Wally West: The Flash Appreciation 2019

[Restingvoice]

In the beginning of the Meltzer JLA series they had a crossover between the JLA and JSA called the lightning saga where ultimately they used the lightning rod to bring Wally and his family back from the speed force which they got sucked into in Infinite Crisis. Funnily enough they had Batman disappointed because he thought it was Barry coming back..

Oh. The same concept as Linda being Wally's living lightning rod in Rebirth, but this one is... something else. This is the story where that idea came from.

[Dred]

Oh. The same concept as Linda being Wally's living lightning rod in Rebirth, but this one is... something else. This is the story where that idea came from.

Linda being Wally's lightning rod is from Waid's run in the 90s. It's where the concept originated, though it has certainly been watered down since.

[Darkspellmaster]

I was doing some research trying to find Bart's funeral issue when I found this blogpost that is some good commentary about DC back in 2007 that still rings true in 2019. It's still the same heads so of course the same issues will persist.

http://everydayislikewednesday.blogs...art-allen.html

I'm going to be blunt, but I've yet to actually forgive Marc Guggenheim for Bart's death in that book. I hated how they made him, even worse than the Bart-torr stuff from the new 52.

Why is it that the Flash and Wonder families are always treated like second fiddle to the bat family, never got that.

YJ was really good, but I really want some form of Sins of Youth, because the parts with Wally and Bart are great and Poor Wally and Linda regarding their honeymoon. Props for how that was dealt with at the time.

[Jekyll]

I'm going to be blunt, but I've yet to actually forgive Marc Guggenheim for Bart's death in that book. I hated how they made him, even worse than the Bart-torr stuff from the new 52.

Why is it that the Flash and Wonder families are always treated like second fiddle to the bat family, never got that.

YJ was really good, but I really want some form of Sins of Youth, because the parts with Wally and Bart are great and Poor Wally and Linda regarding their honeymoon. Props for how that was dealt with at the time.

The important part of your first sentence is Marc Guggenheim. I’ve yet to read a thing by him that I enjoyed or where he didn’t absolutely destroy the character I was reading.

[James Hunter]

Thanks for that. I didn't read Legion of three worlds so that explain my confusion. .

Its a shame you didn't, it was pretty much the best mini tied to FINA CRISIS (and, as someone else pointed out, gave us Kon-El/Conner Kent back too!). It had some fun XS and Bart moments too.

[WallyWestFlash]

Oh. The same concept as Linda being Wally's living lightning rod in Rebirth, but this one is... something else. This is the story where that idea came from.

Not at all.

1. Like Dred said the whole concept of being pulled back from the Speed force because of a lightning rod originated with Terminal Velocity with Wally in 1995.

2. What the original concept introduced and what was done in Infinite Crisis is very different and is a pale comparison to the initial idea.

The idea put forth in Terminal velocity is the Speed force is more of a spiritual plain that speedsters are connected to. When their time comes they feel a "calling" and a pull to join the force and become one with it. It's very heavily referenced to be a speedsters heaven that when they do their part in this world they join their source and a higher plain as their reward. They pass on. They "die" but it's more complex then that. This happened to Johnny Quick in Dead heat to complete his arc from being a skeptic and viewing their powers as scientific in nature to finally accepting that it is more than that and is spiritual.

Linda being Wallys lightning rod ties into that with Wally stating that when he loses himself in the speed force and gets overwhelmed by it she grounds him by giving him a connection to the physical plain and world. As well as it helps him focused on a reason to stay in this world and not pass on because he has someone to come back to and to stay here. Wally states a few times in that story that she helps him remember that his time has not come and he still needs to accomplish more on this earth but that eventually when his time does come that will be his end and reward to become one with the source.

So as you can see the idea is a very deep one and has a very spiritual and complex concept.

On the other hand we have Infinite Crisis and the Lightning saga which really just dumbs down the whole concept and is not the same thing at all.

Wally runs into the Speed force along with Bart in order to defeat Superboy Prime and the Speed force is treated as just another place. Like the Phantom zone. Just another place in another dimension that they use to trap Superboy Prime in even though he obviously has no connectuon to it. Nothing deeper than that. And to further that Linda joins Wally without having any connection to the Speed force either or needing to run fast or anything.

And Wally is brought back not because of an emotional beacon that pulls him back but just an actual lightning rod that does things for reasons.

[WallyWestFlash]

Its a shame you didn't, it was pretty much the best mini tied to FINA CRISIS (and, as someone else pointed out, gave us Kon-El/Conner Kent back too!). It had some fun XS and Bart moments too.

I didn't like Final Crisis at all. I barely and painfully made it through the main series that I really didnt want to bother with the tie ins.

Plus I haven't read the Legion comics so I didn't really care. Although I did hear it was really good and Johns brought a lot of different continuitys together.

[Ilan Preskovsky]

I'm going to be blunt, but I've yet to actually forgive Marc Guggenheim for Bart's death in that book. I hated how they made him, even worse than the Bart-torr stuff from the new 52.

Why is it that the Flash and Wonder families are always treated like second fiddle to the bat family, never got that.

YJ was really good, but I really want some form of Sins of Youth, because the parts with Wally and Bart are great and Poor Wally and Linda regarding their honeymoon. Props for how that was dealt with at the time.

To be fair, Guggenheim may have killed off "Bart" but he wasn't the one who ruined the character. Geoff Johns started it off when he turned Bart into Kid Flash, thereby making one of DC's most unique characters into a fairly bland, run-of-the-mill teen superhero and then Bilson and (I can't remember his writing partner off hand) utterly destroyed him when they wrote his as this unbearably mopey Flash for half a dozen issues before Guggenheim was called in for what was, frankly, a mercy-killing.

[James Hunter]

I didn't like Final Crisis at all. I barely and painfully made it through the main series that I really didnt want to bother with the tie ins.

Plus I haven't read the Legion comics so I didn't really care. Although I did hear it was really good and Johns brought a lot of different continuitys together.

I wasn't a major fan of FINAL CRISIS either(although I do find it better on re-reads) and my Legion reading before LEGION OF THREE WORLDS was limited to the one trade where Conner was thrust into the future and joined the Legion so you don't need a lot of Legion continuity knowledge.

Its a good mini for Bart and Kon though.

[Restingvoice]

Not at all.

1. Like Dred said the whole concept of being pulled back from the Speed force because of a lightning rod originated with Terminal Velocity with Wally in 1995.

2. What the original concept introduced and what was done in Infinite Crisis is very different and is a pale comparison to the initial idea.

The idea put forth in Terminal velocity is the Speed force is more of a spiritual plain that speedsters are connected to. When their time comes they feel a "calling" and a pull to join the force and become one with it. It's very heavily referenced to be a speedsters heaven that when they do their part in this world they join their source and a higher plain as their reward. They pass on. They "die" but it's more complex then that. This happened to Johnny Quick in Dead heat to complete his arc from being a skeptic and viewing their powers as scientific in nature to finally accepting that it is more than that and is spiritual.

Linda being Wallys lightning rod ties into that with Wally stating that when he loses himself in the speed force and gets overwhelmed by it she grounds him by giving him a connection to the physical plain and world. As well as it helps him focused on a reason to stay in this world and not pass on because he has someone to come back to and to stay here. Wally states a few times in that story that she helps him remember that his time has not come and he still needs to accomplish more on this earth but that eventually when his time does come that will be his end and reward to become one with the source.

So as you can see the idea is a very deep one and has a very spiritual and complex concept.

On the other hand we have Infinite Crisis and the Lightning saga which really just dumbs down the whole concept and is not the same thing at all.

Wally runs into the Speed force along with Bart in order to defeat Superboy Prime and the Speed force is treated as just another place. Like the Phantom zone. Just another place in another dimension that they use to trap Superboy Prime in even though he obviously has no connectuon to it. Nothing deeper than that. And to further that Linda joins Wally without having any connection to the Speed force either or needing to run fast or anything.

And Wally is brought back not because of an emotional beacon that pulls him back but just an actual lightning rod that does things for reasons.

Reading the New 52 Flash I didn't feel that it was anything spiritual. It's like the latter depiction, an alternate dimension where people can be trapped in and show up in different era, sometimes with powers.

How about the current depiction?

[Dred]

Reading the New 52 Flash I didn't feel that it was anything spiritual. It's like the latter depiction, an alternate dimension where people can be trapped in and show up in different era, sometimes with powers.

How about the current depiction?

The New 52 Flash does everything in its power to distance itself from Pre-Flashpoint, which is where Wally and the Lightning Rod stuff originates. Manapul and Buccellato were conscripted to reinvent it. Same reason Barry was dating Patty. This was ignored/retconned out with Rebirth as Johns brought back the old Speed Force. That is the current depiction, though the vast majority of writers have completely missed the point since Waid created it. Even Johns himself fell into the trap where he only ever used it to do whatever he wanted story wise rather than work with what was established (Hello Flash Rebirth 2010, the worst thing anyone's ever done with the Speed Force).

[Jekyll]

Reading the New 52 Flash I didn't feel that it was anything spiritual. It's like the latter depiction, an alternate dimension where people can be trapped in and show up in different era, sometimes with powers.

How about the current depiction?

That’s because the New 52 Flash is one of the worst takes on the character of The Flash that we have ever had. They had zero idea where they wanted to go. This is Barry but lets make him Wally lite.......wait....no.....it resulted in a very bland and convoluted book.

[WallyWestFlash]

wally-west-the-flash-vol-5-40.jpg

Could have been so good. Too bad it was really just the beginning of the end.

[Spider-Ham]

I'm still hoping Williamson has a plan to save Wally's fate. He tried to calm down people after HiC #1 and his Flash #51 ends with the promise of a happy ending for Wally.

I guess we will have our answers in two weeks.

[WallyWestFlash]

I'm still hoping Williamson has a plan to save Wally's fate. He tried to calm down people after HiC #1 and his Flash #51 ends with the promise of a happy ending for Wally.

I guess we will have our answers in two weeks.

I don't think so. I think whatever plan Williamson had for Wally, and it looked like he did, has been scratched by Didio and King.

I think he was just trying to console fans with that.

What's in two weeks? Heroes is crap #5? Just going to be another shot of Wallys dead body lIke they have been doing every issue.