Mr & Mrs X: Gambit and Rogue Appreciation 2019

[AppleJ]

X-men Red

I love it! THAT is crowd control Gambit style. Taylor had a great handle on his character. I only wish he had used him more in Red. But between this and his scene with Thor, plus Remy's appearance in All-New Wolverine he gave us a few real fun gems.

I mean, I get that Remy is feeling frustrated, helpless, and not listened too over Rogue's situation. And any character, no matter how normally controlled they are, could lash out now and again in that scenario. Let us readers feel that too, with him, by telling us more about how we got here. He's been in this situation before with a comatose Rogue, who he could only help by making a deal with the devil. But he did try something then. We haven't seen him do anything so far here. I guess we'll see where this issue takes us. Feels like a lot of running in circles thus far.

[Sandmans_Raven]

I too am watching the Game Awards, and came here to post that.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gXfRV-2TGk4

I've been on the edge of buying it, and the addition of those X-Men might push me over.

Oh nice! As if I needed another excuse to get a Switch lol

[AppleJ]

Comic Book Couples Counseling (@CBCCPodcast): https://twitter.com/CBCCPodcast?s=09 will be covering Gambit and Rogue in January starting with X-Men #3, #8, and #24.

I really love their format and can't wait to see their take on our duo!

[Domino_Dare-Doll]

I love it! THAT is crowd control Gambit style. Taylor had a great handle on his character. I only wish he had used him more in Red. But between this and his scene with Thor, plus Remy's appearance in All-New Wolverine he gave us a few real fun gems.

I mean, I get that Remy is feeling frustrated, helpless, and not listened too over Rogue's situation. And any character, no matter how normally controlled they are, could lash out now and again in that scenario. Let us readers feel that too, with him, by telling us more about how we got here. He's been in this situation before with a comatose Rogue, who he could only help by making a deal with the devil. But he did try something then. We haven't seen him do anything so far here. I guess we'll see where this issue takes us. Feels like a lot of running in circles thus far.

I agree with you there; while I understand the approach that they're trying to take to him in Excalibur it really does need, at the least, a few more introspective moments. This is why I tend to dislike team-books to be honest, it always feels like everyone's fighting for spotlight at the same time and, well...

[Malachi]

I agree with you there; while I understand the approach that they're trying to take to him in Excalibur it really does need, at the least, a few more introspective moments. This is why I tend to dislike team-books to be honest, it always feels like everyone's fighting for spotlight at the same time and, well...

It's a craft. One a bit unlike writing a solo or 1-3 book. It takes some time to get it right. Some writers never seem to grasp it.

Excalibur, as it is now, is not really a team book. Gambit, Jubilee and Rogue have deliberatly been given less time and development. Our hope is this will change. At least as a Gambit, Rogue or Jubilee fan.

A bigger question perhaps is: if it doesn't change will this affect sales enough for it the be changed?

[Domino_Dare-Doll]

It's a craft. One a bit unlike writing a solo or 1-3 book. It takes some time to get it right. Some writers never seem to grasp it.

Excalibur, as it is now, is not really a team book. Gambit, Jubilee and Rogue have deliberatly been given less time and development. Our hope is this will change. At least as a Gambit, Rogue or Jubilee fan.

A bigger question perhaps is: if it doesn't change will this affect sales enough for it the be changed?

That's a good question to be honest. I was always under the assumption that if sales dropped off things just got cancelled automatically? Like, does it get communicated to the writer/artist anymore in enough time for them to fix it, or...?

[Vizzz]

Ironically, they will blame those characters and their fans instead of focusing on others like Peter David did with Gambit in X-Factor

[AppleJ]

I do wish there was a way to communicate some of this feedback in a manner that is respectful. Obviously coming at a creator on social media is not. Could consider writing in? I suppose if they have the time and wherewithal, not to mention really thick skin, they might delve into some of these threads if they really want some unfiltered opinions. But maybe they don't? And I get it, not everyone is going to come at this book from the same angle or even from a place of wanting it to succeed. If you're a Betsy or Apocalypse fan or even a general Excalibur fan, right now you're probably fairly satisfied. As a Gambit and Rogue fan who also really likes fantasy, I want so much to like this book and I really do want it to succeed, but it's making me crazy just how unsatisfying it has been so far. Actually X-Men:Red is a great example of how even an underutilized character without much panel time in a very crowded book can still get some great, non generic character moments and feel very much completely in character.

I just hope we see continued improvement.

I've completely forgotten how excited we all were even 2 or 3 months back wondering about that #5 cover. If we're hitting issue #4 shouldn't we be nearing the climax of the 1st story arc soon? Does it feel like we're building up to something? I mean, I can't say I'm quite feeling any big anticipation yet. Maybe this will be the issue? Maybe A will finally unveil whatever he's manipulating everyone into?

[Malachi]

Ideally we shouldn't have to communicate this. The editor should be on top of this. Filtering out useful critique for the writer and artists. I doubt they got the time honestly. Maybe if they are reading stuff like CBR on their free time.

In general I feel that the Excalibur threads so far has represented a quite fair assesment of the issues. Of course you have to acknowledge that fans are more focused on: plot, art and characters then the premise, theme and worldbuilding that a review might write about.

[AppleJ]

Ideally we shouldn't have to communicate this. The editor should be on top of this. Filtering out useful critique for the writer and artists. I doubt they got the time honestly. Maybe if they are reading stuff like CBR on their free time.

In general I feel that the Excalibur threads so far has represented a quite fair assesment of the issues. Of course you have to acknowledge that fans are more focused on: plot, art and characters then the premise, theme and worldbuilding that a review might write about.

Yeah, that's a good point. And I agree, the Excalibur thread reactions pretty well cover the full range of opinions and overall consensus for fans. The reviews I've read have definitely been more positive.

Part of me keeps thinking, or at least hoping, some of this characterization will start to make sense by the end of the arc or will feed into some big secret reveal. Otherwise I don't know what the point has been really.

Ah well, I guess we'll see soon enough?

[Malachi]

Yeah, that's a good point. And I agree, the Excalibur thread reactions pretty well cover the full range of opinions and overall consensus for fans. The reviews I've read have definitely been more positive.

Part of me keeps thinking, or at least hoping, some of this characterization will start to make sense by the end of the arc or will feed into some big secret reveal. Otherwise I don't know what the point has been really.

Ah well, I guess we'll see soon enough?

I'm trying to remain optimistic. Especially on Rogue. Tini has a big oppertunity with her to energise the issues. Removing Gambits need to go Emobit and hopefully the Shogo issues have been resolved by then too. It can be a clean slate in terms of characterisation while keeping all the groundwork on worldbuilding and themes.

[juan678]

https://twitter.com/ToddNauck/status...542277/photo/4

[LegoLiz]

Hi All! Anyone else stay up to read Excalibur? I did. Some things were better but LOTS of things still feel quite off to me . I am intrigued for the next one at least...

[AppleJ]

Hi All! Anyone else stay up to read Excalibur? I did. Some things were better but LOTS of things still feel quite off to me . I am intrigued for the next one at least...

Morning Lego!

I read it early before I left for work this morning. I remain fairly un-wowed, but at least the ending promises of a better issue #5? My unfiltered thoughts at 7 am ...

spoilers:

So going past the preview which had at least one little sweet moment, we get Remy acting out on a crowd of mutant bigots? Ehhhhh. As if he's never delt with an angry crowd or been under extreme pressure before? What exactly did this accomplish for moving the story forward or building on his character? We've seen the human protests enough to get the idea. And ok, catching the thrown bottle was perfect and badass. However, him then flying off the handle over a thrown bottle? It doesn't track. It's not his usual demeanor in modern comics. This just made me grow more weary of his single-mindedness, which is going a bit beyond devotion and grief at this point. I mean, YES ... Tini is REALLY driving home his love for Rogue. Which would be great if she could let him be capable of talking about anything else for 3 issues straight or maybe doing something to solve it. He's a character that isn't treated well by most writers and actively disliked by plenty of fans. This isn't helping that. I thought surely during his one-on-one with Rictor they'd have some deep conversation or Remy could have a chance to shine at something ... anything? Nope. The dialogue isn't that interesting frankly. It moves the plot forward-ish, but we get no insights into what either of these emotionally overwrought gentlemen are going through. I'm sorry, but I want some dang exposition here. Even if that's currently out of vogue. And of course, nothing to acknowledge the Asmsus run or the fact Pete Wisdom and Gambit have worked together before. I get that it's a solo from 7 years ago and that not every writer has time for extensive character homework ... but it's relevant to this subject matter and really this character cast isn't all that big. I'm fairly sure it's in the damn wiki. I'm getting the feeling Tini hasn't read a lot of modern Gambit and is relying heavily on the early 90's to inform the character. Maybe, maybe not. But surely she read the MMX run immediately before this at the very least? If so, it's not coming through very well. Everything else with Betsy and Akkaba and Jubilee and Meggan and "A" ... didn't add a lot of insight for me, but nudged the plot forward in a not overly exciting fashion. Thought we'd see a cute Shogo and Maggie interaction? Nope. Thought we'd see Betsy do anything besides talk and get frustrated? Nope. Confused about Jubilee calling Remy fragile after all her own carrying on over Shogo and then her punching Jaime for being gross at Meggan? Yeah, me too. So far 4 issues in my favorite characters that are currently conscious are feeling off and disappointing. All I can say is thank God Rogue freaking wakes up at the end and it looks like we're finally going to get this showdown on the road already.

end of spoilers

[R0d]

Morning Lego!

I read it early before I left for work this morning. I remain fairly un-wowed, but at least the ending promises of a better issue #5? My unfiltered thoughts at 7 am ...

spoilers:

So going past the preview which had at least one little sweet moment, we get Remy acting out on a crowd of mutant bigots? Ehhhhh. As if he's never delt with an angry crowd or been under extreme pressure before? What exactly did this accomplish for moving the story forward or building on his character? We've seen the human protests enough to get the idea. And ok, catching the thrown bottle was perfect and badass. However, him then flying off the handle over a thrown bottle? It doesn't track. It's not his usual demeanor in modern comics. This just made me grow more weary of his single-mindedness, which is going a bit beyond devotion and grief at this point. I mean, YES ... Tini is REALLY driving home his love for Rogue. Which would be great if she could let him be capable of talking about anything else for 3 issues straight or maybe doing something to solve it. He's a character that isn't treated well by most writers and actively disliked by plenty of fans. This isn't helping that. I thought surely during his one-on-one with Rictor they'd have some deep conversation or Remy could have a chance to shine at something ... anything? Nope. The dialogue isn't that interesting frankly. It moves the plot forward-ish, but we get no insights into what either of these emotionally overwrought gentlemen are going through. I'm sorry, but I want some dang exposition here. Even if that's currently out of vogue. And of course, nothing to acknowledge the Asmsus run or the fact Pete Wisdom and Gambit have worked together before. I get that it's a solo from 7 years ago and that not every writer has time for extensive character homework ... but it's relevant to this subject matter and really this character cast isn't all that big. I'm fairly sure it's in the damn wiki. I'm getting the feeling Tini hasn't read a lot of modern Gambit and is relying heavily on the early 90's to inform the character. Maybe, maybe not. But surely she read the MMX run immediately before this at the very least? If so, it's not coming through very well. Everything else with Betsy and Akkaba and Jubilee and Meggan and "A" ... didn't add a lot of insight for me, but nudged the plot forward in a not overly exciting fashion. Thought we'd see a cute Shogo and Maggie interaction? Nope. Thought we'd see Betsy do anything besides talk and get frustrated? Nope. Confused about Jubilee calling Remy fragile after all her own carrying on over Shogo and then her punching Jaime for being gross at Meggan? Yeah, me too. So far 4 issues in my favorite characters that are currently conscious are feeling off and disappointing. All I can say is thank God Rogue freaking wakes up at the end and it looks like we're finally going to get this showdown on the road already.

end of spoilers

spoilers:

When in the early 90's Gambit behaved in any way like this though? He had a certain aura of mystery and danger around him but nothing remotely close to this, he never attacked common people in the street no matter how offensive that people were. He's been with the X-men for ages, he's used to dealing with angry crowds, and throwing charged objects at them is not how he would act. This is like a new version of Gambit, one that is only capable of having two emotions, concern and anger. That's all, he is entire personality has been reduced to that, which is incredibly disappointing. With Rogue waking up there might be small ray of hope for the future but at this point I'm not sure I have the will to keep reading this mess of a book.

end of spoilers