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  1. #3631

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    That first one is closer than the WatXM one, it just needs a better neck. The Cockrum design has a tall collar, like a mock turtle neck.
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  2. #3632
    Astonishing Member jwatson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LordAllMIghty View Post
    I'll have to read it but nothing you said changes my original opinion about the book.



    I think Jean's name is just a placeholder for Omega level telepaths. She not the only omega level telepath in the universe but she probably the most prominent...next to Xavier.

    Storm's ability easily put her in the energy/matter manipulation category too.
    That's cool. I don't remember most people's opinions after a debate is over but marauders for me makes more sense and I'm even more excited. Also storm is considered a wonderful natural resource now that should be protected and nitured. Grooming like a fool here. Lol. I looooooooved it.
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  3. #3633
    Incredible Member Ororo101's Avatar
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    What do you guys think of this interesting conversation I had with a reddit user on Storm, Thor, Goddesshood, and the new Omega level classification list?

    User 1: “My only issue is Storm and how her powers compare to Thor using Mjolnir. However, if it's just meant to be what compared to Homo Sapiens than that clears it up for me”

    Me: “I believe the difference would be that Thor uses magic to bring forth weather affects with no consequence to global atmospheric conditions while Storm on the other hand, atmokinetically, manipulates existing elements and their natural patterns to produce instantaneous weather manifestations to her specific desired effect.

    Only other reason I could see would be that she was recently ascended to Godhood by Coates over in Black Panther, known now to the Wakandan people as the Hadari Yao, The Walker of Clouds. But the actual effects of that transformation have not really been expounded upon much since then so it’s hard to say if that would’ve affected her rank against Thor without any editorial statement and/or on panel resolution. One could say that her recent proclamation to be a goddess when she blasted Nate in the most recent Age of X-man saga was some form of an X-book acknowledgement since it happened after her elevation in BP but knowing Storm, it could’ve just been super pissed off hyperbole of the moment too lol”

    User 1: “After looking at the list again I wonder if it could be argued that Storm is weather manipulation while Thor is weather manifestation similar to Hope being power manipulation and Legion being power manifestation. I think that's sorta of what you were saying in your first paragraph.

    I don't read BP so what caused her to "ascend to godhood"? Was it for stuff she had done previously such as when Xavier found her and she was being worshipped as a goddess? Or was it implied that there was some new transformation she had undergone. If it doesn't really say that is fine but I'm just curious about that since you mentioned it. When I saw the page with that AoX scene I assumed that was just hyperbole and reference to a time when people did consider her a goddess.

    Me: “Yeah I would say that sounds like a good interpretation of it! Thor “manifests” weather effects while Ororo “manipulates” atmospheric elements. Actually a perfect breakdown that corresponds with the new Omega list and stipulations we now have.

    As far as her ascension to Godhood in Black Panther it was revealed that Ororo has always had gift of Godhead passed down from her ancestors, a gift that grants her access to divine energies by the power of faith/belief. The X-men villain, The Adversary was attacking Wakanda and disposed of their entire pantheon. Apparently T’challa always theorized that Ororo had this ability, probably stemming from her past as a worshiped deity to her tribe, and when they had no other options he needed her to come through to save Wakanda. At the time she had been beaten/trapped by The Adversary under a mountain of fallen rocks with two other heroes and was going into a claustrophobic panic. T’challa talks her out of it, channels the faith of all of Wakanda into her and she ascends to single-handedly banish The Adversary, an inter-dimensional evil entity that required the near sacrifice of the entire X-men team last time they fought him. Great story climax that Coates has been building up to for quite some time and the payoff was, to be entirely too cheesy, “Divine” lol”

    (Inserted pictures of the scans I was explaining)

    User 1: “That's actually really cool. Thanks for sharing those pages! That's a really awesome moment for both Ororo and T'Challa.”

    I think it’s a great way to differentiate the two and the differences in their power. Just like Legion and Hope are both Omega in their own separate but related categories, Power “Manifestation” and Power “Manipulation” respectively, I would think no one on Earth technically surpasses Ororo in Weather/Elemental Manipulation since Thor simply manifests weather magically via Mljonir, no actual manipulation taking place.
    Last edited by Ororo101; 07-24-2019 at 07:27 AM.

  4. #3634
    Astonishing Member jwatson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ororo101 View Post
    What do you guys think of this interesting conversation I had with a reddit user on Storm, Thor, Goddesshood, and the new Omega level classification list?


    spoilers:
    User 1: “My only issue is Storm and how her powers compare to Thor using Mjolnir. However, if it's just meant to be what compared to Homo Sapiens than that clears it up for me”

    Me: “I believe the difference would be that Thor uses magic to bring forth weather affects with no consequence to global atmospheric conditions while Storm on the other hand, atmokinetically, manipulates existing elements and their natural patterns to produce instantaneous weather manifestations to her specific desired effect.

    Only other reason I could see would be that she was recently ascended to Godhood by Coates over in Black Panther, known now to the Wakandan people as the Hadari Yao, The Walker of Clouds. But the actual effects of that transformation have not really been expounded upon much since then so it’s hard to say if that would’ve affected her rank against Thor without any editorial statement and/or on panel resolution. One could say that her recent proclamation to be a goddess when she blasted Nate in the most recent Age of X-man saga was some form of an X-book acknowledgement since it happened after her elevation in BP but knowing Storm, it could’ve just been super pissed off hyperbole of the moment too lol”

    User 1: “After looking at the list again I wonder if it could be argued that Storm is weather manipulation while Thor is weather manifestation similar to Hope being power manipulation and Legion being power manifestation. I think that's sorta of what you were saying in your first paragraph.

    I don't read BP so what caused her to "ascend to godhood"? Was it for stuff she had done previously such as when Xavier found her and she was being worshipped as a goddess? Or was it implied that there was some new transformation she had undergone. If it doesn't really say that is fine but I'm just curious about that since you mentioned it. When I saw the page with that AoX scene I assumed that was just hyperbole and reference to a time when people did consider her a goddess.

    Me: “Yeah I would say that sounds like a good interpretation of it! Thor “manifests” weather effects while Ororo “manipulates” atmospheric elements. Actually a perfect breakdown that corresponds with the new Omega list and stipulations we now have.

    As far as her ascension to Godhood in Black Panther it was revealed that Ororo has always had gift of Godhead passed down from her ancestors, a gift that grants her access to divine energies by the power of faith/belief. The X-men villain, The Adversary was attacking Wakanda and disposed of their entire pantheon. Apparently T’challa always theorized that Ororo had this ability, probably stemming from her past as a worshiped deity to her tribe, and when they had no other options he needed her to come through to save Wakanda. At the time she had been beaten/trapped by The Adversary under a mountain of fallen rocks with two other heroes and was going into a claustrophobic panic. T’challa talks her out of it, channels the faith of all of Wakanda into her and she ascends to single-handedly banish The Adversary, an inter-dimensional evil entity that required the near sacrifice of the entire X-men team last time they fought him. Great story climax that Coates has been building up to for quite some time and the payoff was, to be entirely too cheesy, “Divine” lol”

    (Inserted pictures of the scans I was explaining)

    User 1: “That's actually really cool. Thanks for sharing those pages! That's a really awesome moment for both Ororo and T'Challa.”

    I think it’s a great way to differentiate the two and the differences in their power. Just like Legion and Hope are both Omega in their own separate but related categories, Power “Manifestation” and Power “Manipulation” respectively, I would think no one on Earth technically surpasses Ororo in Weather/Elemental Manipulation since Thor simply manifests weather magically via Mljonir, no actual manipulation taking place.
    end of spoilers
    I think in Storm's case weather manipulation and weather manifestation is one in the same given the classification of omega having no limit. meaning if storm is controllling the weather and can go beyond what the weather is producing because she has no upper limit she is essentially manifesting her own weather conditions. What comes into play at that point is how destructive could it be for the planet or those on it.
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  5. #3635
    Incredible Member Ororo101's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jwatson View Post
    I think in Storm's case weather manipulation and weather manifestation is one in the same given the classification of omega having no limit. meaning if storm is controllling the weather and can go beyond what the weather is producing because she has no upper limit she is essentially manifesting her own weather conditions. What comes into play at that point is how destructive could it be for the planet or those on it.
    I think the difference we were trying to establish between Manipulation and Manifestation is akin to how Legion “manifests” powers out of the limitless void of personalities/powers that reside in his mind while Hope has immeasurable potential to “manipulate” all existing mutant powers around her. Thor’s power over the weather comes magically from within Mjolnir, not needing any existing scientific realities to make his effects known, while Ororo has the limitless potential to manipulate the very scientific realities that govern the elements of weather itself. Thor maneuvers “around” existing elements to get what he wants and Ororo masters the elements themselves to get what she wants.

  6. #3636
    Astonishing Member jwatson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ororo101 View Post
    I think the difference we were trying to establish between Manipulation and Manifestation is akin to how Legion “manifests” powers out of the limitless void of personalities/powers that reside in his mind while Hope has immeasurable potential to “manipulate” all existing mutant powers around her. Thor’s power over the weather comes magically from within Mjolnir, not needing any existing scientific realities to make his effects known, while Ororo has the limitless potential to manipulate the very scientific realities that govern the elements of weather itself. Thor maneuvers “around” existing elements to get what he wants and Ororo masters the elements themselves to get what she wants.
    I think i get what your saying but i would say he was more conjuring storm's through magic than actually manifesting them himself or creating them based on that definition though. For instance Storm can manipulate a gentle breeze to blow left in stead of right or she can manifest jovial pressures on earth by manipulating the forces that govern the elements. She has to manifest the joival pressure because it's not something that naturally occurs on earth. Where as thor is magically conjuring the potential of a storm or existing storms to get the effects he desires. One can affect the ecosystem and one doesn't.
    Don't let anyone else hold the candle that lights the way to your future because only you can sustain the flame.

  7. #3637
    Judgement Awaits LordAllMIghty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ororo101 View Post
    What do you guys think of this interesting conversation I had with a reddit user on Storm, Thor, Goddesshood, and the new Omega level classification list?


    spoilers:
    User 1: “My only issue is Storm and how her powers compare to Thor using Mjolnir. However, if it's just meant to be what compared to Homo Sapiens than that clears it up for me”

    Me: “I believe the difference would be that Thor uses magic to bring forth weather affects with no consequence to global atmospheric conditions while Storm on the other hand, atmokinetically, manipulates existing elements and their natural patterns to produce instantaneous weather manifestations to her specific desired effect.

    Only other reason I could see would be that she was recently ascended to Godhood by Coates over in Black Panther, known now to the Wakandan people as the Hadari Yao, The Walker of Clouds. But the actual effects of that transformation have not really been expounded upon much since then so it’s hard to say if that would’ve affected her rank against Thor without any editorial statement and/or on panel resolution. One could say that her recent proclamation to be a goddess when she blasted Nate in the most recent Age of X-man saga was some form of an X-book acknowledgement since it happened after her elevation in BP but knowing Storm, it could’ve just been super pissed off hyperbole of the moment too lol”

    User 1: “After looking at the list again I wonder if it could be argued that Storm is weather manipulation while Thor is weather manifestation similar to Hope being power manipulation and Legion being power manifestation. I think that's sorta of what you were saying in your first paragraph.

    I don't read BP so what caused her to "ascend to godhood"? Was it for stuff she had done previously such as when Xavier found her and she was being worshipped as a goddess? Or was it implied that there was some new transformation she had undergone. If it doesn't really say that is fine but I'm just curious about that since you mentioned it. When I saw the page with that AoX scene I assumed that was just hyperbole and reference to a time when people did consider her a goddess.

    Me: “Yeah I would say that sounds like a good interpretation of it! Thor “manifests” weather effects while Ororo “manipulates” atmospheric elements. Actually a perfect breakdown that corresponds with the new Omega list and stipulations we now have.

    As far as her ascension to Godhood in Black Panther it was revealed that Ororo has always had gift of Godhead passed down from her ancestors, a gift that grants her access to divine energies by the power of faith/belief. The X-men villain, The Adversary was attacking Wakanda and disposed of their entire pantheon. Apparently T’challa always theorized that Ororo had this ability, probably stemming from her past as a worshiped deity to her tribe, and when they had no other options he needed her to come through to save Wakanda. At the time she had been beaten/trapped by The Adversary under a mountain of fallen rocks with two other heroes and was going into a claustrophobic panic. T’challa talks her out of it, channels the faith of all of Wakanda into her and she ascends to single-handedly banish The Adversary, an inter-dimensional evil entity that required the near sacrifice of the entire X-men team last time they fought him. Great story climax that Coates has been building up to for quite some time and the payoff was, to be entirely too cheesy, “Divine” lol”

    (Inserted pictures of the scans I was explaining)

    User 1: “That's actually really cool. Thanks for sharing those pages! That's a really awesome moment for both Ororo and T'Challa.”

    I think it’s a great way to differentiate the two and the differences in their power. Just like Legion and Hope are both Omega in their own separate but related categories, Power “Manifestation” and Power “Manipulation” respectively, I would think no one on Earth technically surpasses Ororo in Weather/Elemental Manipulation since Thor simply manifests weather magically via Mljonir, no actual manipulation taking place.
    end of spoilers
    I see no reason to cover this post as spoiler.

    Thor can control the weather without his hammer...though we have no idea how powerful he is without it. He doesn't have Storm's finite control or creative skill. Its the Sledgehammer vs. Surgeon scalpel debate.

    Anyway, Thor's powers are magic based so his ability to manifest thunderstorms in space is not that hard believe. While Storm's powers are more science based as she needs to quickly manipulate molecules and atoms to create weather effects.
    Last edited by LordAllMIghty; 07-24-2019 at 07:23 AM.
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  8. #3638
    Incredible Member Ororo101's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jwatson View Post
    I think i get what your saying but i would say he was more conjuring storm's through magic than actually manifesting them himself or creating them based on that definition though. For instance Storm can manipulate a gentle breeze to blow left in stead of right or she can manifest jovial pressures on earth by manipulating the forces that govern the elements. She has to manifest the joival pressure because it's not something that naturally occurs on earth. Where as thor is magically conjuring the potential of a storm or existing storms to get the effects he desires. One can affect the ecosystem and one doesn't.
    Yes that’s exactly what I mean! Thor conjures/manifests storms via magic, in essence skipping over all of the actual complexities of atmospheric manipulation by essentially using magic as a cheat/loophole to get his desired effect and Storm has fully mastered the manipulation of the atmosphere and it’s components to do the same thing. In essence, Thor’s daddy gave a substantial bribe to the University to get him in and get his degree without the knowledge it took to earn it while Storm saved money, studied hard, and worked her ass off to get her PhD. While he may get the more high paying job because of his connections, all experts in the field regard her as the most knowledgeable on the topic.
    Last edited by Ororo101; 07-24-2019 at 07:29 AM.

  9. #3639
    Incredible Member Ororo101's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LordAllMIghty View Post
    I see no reason to cover this post as spoiler.

    Thor can control the weather without his hammer...though we have no idea how powerful he is without it. He doesn't have Storm's finite control or creative skill. Its the Sledgehammer vs. Surgeon scalpel debate.

    Anyway, Thor's powers are magic based so his ability to manifest thunderstorms in space is not that hard believe. While Storm's powers are more science based as she needs to quickly manipulate molecules and atoms to create weather effects.

    Idk I felt the need to add spoiler tags to the body of the post for those who really didn’t want to know about today’s issue before they read it even though spoilers are everywhere by now lol but I can remove them if everyone’s cool with it
    Last edited by Ororo101; 07-24-2019 at 07:38 AM.

  10. #3640
    Judgement Awaits LordAllMIghty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ororo101 View Post
    Yes that’s exactly what I mean! Thor conjures/manifests storms via magic, in essence skipping over all of the actual complexities of atmospheric manipulation by essentially using magic as a cheat/loophole to get his desired effect and Storm has fully mastered the manipulation of the atmosphere and it’s components to do the same thing. In essence, Thor’s daddy gave a substantial bribe to the University to get him in and get his degree without the knowledge it took to earn it while Storm saved money, studied hard, and worked her ass off to get her PhD. While he may get the more high paying job because of his connections, all experts in the field regard her as the most knowledgeable on the topic.
    Lol...on point.
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  11. #3641
    Astonishing Member jwatson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ororo101 View Post
    Yes that’s exactly what I mean! Thor conjures/manifests storms via magic, in essence skipping over all of the actual complexities of atmospheric manipulation by essentially using magic as a cheat/loophole to get his desired effect and Storm has fully mastered the manipulation of the atmosphere and it’s components to do the same thing. In essence, Thor’s daddy gave a substantial bribe to the University to get him in and get his degree without the knowledge it took to earn it while Storm saved money, studied hard, and worked her ass off to get her PhD. While he may get the more high paying job because of his connections, all experts in the field regard her as the most knowledgeable on the topic.
    completely agree.
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  12. #3642
    Astonishing Member jwatson's Avatar
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    OMG storm is absolutely stunning in Marvels Epilogue. Stunning. Art is amazing. She has a whole page where she hit's herself with lightning and changes into her classic costume. beautiful.
    Don't let anyone else hold the candle that lights the way to your future because only you can sustain the flame.

  13. #3643
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    Quote Originally Posted by jwatson View Post
    OMG storm is absolutely stunning in Marvels Epilogue. Stunning. Art is amazing. She has a whole page where she hit's herself with lightning and changes into her classic costume. beautiful.
    I was gonna buy it for the art but there just wasn't enough pages of story to justify the price for me.
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  14. #3644
    Astonishing Member jwatson's Avatar
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    And seeing the infamous Hurricane Storm created over manhattan in her first appearance painted by alex ross almost brought a tear to my eye. So much Storm love today. Yes!
    Don't let anyone else hold the candle that lights the way to your future because only you can sustain the flame.

  15. #3645
    Astonishing Member jwatson's Avatar
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    Also fearless really gets into Storm's head on the greed of man. It's a deep scene. Today is like the best Storm day and i don't know how long.
    Don't let anyone else hold the candle that lights the way to your future because only you can sustain the flame.

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