac]

That's a great question, one I don't have an answer to. Let's meet back here in a few months when the next big teaser images come out, hysteria ensues and everyone quits Marvel forever again, and it all turns out to be a Weapon WD40 mini series.

On another note I'm really looking forward to the mini. Donny Cates is one of my favorite writers. He brings an incredible mix of uncontrolled imagination (I get that a mashup isn't the most creative thing, but all his other stuff is very fresh and innovative imo) and exciting plots while managing good character work at the same time. His sense of humor clicks with me too.

I wish I agreed with you. Unfortunately I don't share your enthusiasm for Cates. I appreciate he is good at what he does, and I have enjoyed some of his work (Damnation was fun), but this won't be on my pull list, just as Cosmic Ghost Rider dropped off of it when I realised I just wasn't enjoying it. I hope it lives up to your expectations though.

[Daniel22]

People are barely even talking about it anymore. The people who thought the possible event sounded bad moved on. The people who for some reason hate Cosmic Ghost rider came and went. And a few other people decided to do what some comic book readers do and lament the good old days when "comics were good." None of which was really connected anyway, just the typical thread creep boosted by the bait-and-switch that has become the new Marvel Method.

I don't think it's new... "Everything you thought you knew.. IS WRONG"!!! and "The REAL story behind" and "NOTHING will EVER be the same" have all been around for decades, since almost the beginning really.

I don't get the Cosmic Ghost Rider thing. It makes perfect sense to me, Spirit of Vengeance + human of vengeance. It's totally in character for Castle to do anything he can to continue his war on criminals. I get that it came on the heels of Weapon H, so maybe there was some mashup fatigue. The actual stories have been fantastic though imo.

[Daniel22]

I wish I agreed with you. Unfortunately I don't share your enthusiasm for Cates. I appreciate he is good at what he does, and I have enjoyed some of his work (Damnation was fun), but this won't be on my pull list, just as Cosmic Ghost Rider dropped off of it when I realised I just wasn't enjoying it. I hope it lives up to your expectations though.

That's cool. I'm always all for people reading what they like and ignoring what they don't.
Do you read indies? "God Country" was my introduction to Cates and I think it is fantastic. Tons of heart, a masterful blending of human issues and emotions intertwined with fantastical settings, a look at family dynamics through different lenses... Can't recommend it enough.

[JKtheMac]

That's cool. I'm always all for people reading what they like and ignoring what they don't.
Do you read indies? "God Country" was my introduction to Cates and I think it is fantastic. Tons of heart, a masterful blending of human issues and emotions intertwined with fantastical settings, a look at family dynamics through different lenses... Can't recommend it enough.

It is on my long list of things to catch up on. Mainly because I am a Thor fan and consequently can't resist at least peeking at stories about mythical weapons. It also got some pretty great reviews.

[cranger]

That's just marketing in general. Nothing new and nothing uniquely Marvel about it. Goes back decades. Look at all of the front covers of all your old comics.

You won't get an argument from me. I was addressing your query about why people were talking about other stuff here. Also I obviously wasn't clear, I am not saying this marketing tactic is new, I am saying it feels like Marvel has abandoned letting stories and word of mouth about those stories (which often were the result of great collaborations via the so-called Marvel Method) create interest and now relies on controversy to create interest instead of memorable, lasting stories.

[Prof. Warren]

You won't get an argument from me. I was addressing your query about why people were talking about other stuff here. Also I obviously wasn't clear, I am not saying this marketing tactic is new, I am saying it feels like Marvel has abandoned letting stories and word of mouth about those stories (which often were the result of great collaborations via the so-called Marvel Method) create interest and now relies on controversy to create interest instead of memorable, lasting stories.

There's no controversy here. The fact that some fans are so easily triggered and so nutty that hyperbole - which has been the Marvel way of promoting their stories since the beginning - sets them off isn't Marvel's fault and it sure isn't "controversial."

Marvel released a teaser that the Marvel Universe would be destroyed and followed it up the next day with the reveal that, wait, it's going to be a Cosmic Ghost Rider mini that'll be more humorously inclined. Any level headed person would chuckle at the joke and move on. Either they'll be picking up the series when it comes out or they won't but certainly nothing about the teasers or the reveal is any big deal. It's just normal promotional tactics that some people actually enjoy for the ballyhoo of it all or, at the very least, aren't bothered by.

If anyone goes through back issues from the '80s, they'll find house ads every bit as hyperbolic and "controversial" in teasing big changes as anything Marvel puts out today.

[Daniel22]

You won't get an argument from me. I was addressing your query about why people were talking about other stuff here. Also I obviously wasn't clear, I am not saying this marketing tactic is new, I am saying it feels like Marvel has abandoned letting stories and word of mouth about those stories (which often were the result of great collaborations via the so-called Marvel Method) create interest and now relies on controversy to create interest instead of memorable, lasting stories.

I think you're right in that Marvel tries too much to get the big reaction leading up to a story. I get why they do it, because the stories with huge backlash at the beginning almost always sell. Whether people hate read or love read the comic, the sales count the same. I know that as long as people are talking about a comic, whether they love it or hate it, it will sell. Indifference is worse than hate when it comes to sales in my experience.

The frustrating thing for me is that the stories often ARE good enough to be memorable and lasting, but Marvel can't resist doing the over the top marketing stuff that turns some people off. A portion of fans hated Secret Empire before it started. I think it was good, but it had so much ill will to overcome from the start, because of the "Cap is a Nazi" marketing. But also from their perspective, a lot of the stories that people love and will become evergreen don't sell a huge amount. King's Vision was a critical smash and the trades sell, but the floppy sales were mediocre. Same with Cates on Strange or Ms Marvel or others, the stories are well liked and become lasting and memorable, but the sales aren't high.

[JKtheMac]

You won't get an argument from me. I was addressing your query about why people were talking about other stuff here. Also I obviously wasn't clear, I am not saying this marketing tactic is new, I am saying it feels like Marvel has abandoned letting stories and word of mouth about those stories (which often were the result of great collaborations via the so-called Marvel Method) create interest and now relies on controversy to create interest instead of memorable, lasting stories.

You are using words that imply this is somehow a different time or a change. ‘abandoned’ when in truth they have always done this and always will.

I have been reading memorable stories and I have been telling others about them, so again pure rhetoric to say they are not writing memorable ones or don’t rely on word of mouth. I get most recommendations from podcasts so that’s just word of mouth with added technology.

The time when marketing of this type was at its highest was both DC and Marvel in the sixties and seventies.

It is even rhetorical to use the phrase ‘bait and switch’ because that is a con and this kind of marketing is a knowing wink. Only the most cynical would claim people were being suckered into parting with money for something other than they expected.

[cranger]

You are using words that imply this is somehow a different time or a change. ‘abandoned’ when in truth they have always done this and always will.

I have been reading memorable stories and I have been telling others about them, so again pure rhetoric to say they are not writing memorable ones or don’t rely on word of mouth. I get most recommendations from podcasts so that’s just word of mouth with added technology.

The time when marketing of this type was at its highest was both DC and Marvel in the sixties and seventies.

It is even rhetorical to use the phrase ‘bait and switch’ because that is a con and this kind of marketing is a knowing wink. Only the most cynical would claim people were being suckered into parting with money for something other than they expected.

If you think memorable stories are driving sales more today than or even half as much as they did in the newsstand days and that hype is not much more important and the primary driver of sales when the direct market is basically a pre-order/subscription model then we just disagree. No need to get all semantics police on me.