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  1. #106
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    George Perez Wonder Woman was grounded in research--although a lot of that research was outdated, as I found out when I did archaeology and classical studies courses at university--but even though he was trying to do right by feminism and using feminist theories, the look of the Amazon world came from a male dominant culture. He borrowed a lot from ancient Greek and Roman design, by way of M.C. Escher, and he used a pantheon that is biased toward partiarchy. He didn't even incorporate Minoan design which had been more nature-based and wholistic.

    If you look at the Patty Jenkins movie design, they asked themselves what if an all female society designed the environment--and they got away from the phallic designs and had more spirals. Amazons live on a island so their designs are influenced by maritme motifs.

    If one extends that out to technology--instead of the dominant phallic shapes we see in our modern devices--the Amazons could have technology that is just as advanced but looks and works in different ways from what we know. This would give their world an exotic, mystical appearance--simply because it doesn't conform to the designs we're used to seeing in modern technology--but their designs could still be just as mathematical and heuristic as any of ours.
    sorry 🍁

  2. #107
    Lv 67 Pinsir's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Kelly View Post
    George Perez Wonder Woman was grounded in research--although a lot of that research was outdated, as I found out when I did archaeology and classical studies courses at university--but even though he was trying to do right by feminism and using feminist theories, the look of the Amazon world came from a male dominant culture. He borrowed a lot from ancient Greek and Roman design, by way of M.C. Escher, and he used a pantheon that is biased toward partiarchy. He didn't even incorporate Minoan design which had been more nature-based and wholistic.

    If you look at the Patty Jenkins movie design, they asked themselves what if an all female society designed the environment--and they got away from the phallic designs and had more spirals. Amazons live on a island so their designs are influenced by maritme motifs.

    If one extends that out to technology--instead of the dominant phallic shapes we see in our modern devices--the Amazons could have technology that is just as advanced but looks and works in different ways from what we know. This would give their world an exotic, mystical appearance--simply because it doesn't conform to the designs we're used to seeing in modern technology--but their designs could still be just as mathematical and heuristic as any of ours.
    You pretty much described a lot of the problems I've had with the merger of Wonder Woman into a larger Hellenistic cannon. It actually makes the Amazons come off as stagnant when after 3,000 years they cite parables from a patriarchal culture, not having developed stories of their own. I understand that it is often easier to latch onto an already existing lore than create unique stories to reference, but its a crucial aspect of world building. Greek mythological is unique for employing a 'monstrous woman' trope too, including preternatural characters like Circe, Medusa and her sisters, the Furies, sirens, harpies, Clytemnestra and of course the Amazons themselves, vile women who cleave their breasts off to behave as men. I mean, is it safe to say that there is no mythological canon as misogynistic as the Greek one!?

    Also, I've brought this up before, but the origin story to how Wonder Woman got her name Diana, what is essential they pay off to the Challenge of the Gods story line, is to basically explain why she has a Latin name (in the Golden Age, Wonder Woman is named after the Latin moon god). The story being that WW is now named after Steve Trevor's mother, Diana, who crash landed on Amazon Island in WWII and died saving the Amazons. So in honour of her, Hippolyta named her child Diana. I don't know if Perez ever actually confirmed this or not, but its just a bizarre plot line that really added nothing to WW's lore.
    Also visit my blog where I expose Wonder Woman for the criminal she is!

    How come these anonymous sources failed to report Zack Snyder had left post-production on Justice League? They seem to know everything now...

  3. #108
    Mighty Member kjn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pinsir View Post
    You pretty much described a lot of the problems I've had with the merger of Wonder Woman into a larger Hellenistic cannon…
    On the other hand, that merger was already there with the very first Wonder Woman tales: her world has always been connected to Greek mythology. Pérez was rather the first Wonder Woman writer (and arguably still the only one) that has tried to examine and subvert the misogyny within Greek mythology.

    Could he have done it better? Certainly. But at least he attempted to see Greek mythology from a feminist lens, which is more than anyone else did or has done, not even Rucka or Simone.

  4. #109
    Extraordinary Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pinsir View Post
    Also, I've brought this up before, but the origin story to how Wonder Woman got her name Diana, what is essential they pay off to the Challenge of the Gods story line, is to basically explain why she has a Latin name (in the Golden Age, Wonder Woman is named after the Latin moon god). The story being that WW is now named after Steve Trevor's mother, Diana, who crash landed on Amazon Island in WWII and died saving the Amazons. So in honour of her, Hippolyta named her child Diana. I don't know if Perez ever actually confirmed this or not, but its just a bizarre plot line that really added nothing to WW's lore.
    It really would have made things easier to do it the way Marston basically did it: the Greek and Roman deities are the same beings using different names, and the Amazons are aware that Artemis is also called Diana. It would be old news by the time Diana was born, so why wouldn't Hippolyta pick the name Diana if she wants to honor Artemis?

    Diana Trevor is kind of a needless addition that adds another unnecessary moving part to the origin story. And superhero origins are better when they are streamlined because they are not meant to be dwelt on too long and need to be simple foundations to build off of. Diana doesn't even spend four issues Man's World after her first adventure before being dragged back to the island for a lengthy story whose main purpose is to reveal the origin of...her name? It honestly kills the momentum and is one of the instances where the first couple years of the Perez run can be a slog to get through due to the pacing and excessive details. Steve's plane crash after Diana is already in the progress of leaving the island and Circe's convoluted backstory and motivations with Hecate are other annoying examples (to me at least).

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