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  1. #1096
    Fantastic Member Siena Blaze's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by salarta View Post
    I'll be honest and straightforward, what "power level" Lorna's considered doesn't really matter. In fact, as I've said before, classification systems of this sort are garbage and always have been.

    The only thing that makes it matter is general disrespect toward the character at Marvel.

    When a character gets tons of use and respect, "classifying" them at a lower level than what past material implies should be the case isn't really an issue. Cause you know it's not happening out of spite. They're simply doing whatever they feel makes the most sense.

    It's when you have a pattern of disrespect that a problem exists. That pattern means you can't trust - or really, respect - the "ranking" given. Especially in Lorna's case where past material has said she either could equal or surpass Magneto one day, or already has. As a result, the lower ranking exists as a part of that ongoing pattern that Marvel refuses to break - and in the process becomes symbolic of their disrespect.


    All this to say it's not really the ranking that matters, it's what the ranking represents within the context of how Marvel treats Lorna in general. It's like you have two police officers, but the female officer never gets good assignments, never gets recognized for her service, never gets included in big department activities even when her expertise is deeply relevant, and then on top of it her status as an expert in her field - the same as the other officer's - is placed one rung down despite meeting all the same qualifications. At some point you have to ask how much bias factors into it.
    Buuuut...didn't it make your blood boil seeing her name follow Havok's? It made mine.

  2. #1097
    Astonishing Member AbnormallyNormal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmc247 View Post
    X-Force which interviews have called Krakoa's CIA and Special Forces is as far as I can see the council going. They want to keep up appearances and convince the international public they are against using deadly force against humans while keeping their actions that do plausibly deniable.

    I think it would honestly take a schism among Krakoa and Lorna deciding these guys need a dark knight or bad cop to take the pressure and attention off them for such a thing to work. I would be more then happy with that happening certainly. The current set up raised Lorna's profile, but she is stuck in every way I described the past two pages.

    I have the feeling for now Hickman is happy with all the mutants mostly happy under Krakoa and certainly the sales are likely to keep that status quo for a fair bit. But, she also doesn't have a place on the island really and hanging out with dad who currently isn't leading anything doesn't open up the doors Genosha did for her. Magneto's role on Krakoa is more similar to Lorna and Pietro's role on Genosha. Right now Lorna doesn't have a role on Krakoa and if that continues for more then a couple months she will be back to being a love interest character I suspect.

    Hickman wrote the best Lorna we have seen in quite some time to look at the positive. But, on the negative side she really has no role on the island that I can see. Lorna leading the Acolytes again in a way that isn't cut short or reduced to her being a pitch hitter for Magneto like last time would be great, but how that works is not so easy when all mutants are supposed to be ruled by the council.

    Lorna has no clear position on Krakoa and no place off Krakoa either until there is some kind of schism.
    Yeah. I just read some interviews by the X-Force author and it seems like my Acolytes idea is already basically covered by this book, it's apparently going to be very gritty and all that. Which is insane to me given the presence of Beast and Jean but hey. Ok then.

    So yeah I honestly have no idea where Lorna is ending up but she's not the only character without a book of course, it's just kind of sad. Also it feels like some characters might be on the "wrong" book but we'll see, it seems the books are interconnecting somewhat more than they have been in a while so perhaps characters bounce around a bit anyway.

    But yeah XForce is going to take like all of the space that Lorna could have used :/
    "So many killers... so much screaming... so many dying. I didn't know where to turn, who to help - which sentinel to stop first. And with the accusations of human judgement screaming in my ears... all I could think was that he was right. MAGNETO HAD BEEN RIGHT ALL ALONG!"

  3. #1098
    Astonishing Member Soulsword323's Avatar
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    Lorna could have definitely worked well full time on X-Force, but it is what it is. Though, there is a chance we could still see Polaris show up for a mission. I believe Percy said that we'd see other people join missions from time to time (if I didn't misread/interpret what he said).

    We know there's more stuff on the way in terms of team books, and I think there is definitely a place for Polaris still.

  4. #1099
    Astonishing Member powerpax's Avatar
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    It's not a competition. I can think of plenty of spaces for Lorna. I don't have a problem with the roster of X-Force, which is not strictly black ops like the old one.

  5. #1100

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    Quote Originally Posted by Siena Blaze View Post
    Buuuut...didn't it make your blood boil seeing her name follow Havok's? It made mine.
    Of course, but I'm also not surprised. It's typical MarvelThink. The company and the immediate culture surrounding it is very insular, thinking and acting in a cyclical fashion. Things like that are subconscious tells. You can rely on those tells to gauge a person's perspective - and if they're in a position of power, map out the scenarios most likely to play out for how they use their power.

    Another way to put it is, writers of these articles subconsciously take their cues from Marvel. If the cue they pick up is "Lorna is beneath Havok," then their writing reflects it, e.g. putting Havok first.


    I should also specify that Havok's name before Lorna's is, like the classification system, only an issue due to how Lorna's been treated around Havok. If that history/pattern didn't exist, it wouldn't matter whose name came first.

    Anyway, more social media stuff I meant to include but forgot, so now I need to edit it in.



    Another case of "Marvel chooses to use other green-haired characters instead of Lorna, people expect it to be Lorna because people outside Marvel expect her to be in more places than Marvel's willing to put her."



    Aside from Viny's tweet, I think Marvel's tweet itself is extremely telling. Back in 2008, they were willing to include Lorna as an example of a meaningful female X-Men character outside the usual suspects. Today, you can bet Marvel would never include her in such a tweet.
    Last edited by salarta; 11-05-2019 at 08:51 PM.
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  6. #1101
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    I meant to post this last night as it was Jim Steranko's birthday (November 5th), but fell asleep. Happy Birthday and thanks for your work in creating Polaris.



    Emma Dumont's birthday is on the 15th of November. I still remember her holding up the gift from her cast of X-Men 50 and how ecstatic she was back in 2017 and how much energy she brought on a daily basis for those who need a reminder.



    Last years birthday was much more subdued for her. It was patently obvious the show was heading off a cliff straight head first and none of the actors were feeling their characters that season.

    As for the issue of the comics right now. I said before that Hickman is correct that not every character can have a team book or deserves a team book. That said Lorna needs a role on the island over the next year or chances are she devolves back into a love interest character and I would rather she be fully limboed and not see her for a few years then that happen.

    What role could she have? I don't know at this point. It looks like Poccy, Mags and Xavier are the diplomats, we know who the official security is and we know who the council is. For those who believe there are plenty of spaces for Lorna besides those things... that is nice, but what if its not security, diplomacy or governance. In terms of being the mutant world's connection to humans that is what Emma and company are for.

    At a larger level I hope AbnormallyNormal sees what I have been saying to him for awhile. The X-Men have been slowly over time since Decimation (and now quickly with Krakoa) moving away from Xavier's old dream while Magneto has been moving away from his old dream of mutants ruling the world. There really isn't a philosophical middle ground to be had anymore they are both at the exact same place.

    For Magneto that is great as he is on the council, a diplomat, and will be guest starring on many other books including Fallen Angels. For Lorna what it means is harder to say. My feeling is the character will be treading water for awhile until there is some nitch she can fill and hopefully that nitch isn't love interest.

    It would have been easy to argue that say Lorna and the core X-Men had a wide gulf of differences to mine to create drama between them just a few years ago. Today? Is there a difference from the core X-Men including even Jean and Lorna in any area that can be used for drama? If so I don't see it.
    Last edited by jmc247; 11-06-2019 at 10:57 AM.

  7. #1102
    Astonishing Member Soulsword323's Avatar
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    Although she didn't actually appear, Polaris was mentioned in Percy's script for X-Force. Apparently she was to be included with the crew of the Marauders? Not sure as to why, but I didn't see her regardless. Emma was also mentioned to have appeared, but I didn't see her either. Maybe they had to be removed for a reason, or this was an old script that had a Lorna cameo or something.

  8. #1103
    Astonishing Member powerpax's Avatar
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    I see a lot of spec that she may be a later addition, which I'd be all for.

  9. #1104
    Astonishing Member Soulsword323's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by powerpax View Post
    I see a lot of spec that she may be a later addition, which I'd be all for.
    Same here. Would love if she was included in that book.

  10. #1105
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    What did it say in regards to Lorna and Emma? I can say that I did wonder if Lorna was originally meant to be part of the Hellfire Club as the green queen early on, but backed away from it? The whole connecting Emma and Lorna with North as part of HoX was a hint in that direction.
    Last edited by jmc247; 11-06-2019 at 11:04 AM.

  11. #1106
    Astonishing Member Soulsword323's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmc247 View Post
    What did it say in regards to Lorna and Emma? I can say that I did wonder if Lorna was originally meant to be part of the Hellfire Club as the green queen early on, but backed away from it?

    The whole connecting Emma and Lorna with North as part of HoX was also a hint in that direction.


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  12. #1107
    Mighty Member CGAR's Avatar
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    I feel like that script was the writers error and not spoilers.
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  13. #1108
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    I actually see a green head aboard that boat and what looks like a white one. It could be either X-Force jumped the gun on things that the Marauders will get to in future issues, plans changed for the Marauders late in the day, or there was just some miscommunication.

    I have trouble seeing either Emma or Lorna hanging out on a boat on the high seas for more then if they were absolutely needed for a vital mission or two. They feel like more the actors that would do the deal making and negotation to make things work for the pirates getting mutants out of the hostile countries.

  14. #1109
    Astonishing Member powerpax's Avatar
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    Why would the writer spontaneously add two mutants to the Marauders' public roster?

  15. #1110
    Astonishing Member powerpax's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmc247 View Post
    I have trouble seeing either Emma or Lorna hanging out on a boat on the high seas for more then if they were needed for a vital mission or two. They feel like more the actors that would do the deal making and negotation to make things work for the pirates.
    Emma is running Marauders along with Kitty. I personally do not see Lorna as the negotiator but that's me. IMO Polaris is the tip of the spear these days.

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