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  1. #31
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    All in all, I've actually enjoyed Aaron's Thor run especially God of Thunder and Jane Thor.

    However, I have a problem with how he's been handled in recent times. His (and Odin's) characterization just seems off and even quite different from God of Thunder (which Aaron himself wrote).

    I prefer the more nuanced, mature, reasonable and wise Thor. And Odin too. The whole Thor that doesn't know how to go on dates and has been single for centuries (which is very strange because he was very in love with Sif some years ago), gets his skull fractured by Hulk (granted that was Ewing in Immortal Hulk), doesn't seem stronger than Namor (anymore), cheats on his girlfriend (not sure where that came from), has been surpassed by She-Hulk (which is all manner of random) e.t.c barely works for me to be honest.

    Aaron's Thor work is overall enjoyable to me but he writes the character like a blockhead at times which is just jarring when you think of his previous depictions. Once again, the key to good storytelling in the shared universe isn't necessarily continuity but consistency and Thor's current depiction is veering into inconsistency.

  2. #32
    Astonishing Member DragonsChi's Avatar
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    I sorta feel that we wont see a change in the direction of certain characters until the cultural and political climate at Marvel changes. These past couple of years there is a clear sign that the atmosphere at Marvel comics can be described as jumbled. Somethings changed for the better while others for the worse. However, one thing has been very clear Marvel is willing to make their most prominent characters look like fools in continuance of pushing a certain agendas. They seem incapable of up-lifting properties at the same time but are fully cable of alienating their audience.

    Marvel sales have been some of the lowest they have seen in several years and probably will continue to be so until they figure out that they the need older audience on their side to move forward with the younger audience. I'm actually in the younger audience side and I can see that. I can even fully admit that a large margin of the newer stuff is utter crap compared to the older stuff. There are so many titles and characters, who use to be filled with so much excitement and personality that feel soooo hollow and dull now. It's nothing short of being equally sad as it is embarrassing.

    Anyway, Thor is suffering because of the men and women at Marvel Comics's values and personal agenda's. Yes, I do believe Marvel writers want to write good stories but I also feel they will and have already sacrificed good story telling for pushing their personal thoughts and messages.
    Last edited by DragonsChi; 12-24-2018 at 08:42 AM.
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  3. #33
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    I do feel his work with Jane was solid

    There have been some other bits like the shiar god's story I liked

    But his handling of thor and Odin I cannot stand

    I'm not that keen on Loki at present, who to me just seems a bit of a limp villain, which I get given the movies influence I think is huge

    Generally I find him lacking as a writer imo

  4. #34
    Astonishing Member Anthony W's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snoop Dogg View Post
    People bring up that Titania scene a lot, but that's the same character who joined a radical ultra feminist's team of Femizons to create a world where they would they would be the most valuable women and powerful people on the planet.
    That sounds like someone who would really make the hero work for it, too bad she didn't show up.
    "The Marvel EIC Chair has a certain curse that goes along with it: it tends to drive people insane, and ultimately, out of the business altogether. It is the notorious last stop for many staffers, as once you've sat in The Big Chair, your pariah status is usually locked in." Christopher Priest

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snoop Dogg View Post
    People bring up that Titania scene a lot, but that's the same character who joined a radical ultra feminist's team of Femizons to create a world where they would they would be the most valuable women and powerful people on the planet
    I don't think we should take a massive crowd scene, in which the character was literally one of dozens, as too indicative of their characterization. Especially when said character is depicted as being happily married, more often than not.

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by DragonsChi View Post
    I sorta feel that we wont see a change in the direction of certain characters until the cultural and political climate at Marvel changes. These past couple of years there is a clear sign that the atmosphere at Marvel comics can be described as jumbled. Somethings changed for the better while others for the worse. However, one thing has been very clear Marvel is willing to make their most prominent characters look like fools in continuance of pushing a certain agendas. They seem incapable of up-lifting properties at the same time but are fully cable of alienating their audience.

    Marvel sales have been some of the lowest they have seen in several years and probably will continue to be so until they figure out that they the need older audience on their side to move forward with the younger audience. I'm actually in the younger audience side and I can see that. I can even fully admit that a large margin of the newer stuff is utter crap compared to the older stuff. There are so many titles and characters, who use to be filled with so much excitement and personality that now feel soooo hollow and dull now. It's nothing short of being equally sad as it is embarrassing.

    Anyway, Thor is suffering because of the men and women at Marvel Comics's values and personal agenda's. Yes, I do believe Marvel writers want to write good stories but I also feel they will and have already sacrificed good story telling for pushing their personal thoughts and messages.
    In some books I have had a sense of being preached at, not just at marvel

    I don't like that feeling as it detaches me from the internal story mythos

    Others might feel very differently but there it is

    Not in all cases nor in a majority but when it's there it's very strongly expounded imo

  7. #37
    Astonishing Member DragonsChi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kilderkin View Post
    In some books I have had a sense of being preached at, not just at marvel

    I don't like that feeling as it detaches me from the internal story mythos

    Others might feel very differently but there it is

    Not in all cases nor in a majority but when it's there it's very strongly expounded imo
    yep.

    But it's even in the subtle things they do now. From how certain characters are drawn now compared to how they where drawn before. How they respond and behave in the presences of newer characters now verses how they would have respond. There is so many things that they are doing now that just feels "UnMarvel" and that in part can be seen in how Thor is being handled.

    I never really cared much for Thor. I liked him fine in the Avengers stories but he was never a character I could get into. However, he is one of the shinning light as to the drastic changes that have happen to many of Marvel's core characters.

    As a younger fan I have gone back and read through a lot of "old" Marvel and it's just really clear, to me at least, why Marvel comics seems to be falling behind.
    Last edited by DragonsChi; 12-24-2018 at 08:53 AM.
    Idea's Open Discussion And Growth. Silencing Idea's Confirms Them To Be True In The Minds Of Those Who Hold Them. The Attempt Of Eliminating Idea's Proves You To Be A Fool.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by DragonsChi View Post
    yep.

    But it's even in the subtle things they do now. From how certain characters are drawn now compared to how they where drawn before. How they respond and behave in the presences of newer characters now verses how they would have respond. There is so many things that they are doing now that just feels "UnMarvel" and that in part can be seen in how Thor is being handled.

    I never really cared much for Thor. I liked him fine in the Avengers stories but he was never a character I could get into. However, he is one of the shinning light as to the drastic changes that have happen to many of Marvel's core characters.

    As a younger fan I have gone back and read through a lot of "old" Marvel and it's just really clear, to me at least, why Marvel comics seems to be falling behind.
    Imo some of the current writers at marvel appear more concerned with delivering a message (which might be a very worthwhile one) in their books than in telling a solid story within the mythos

    Irrelevant to any such message, idea or comment ( nor the value or virtue of such ) I don't like how I feel it's being done, it feels externally preachy to me

    Previous era's may have been just the same, but having reread a lot of that older material digitally it certainly does not feel that way to me

    of course this is just me

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by DragonsChi View Post
    I sorta feel that we wont see a change in the direction of certain characters until the cultural and political climate at Marvel changes. These past couple of years there is a clear sign that the atmosphere at Marvel comics can be described as jumbled. Somethings changed for the better while others for the worse. However, one thing has been very clear Marvel is willing to make their most prominent characters look like fools in continuance of pushing a certain agendas. They seem incapable of up-lifting properties at the same time but are fully cable of alienating their audience.

    Marvel sales have been some of the lowest they have seen in several years and probably will continue to be so until they figure out that they the need older audience on their side to move forward with the younger audience. I'm actually in the younger audience side and I can see that. I can even fully admit that a large margin of the newer stuff is utter crap compared to the older stuff. There are so many titles and characters, who use to be filled with so much excitement and personality that feel soooo hollow and dull now. It's nothing short of being equally sad as it is embarrassing.

    Anyway, Thor is suffering because of the men and women at Marvel Comics's values and personal agenda's. Yes, I do believe Marvel writers want to write good stories but I also feel they will and have already sacrificed good story telling for pushing their personal thoughts and messages.
    Something tells me that this would explain the basis of Comicsgate...before it got toxic.

  10. #40
    Astonishing Member DragonsChi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cmbmool View Post
    Something tells me that this would explain the basis of Comicsgate...before it got toxic.
    What is Comiscgate? I keep seeing this word around and I'm still not sure if it is a real thing or just forum term.
    Idea's Open Discussion And Growth. Silencing Idea's Confirms Them To Be True In The Minds Of Those Who Hold Them. The Attempt Of Eliminating Idea's Proves You To Be A Fool.

  11. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by DragonsChi View Post
    What is Comiscgate? I keep seeing this word around and I'm still not sure if it is a real thing or just forum term.
    In a nutshell:

    Comicsgate is a supposed pushback of politics in comics and "just wanting good stories."

    At the same time, it does not merit the "-gate" suffix. There was no one single incident like the break-in at Watergate or a document release like Gamergate to merit the suffix. In short, Comicsgate seems more like a big internet flame war.

  12. #42
    Astonishing Member DragonsChi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by U.N. Owen View Post
    In a nutshell:

    Comicsgate is a supposed pushback of politics in comics and "just wanting good stories."

    At the same time, it does not merit the "-gate" suffix. There was no one single incident like the break-in at Watergate or a document release like Gamergate to merit the suffix. In short, Comicsgate seems more like a big internet flame war.
    I see. Well I'm not interested in that totally. You can have political stories and still get good entertainment out of them. I just feel that a lot of the comics today aren't all that entertaining. I do feel it is in part that the writers and editors at Marvel are to heavily focused on certain things. I think it's bad when you have younger readers buying and looking to buy stuff that came out 20-30 years ago than it is for them to keep up with what is going on today.

    But those are just my thoughts on it. I do know that if I was a Thor fan I would be upset with his current handling. Not because Jane took over but just by his handling. There is a whole host of things that are just F'ed with him now from an outsider looking in.
    Idea's Open Discussion And Growth. Silencing Idea's Confirms Them To Be True In The Minds Of Those Who Hold Them. The Attempt Of Eliminating Idea's Proves You To Be A Fool.

  13. #43
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Username taken View Post
    However, I have a problem with how he's been handled in recent times. His (and Odin's) characterization just seems off and even quite different from God of Thunder (which Aaron himself wrote).
    But that Thor had Mjolnir. And everything that makes Thor Thor is housed in Mjolnir (or so we've been presented) .

  14. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    But that Thor had Mjolnir. And everything that makes Thor Thor is housed in Mjolnir (or so we've been presented) .
    I've asked this question before, but haven't gotten an answer.

    Does anyone know when the worthiness enchantment was added to Thor's hammer, prior to Aaron? I remember some flashbacks where he had the hammer and no indication of it. I always presumed it was part of his punishment when he was forced to be Donald Blake.

  15. #45
    Astonishing Member Panic's Avatar
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    It was in the early Tales of Asgard, IIRC, so a long time ago. Of course young Thor was shown as far smarter and more sophisticated there than Aaron's version.

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