The First Family of Marvel: The Fantastic Four Appreciation 2019

[Iron Maiden]

I’d love to see Slott do a storyline where Doom and Margali Szardos get married, and form their own alliance to combat both Doctor Strange and the FF. Maybe have a storyline that involves Morgan Le Fay, or Merlyn from Otherworld.

Let's not make his life any more complicated. I'm still waiting to see if Amara had their baby yet. I'm disappointed that Marvel hasn't followed up on this or provided any indication what Amara's status is.

[Digifiend]

Like Da Vinci SHIELD and Miles's organic webbing, this is probably a plot abandoned because of Bendis's departure from Marvel. I wouldn't be surprised if Amara just never appears again.

[Iron Maiden]

I'm afraid you are very likely correct Digifiend. This long and no follow up is not an encouraging sign. Seems like anything that had to do with humanizing Doom, Slott doesn't want to deal with in his Fantastic Four or Iron Man.

[Crimz]

By Nszerdy

[Snoop Dogg]

I HUNGER for new arc solicitations. I. HAVE. A. NEED!

[Shadowcat]

Am I the only one who didn’t like what Bendis did with Doom?

[Iron Maiden]

Am I the only one who didn’t like what Bendis did with Doom?

Probably not. It got mixed reactions. IMO it was a logical progression to take with Doom post SW. IMO what Slott did was worse since he has Doom going back to doing death traps for the Fantastic Four. This was a regression to Infamous Iron Man but Zdarsky's Marvel Two in One. I'd even say it does the same for Hickman's Fantastic Four.

Some of us Doom fan feel that after Secret Wars, Doom had come to an epiphany and Bendis pretty much has him say as much to Amara very early on in Infamous IM. He achieved everything he had wanted and found it wasn't what he wanted after all. Slott having Doom arbitrarily deciding that the Fantastic Four's coming into Latveria was a crime punishable only by death was aberrant to say the least, even by his older standards. Granted, in the RW you could argue the case for them entering a country's sovereign air space was illegal and could be cause for an international air space. But they've been to Latveria before without incident. Reed took Sue along with him to go see Valeria in Doom's castle in the dead of night during Hickman's New Avengers run. They weren't jailed or threatened with death. Doom just was annoyed that they came during the night when she should have been in bed.

[U.N. Owen]

I'm hoping we get something done with Kristoff Vernard and the Fantastic Four. I don't remember him dying, so why he wasn't in Latveria during the Herald of Doom arc was a bit jarring.

[Iron Maiden]

I agree. I think lot of the reason why we get an frequently MIA Kristoff is that only some writers seem to be interested in dealing with the personal relationships Doom has had over the years. Even old faithful Boris is seldom seen these days. Hickman at least used them both and IMO wrote the best version of Nathaniel Richards there has ever been. I did get a chance to talk to Hickman briefly at C2E2 (he had a pretty long line at his section in Artist's Alley!) and he said he doesn't see why more writers don't use Kristoff. He saw a lot of potential there.

Amara also is MIA and Lancer from the Heroes Return and Claremont's Fantastic Four I believe was killed off but have yet to find what comic...Exiles maybe? Claremont had once said at an old MB (which no longer exists) that for some reason Marvel didn't want him using Lancer.

[U.N. Owen]

The most common argument I've heard against Kristoff's inclusion in recent comics is that he's somehow obsolete. He is meant to be heir of Doom, a chance for Doom to one-up Reed in parenting. Then Val came along and took that from him and had a more complicated relationship with the FF and Doom. Instead of a dark mirror to Franklin, you've now tied the families together.

I personally say that was horse crap since it's not like you can't tell stories when characters no longer fit a role. If that was the case, Sue would be gone since she no longer fits the role of damsel in distress. You could just create a new role for the character. You just need to do it well.


I'd love to see Kristoff's reaction to Reed telling him what Doom did on Battleworld with the whole creating versions of the Fantastic Four and Future Foundation as his church and family.

[Iron Maiden]

A few posts up, I posted that picture featured those two "siblings", Val and Kristoff. Now with Val, Doom named himself as her godfather when he delivered her safely when Sue was very much in danger of losing the baby and perhaps dying herself. Kristoff is his adopted heir. Though not related by blood, they both share a different view of Doom than most people in the world. Sue she seems to have become increasingly hostile to any contact, especially in the one FF annual where she even frightened Valeria with the ferocity of her attacks on her "Uncle Doom" and didn't want to go home with Sue. Slott has so far ignored or perhaps deliberately avoided any contact with Doom and Val.

So if Slott is pretty much ignoring this, it wouldn't be like Val would be taking Kristoff's place. But I also have doubts that Slott would use him anyway.

[Snoop Dogg]

I'm hoping we get something done with Kristoff Vernard and the Fantastic Four. I don't remember him dying, so why he wasn't in Latveria during the Herald of Doom arc was a bit jarring.

Kristoff left Latveria to be his own person in Soule and Pulido's She-Hulk years ago and Victor let him go because he agreed with him that the country shouldn't be inherited by someone who only knows subservience. He should have gone back to doing that, not staying in Latveria again and letting the problem continue.

[Coatl]

Kristoff left Latveria to be his own person in Soule and Pulido's She-Hulk years ago and Victor let him go because he agreed with him that the country shouldn't be inherited by someone who only knows subservience. He should have gone back to doing that, not staying in Latveria again and letting the problem continue.

Well, as far as I remember, no, yes of course I know that issue of She-Hulk (that I kind of hate because I consider it terribly OC and inconsistent) but as I understood the conclusion She-Hulk said very clearly that Kristoff DIDN'T want to left Latveria, but Doom being so controlling had left him without options, at that point Doom allows HER leave Latveria unharmed and promised Kristoff to think about the issue. Kristoff just is assigned to make sure that She-Hulk leaves the country, but never is stated that he isn't coming back, at contrary, he still wants to live there all he was asking was for was a little more freedom.

Other hand, based in previous characterizations of him; Kristoff have had two main goals his entire life, please his father (hard if not impossible) and become a fit ruler. Even when he isn't always in the best terms with his adoptive father, he always has cared for his people and country, so making him just disappear when there is a big menace at the door seems just lazy.

[Iron Maiden]

Kristoff left Latveria to be his own person in Soule and Pulido's She-Hulk years ago and Victor let him go because he agreed with him that the country shouldn't be inherited by someone who only knows subservience. He should have gone back to doing that, not staying in Latveria again and letting the problem continue.

The problem didn't continue......Kristoff was seen in Hickman's New Avengers several times and it was more of a mentoring relationship. He fought with his father against the Mapmakers during the incursions of Latveria. He's not been seen since that last dinner with Namor in Castle Doom and then Doom was off to head off the Beyonder's plan with Owen. I'm curious to see where Kristoff turns up next but I'm pretty sure it won't be in the Fantastic Four.

I think Kristoff came off as a bit sheltered in Soule's She Hulk story. But I will say it looked like Soule had some further plans for Kristoff but it doesn't look like it ever came about. At least I never came across anything. Kristoff should only be several years older than Franklin. He was Franklin's nemesis a couple of times in the Son of a Genius comics. I'd like to see them meet up now that they're closer in age.

[Grim Fandango]

FF/Spidey team-up?

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