X-Men comics are getting dumber

[FUBAR007]

Judging the quality of a comic book by word quantity and not scene pacing or word quality is bizarre. You pay $4 for at least 20 pages of professionally drawn artwork that tells a story. You did not really get more bang for your buck if it took you 20 minutes to read an issue instead of 10. You get more if you got more story. And more story doesn't mean better story. You might not prefer that.

In other words, you prefer decompressed storytelling. Fine. Some of us don't.

I can pull professional comics artwork off the internet for free. That's not what I'm paying for. What I'm paying for is story. The implied premise of your statements is that more densely written comics can't be as good or better than decompressed comics, and that is flat out wrong.

This may make your head explode, but some of us actually liked "Claremont-style" comics. That's what got us into the medium in the first place. And, the movement away from that style toward what often amounts to 20 pages of pin-ups is part of what's driven some of us away.

Modern word limits on word balloon counts and pages are good.

Do you know for a fact that such limits are a thing? Or, are you just assuming that?

[Snoop Dogg]

In other words, you prefer decompressed storytelling. Fine. Some of us don't.

I can pull professional comics artwork off the internet for free. That's not what I'm paying for. What I'm paying for is story. The implied premise of your statements is that more densely written comics can't be as good or better than decompressed comics, and that is flat out wrong.

This may make your head explode, but some of us actually liked "Claremont-style" comics. That's what got us into the medium in the first place. And, the movement away from that style toward what often amounts to 20 pages of pin-ups is part of what's driven some of us away.



Do you know for a fact that such limits are a thing? Or, are you just assuming that?

I don't prefer decompressed comics. Preferring one or the other isn't reasonable because too much either way can be harmful. My favorite writers tend to be wordier than most nowadays, but those words are more valuable because they're not about reintroducing things to readers every issue when recap pages exist. Claremont would do a lot of gratuitous narration, but he was good at making it more compelling compared to his peers. That's what made it valuable, not that he was giving you a lot to read. Even he would fall into the trap of, instead of adding extra information to help the art tell the story, just describing exactly what was happening in a panel that anyone looking at the panel could understand. But when he was adding extra information that added texture to events, it helped the book. It's a visual medium. The premise isn't that one style is better than another, it's that how much story is being told is important, but how long it takes that story to be read or how many words there are isn't.

Generally, writer nowadays don't put more than 25 words into a word balloon and they don't do more than three balloons in a panel. This lets the art breathe more and lets letterers do the work without having to figure out how to connect words and pages that don't fit. Obviously, all of these "rules" can be broken, by some writers very often. Back in the day copy-blocks would seem to have 50 word limits.

[FUBAR007]

I don't prefer decompressed comics. Preferring one or the other isn't reasonable because too much either way can be harmful. My favorite writers tend to be wordier than most nowadays, but those words are more valuable because they're not about reintroducing things to readers every issue when recap pages exist. Claremont would do a lot of gratuitous narration, but he was good at making it more compelling compared to his peers. That's what made it valuable, not that he was giving you a lot to read. Even he would fall into the trap of, instead of adding extra information to help the art tell the story, just describing exactly what was happening in a panel that anyone looking at the panel could understand. But when he was adding extra information that added texture to events, it helped the book. It's a visual medium. The premise isn't that one style is better than another, it's that how much story is being told is important...

Fair enough.

...but how long it takes that story to be read or how many words there are isn't.

I disagree. At $4+ a floppy, anything that takes 5 min. or less to read is usually a rip-off.

When I started into comics, a standard-sized issue cost $1. Adjusted for inflation to today, that's $1.83. In general, I got way more for my money then than I can get now.

Generally, writer nowadays don't put more than 25 words into a word balloon and they don't do more than three balloons in a panel. This lets the art breathe more and lets letterers do the work without having to figure out how to connect words and pages that don't fit. Obviously, all of these "rules" can be broken, by some writers very often. Back in the day copy-blocks would seem to have 50 word limits.

Sounds like you've got experience in the industry. Are you a comics pro?

[PrezValentine]

Looks like my theory that Snoop Dogg is Hickman posting undercover gained a new adept.

[Snoop Dogg]

Sounds like you've got experience in the industry. Are you a comics pro?

I've just absorbed enough insight from creators at every stage of the process via tweets and podcasts to have an okay idea of how the sausage is made and how to discern the craft of comics. My current creative talents are limited to forum posts, but that could change. Really just focused on my Pac-Man Champ 2 scores right now.

[Snoop Dogg]

Looks like my theory that Snoop Dogg is Hickman posting undercover gained a new adept.

You know too much.

[924COLLECTIVE]

I disagree. At $4+ a floppy, anything that takes 5 min. or less to read is usually a rip-off.

When I started into comics, a standard-sized issue cost $1. Adjusted for inflation to today, that's $1.83. In general, I got way more for my money then than I can get now.

The level of decompression and filler today is Astonishing. I do not see the value in this current format.
$7.99 for issue 1 and $4 for each subsequent issue. Spending $44 on this relaunch, not gonna happen.

So far we are headed into issue 6 and we still haven't gone anywhere.
It isn't surprising that the sales figures plummeted after the Issue 1 novelty wore off.

[cranger]

So far we are headed into issue 6 and we still haven't gone anywhere.
It isn't surprising that the sales figures plummeted after the Issue 1 novelty wore off.

because it is coming out weekly those orders were already determined by retailers without customer input. December's numbers will give us a look at if early reaction was that negative, but if people didn't start to really feel like it was a waste of time until now than January would be the month to look at and see if it really goes down.

[Tazirai]

In other words, you prefer decompressed storytelling. Fine. Some of us don't.

I can pull professional comics artwork off the internet for free. That's not what I'm paying for. What I'm paying for is story. The implied premise of your statements is that more densely written comics can't be as good or better than decompressed comics, and that is flat out wrong.

This may make your head explode, but some of us actually liked "Claremont-style" comics. That's what got us into the medium in the first place. And, the movement away from that style toward what often amounts to 20 pages of pin-ups is part of what's driven some of us away.



Do you know for a fact that such limits are a thing? Or, are you just assuming that?

ROM would have killed him/her. ROM Spaceknight had me reading a Single issue like a 30 minute tv show. While new comics are done in less than 5-7 minutes. I miss the days of reading a comic and enjoying the art.
There's more dialogue on these two pages, than in most comics today...

[Snoop Dogg]

ROM would have killed him/her. ROM Spaceknight had me reading a Single issue like a 30 minute tv show. While new comics are done in less than 5-7 minutes. I miss the days of reading a comic and enjoying the art.
There's more dialogue on these two pages, than in most comics today...

Well, it's 5 to 6 panels, which is still standard panel count today. Each panel has on average three word balloons, each with less than or around 25 words. Today, some of these narration panels and thought bubbles would be converted to dialogue or removed. Like the narration telling you what Hybrid is doing, because that's obvious, or his internal thoughts, because his face gives away what he's doing. The narration captions in general would be gone, but the one in the Kitty panel and the one in the farm equipement panel should also be gone too, because it's just saying what's clearly visible. Also, that last Storm panel is pretty pointless. She's just illogically repeating what she just said and catching on to what Wolverine already realized in the previous panel.

[WallStreeter]

I think the comics are in a holding state until the Disney/Fox merger is completed. That's part of the problem, so right now they kind of just suck.

[uebersoldat]

Well, what else can they do when people get offended at the tiniest thing and rant all over social media? You can't make everyone happy so have far less dialogue and more kid jokes. Reap what you sow.

[Maestroneto]

Well, what else can they do when people get offended at the tiniest thing and rant all over social media? You can't make everyone happy so have far less dialogue and more kid jokes. Reap what you sow.

Aren't you the one who kept complaining there's too much politics in X-Men comics

[MyriVerse]

"Not humans and mutants. Just us. But **** the animals"

TBH, any other way would be stupidity beyond belief. And this is doubly true for animals that should have been extinct millions of years ago, but were artificially protected.

[sungila]

Probably the most fundamental misreading of Morrison’s run i’ve Seen on these boards.

No points for you.

Hey, point that personal point system of yours someplace else Nick Miller!

No virtual handclaps for me. Pity.

I do not propound any 'fundamental' reading of Morrison's run.

I think it was brilliant. I think it was necessary. I think Morrison has a deft understanding and ability to work with a chaos palate that (again) manages to cloud and clarify the mirror of panel and page. He presents a dark mirror, dark offers depth but it also achieves through dregs, spent fires and smoldering ends.

From the filthly flower comes the filth comes the flower. Expanse outside etcetera.

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