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  1. #2821

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    Quote Originally Posted by gurkle View Post
    I think every bit of news about WandaVision or Doctor Strange 2, real or fake, is going to terrify me with the prospect of "Wanda goes House of M and Strange has to put her down." I don't think it will happen but we are talking about a franchise that is heavily based on 2000s Marvel comics (which is why I fully believe that Young Avengers is being set up).

    The one consolation I have is that it's no longer politically correct to portray mental illness as something that makes people go evil and kill their friends (and shouldn't be). Elizabeth Olsen kind of hinted at this the other day:



    I really winced at that quote because of the "always" - but then she probably hasn't read many comics beyond House of M and maybe the Robinson series - but all I can do is hope that they understand now that it's not supposed to be "stigmatized" in the way that it was in 2004-5.

    Mostly I think that's why I'm so disappointed in not having any comics to follow, because I don't enjoy reading rumors and real/fake leaks about 2021. Whatever we get will never be as bad as I can imagine it being but it's still not much fun to think of how a story of Wanda creating her own reality by accident (which seems increasingly what WandaVision will probably be about) could go horribly wrong.
    I wince at it because it (along with what they did to Hank) were the poorest representations of mental illness. It's mental illness means they are antagonists or evil. And in both cases they never mention an actual mental illness for them (until far later). In Wanda's case they threw out crazy as an insult. But then it ended up being possession. And none of how they depicted it is anything like dealing with mental illness. Because you are never suddenly cured or better. It's a constant struggle. Also removing Wanda from being a fleshed out character to plot device doesn't go a long way in making her good representation. They just did the "womins is baby crazy" trope.

    So if movies delve into that, I hope they handle it a hell of a lot better than comics have.
    Last edited by GenericUsername; 10-12-2019 at 04:00 PM.
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  2. #2822
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    Quote Originally Posted by GenericUsername View Post
    I hope they don't do HoM, or if they do, it's as much to do with it as Age of Ultron was to do with that book. Here's to hoping movie Wanda doesn't get trashed into oblivion too.
    I always feel these concerns are very valued as some things in life should, mostly cause we care and love ❤️ Wanda’s character so much an d really it makes me proud to see such a loving and big fan when back in the AvX days their where few.

    But one of the major things I believe is that Marvel and Disney have made the MCU into a publicly traded entity, so they have to really watch how they use their characters, especially their female ones. They would not want to risk too much going negative.
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  3. #2823
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    Now this looks very much like a casting call before Infinity War, and up until today I have seen no indication that anything was even shot:

    https://www.cbr.com/wandavision-cast...-speed-babies/

    https://www.backstage.com/casting/wandavision-320329/

    Edit: looks increasingly suspicious to me. While Kevin Feige will have some oversight, I am rather sure that he is not executive producer.
    Last edited by Probability010; 10-12-2019 at 05:13 PM.

  4. #2824
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    Quote Originally Posted by Probability010 View Post
    Edit: looks increasingly suspicious to me. While Kevin Feige will have some oversight, I am rather sure that he is not executive producer.
    He probably will be credited as executive producer on the Disney+ shows. They usually credit several executive producers, but only one of them runs the show day-to-day. Feige will be executive producer because he's the boss of the showrunners.

    On the other hand that call is for babies in general. I think Wanda and Vision's twins will probably factor in in some way, but that particular casting call doesn't prove it.
    Last edited by gurkle; 10-12-2019 at 05:17 PM.

  5. #2825
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    Quote Originally Posted by gurkle View Post
    He probably will be credited as executive producer on the Disney+ shows. They usually credit several executive producers, but only one of them runs the show day-to-day. Feige will be executive producer because he's the boss of the showrunners.

    On the other hand that call is for babies in general. I think Wanda and Vision's twins will probably factor in in some way, but that particular casting call doesn't prove it.
    I just looked it up, Kevin Feige *is* executive producer for anything past episode 1. I didn’t know that before now:

    https://www.imdb.com/title/tt9140560/fullcredits

    Edit: Well, IMBd isn’t the most reliable source either. Or did I miss that US Agent was announced for the cast of WandaVision ???
    Last edited by Probability010; 10-12-2019 at 05:30 PM.

  6. #2826
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    Quote Originally Posted by Probability010 View Post
    I just looked it up, Kevin Feige *is* executive producer for anything past episode 1. I didn’t know that before now:

    https://www.imdb.com/title/tt9140560/fullcredits

    Edit: Well, IMBd isn’t the most reliable source either. Or did I miss that US Agent was announced for the cast of WandaVision ???
    I think someone copy and pasted US Agent and Sharon Carter in by mistake.
    Don't forget that Stan Lee is writing as well. Quite a coup, that.

  7. #2827
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    IMDb lists the creator of a show or property as a "writer" on every single episode, whether they had anything to do with it (or were even alive). One of many things that makes IMDb so frustrating to search.

  8. #2828
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    I think we can look at Civil War as an indication that, while the MCU might adapt controversial storylines, they won't adapt them in such a way where the heroes become as compromised as they were during them.
    Well, a lot of people bring CW as an example when I point out how shitty HoM would be for Wanda.
    And IMO, they are not really comparable, HoM is Avengers 200/OMD level of bad.
    Last edited by MaximoffTrash; 10-13-2019 at 12:15 AM.

  9. #2829
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    Quote Originally Posted by GenericUsername View Post
    I wince at it because it (along with what they did to Hank) were the poorest representations of mental illness. It's mental illness means they are antagonists or evil. And in both cases they never mention an actual mental illness for them (until far later). In Wanda's case they threw out crazy as an insult. But then it ended up being possession. And none of how they depicted it is anything like dealing with mental illness. Because you are never suddenly cured or better. It's a constant struggle. Also removing Wanda from being a fleshed out character to plot device doesn't go a long way in making her good representation. They just did the "womins is baby crazy" trope.

    So if movies delve into that, I hope they handle it a hell of a lot better than comics have.
    Yeah, I am of the attitude that if it's demonic possession, fight it like a witch/chosen one of Elder God.
    If it's mental illness that can be found in real world, fight it like a functionally human being.
    From a rather selfish standpoint I don't want it even if they “do it better than comics”, because it's simply not her.
    “Wanda going crazy”, “Wanda bringing in Mutants”, all come down to “what 'fans' want her to be” VS “what she should be”. It would feel like losing even if she gets a good story out of it. Because she will still be known for “mental illness”, and most people won't differentiate proper depicion and shitty ones, as a result HoM will probably take the place as Wanda's classic read. She needs some surgical removal of that tumor.

  10. #2830
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    Quote Originally Posted by GenericUsername View Post
    I hope they don't do HoM, or if they do, it's as much to do with it as Age of Ultron was to do with that book. Here's to hoping movie Wanda doesn't get trashed into oblivion too.
    Well, I hope they get someone they didn't use in AoU, which would be Morgan Le Fay!
    Imagine a V3 adaption but with the HoM title.
    Would be ironic since it will be another Avengers V3 under a Bendis title. (AoU movie is essentially Ultron Unlimited adaption.)

  11. #2831

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    Quote Originally Posted by MaximoffTrash View Post
    Yeah, I am of the attitude that if it's demonic possession, fight it like a witch/chosen one of Elder God.
    If it's mental illness that can be found in real world, fight it like a functionally human being.
    From a rather selfish standpoint I don't want it even if they “do it better than comics”, because it's simply not her.
    “Wanda going crazy”, “Wanda bringing in Mutants”, all come down to “what 'fans' want her to be” VS “what she should be”. It would feel like losing even if she gets a good story out of it. Because she will still be known for “mental illness”, and most people won't differentiate proper depicion and shitty ones, as a result HoM will probably take the place as Wanda's classic read. She needs some surgical removal of that tumor.
    Unfortunately I already see HoM recommended for her, even before something like Nights of Wundagore. Sometimes I wonder if people only focus on the last 15 years of comics or something. A lot of stuff gets forgotten.
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  12. #2832
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    Quote Originally Posted by GenericUsername View Post
    Unfortunately I already see HoM recommended for her, even before something like Nights of Wundagore. Sometimes I wonder if people only focus on the last 15 years of comics or something. A lot of stuff gets forgotten.
    I mean, recommending HoM has been the norm for a long time.
    Even if nothing can straight out remove it, something like TV Series/Movie should at least shift the focus from it.

  13. #2833
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    When will people stop suggesting HOM for Wanda? I don see people suggesting that Spidey should throw MJ in a wall or have Captain Marvel being raped by her own son in the MCU. Seriously people should just do the research, of course Disassembled and HOM started because a Hack did a critical research failure in the first place.
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  14. #2834

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    Quote Originally Posted by MaximoffTrash View Post
    I mean, recommending HoM has been the norm for a long time.
    Even if nothing can straight out remove it, something like TV Series/Movie should at least shift the focus from it.
    I agree. And it does worry me, because we both are very aware that if they ruin her the same way in movies, she's probably done then. She'll become an untouchable.
    Was Curlytop

  15. #2835
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    Quote Originally Posted by MaximoffTrash View Post
    I mean, recommending HoM has been the norm for a long time.
    Even if nothing can straight out remove it, something like TV Series/Movie should at least shift the focus from it.
    With a story like House of M there are only three things that can neutralize or ameliorate it's cancerous effect:

    1. Erase it and make it non-canon.

    2. Create a new storyline that is so iconic and popular it buries HoM in tge public consciousness.

    3. An adaptation takes parts of it into a form that is far less toxic form that replaces and usurps it in pop culture perception.

    I think WandaVision will use parts of House of M, but will ignore most of it, instead they will mesh it with other stories, and, this is crucial, it will be about Wanda. This changes everything at a structural and plot level. HoM was not about Wanda, she was a plot device who barely appeared in it and had no arc. There was also no Vision.
    Also, the sitcom aspect means Wanda won't be "sad and tragic" all the time, we will see a happier more fun version of herself. One of the things HoM did was flanderize Wanda into being sad, showing her being fun counteracts that and shows a more rounded character.

    Because the story is focused on her, they have to give proper explanations for her actions and how they occur, they cannot do what Bendis did, and just handwave it.

    My theory in short: I think the world (Modred or Morgan perhaps showing her how to) she creates enables Vision to feel, and he can't feel in the real world. This draws Wanda deeper into this fantasy world. I think this will be an elaborate scheme by Chthon to draw her toward him and corrupt her. WandaWorld IMHO is inside or adjacent to the Flickering Realms.

    It's about her becoming Scarlet Witch, I.e a heroine. Like any satisfying hero's journey it will have moments of darkness and despair, which Wanda will have to overcome to defeat the villain. This differs from most Marvel movies in that the struggle is deeply personal, fitting if it explores Chaos Magic.

    I think symbolically Wanda gives way to Scarlet Witch in the end; a new person emerges, one who embraces her true self. IMHO the moment where she becomes Scarlet Witch will have a ton of emotional weight precisely because of what she has endured and overcome to become Earth's most powerful Witch.

    I really think its she who ends up helping Strange In his movie; I think Derickson is going to delve into his unresolved grief over his sister, and Wanda, his "mystical sister from another Elder God" (I can imagine Strange saying something like that lol)being the person who helps him come to terms with his loss.
    Last edited by Relugus; 10-13-2019 at 01:22 AM.

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