Ororo Munroe: Storm Appreciation 2019

[The Quiet Councilor]

Storm was speaking in general terms about humanity and their/our institutional and systemic oppression. I don’t think it’s that different than the broad strokes used when discussing white privilege, heteronormativity, or toxic masculinity. The people who tend to go “not all xyz” about it are the ones most insecure about it.

Storm wasn’t talking about T’Challa.

[jwatson]

Storm wasn’t talking about T’Challa.

Exactly but if that's the example he used he must think she was since he's human too. But then that brings up the question why is buttefly even routing for them if he really believes that is what the scene meant.

[butterflykyss]

No i said do you see Storm as someone who lumps all men together? It was a question you didn't answer. IMO she was talking about the men she was going up against. But if you want to post a panel and take all the context away to fit your narrative that is cool. But i'm stamping that receipt revoked because it don't make sense.

And i said say something postive about men, not notice an emotional state of a man in that second so i'm going to have to stamp that receipt as unreturnable too.

I find it funny that in one breath you can talk about how horrible X-men Gold was for Storm and how kitty got all the shine, but yet you can do a figure 8 to somehow turn black panther into some great piece of work and not see where his fans are coming from. So no, none of my questions were answered.

But then hey, if you think Storm meant ALL men in that panel i guess that in of itself informs me on what YOU think of Storm.

1. oh I gotcha. I thought you made a statement that she doesnt lump people together. but to answer your question I would say she wouldnt lump people any group of people together. but it doesnt matter really what I think. i assume you believe coates had her do this and Hickman himself did the same.

2. and tchalla being shown capable of loving, living on his own terms and not boggled with the weight of being a king I would say is positive.

3. black panther has not centered around ororo. she has been in maybe 2 or 3 issues out of 17 issues that have been released. that is apples and rocks comparison.

4. and I think she meant men in context of being desperate and when they have no other options to exhaust. all in all its still a lumping of men which counters your original point.

[butterflykyss]

Storm was speaking in general terms about humanity and their/our institutional and systemic oppression. I don’t think it’s that different than the broad strokes used when discussing white privilege, heteronormativity, or toxic masculinity. The people who tend to go “not all xyz” about it are the ones most insecure about it.

Storm wasn’t talking about T’Challa.

agreed beloved!!

[jwatson]

1. oh I gotcha. I thought you made a statement that she doesnt lump people together. but to answer your question I would say she wouldnt lump people any group of people together.

2. and tchalla being shown capable of loving, living on his own terms and not boggled with the weight of being a king I would say is positive.

3. black panther has not centered around ororo. she has been in maybe 2 or 3 issues out of 17 issues that have been released. that is apples and rocks comparison.

4. and I think she meant men in context of being desperate and when they have no other options to exhaust. all in all its still a lumping of men which counters your original point.

1. But thats what she does about the state of men. "Men think they have a monopoly on indiscretion."
2.He wasn't shown it was a panel of someone speaking to his state of mind, much like Storm did in the last issue of BP.
3. It hasn't centered around Tchalla either but it gave Storm more shine, story, and growth in the issues she appeared than it did the MAIN character of his own book. Gold was a team book, this is a solo.
4. Again it would be impossible for her to be talking about all men while she is sleeping with one. Well it would be possible but what does that say about her values. And not all humans are desperate from Fearless alone we know there are humans out their living their best life.

[butterflykyss]

1. But thats what she does about the state of men. "Men think they have a monopoly on indiscretion."
2.He wasn't shown it was a panel of someone speaking to his state of mind, much like Storm did in the last issue of BP.
3. It hasn't centered around Tchalla either but it gave Storm more shine, story, and growth in the issues she appeared than it did the MAIN character of his own book. Gold was a team book, this is a solo.
4. Again it would be impossible for her to be talking about all men while she is sleeping with one. Well it would be possible but what does that say about her values. And not all humans are desperate from Fearless alone we know there are humans out their living their best life.

1. As the Quiet Coucilor mentioned she was speaking in broad strokes. I dont see anything wrong with her delivery.

2. That's not true. Hes shown smiling and thereafter he has a date night with Ororo. They are shown positively in regards to black love. Moreover, he would later encourage ororo to embrace a part of herself she always denied. This reflects how a man should be there for his woman in a positive manner. The things you seek have always been there.

3. No you tried to make an inaccurate comparison to kitty and gold and ororo and black panther. you tried to imply that storm got all the shine in black panther which isnt true. and I disagree about this not centering around him. this has been about his journey in fighting an imperialist wakandan empire, restoring his memories and correcting the war he was indirectly responsible in creating. let's not forget him navigating through the "no one man" story. nevertheless, it may not be the development you want to see but as I mentioned many times before tchalla has to deal with the demons of leaving his sister, the destruction of wakanda and now the creation of this evil empire. he will come out on top but it is much like ororos life death story where she had to lose it all to truly appreciate all of who she is. its the same with this story.

4. contradictions exist in life. and all the time. there are people who condemn homosexuality yet they engage in homosexual behavior. and all humans or men may not feel that way but from ororos perspective they do.

[jwatson]

1. As the Quiet Coucilor mentioned she was speaking in broad strokes. I dont see anything wrong with her delivery.

2. That's not true. Hes shown smiling and thereafter he has a date night with Ororo. They are shown positively in regards to black love. Moreover, he would later encourage ororo to embrace a part of herself she always denied. This reflects how a man should be there for his woman in a positive manner. The things you seek have always been there.

3. No you tried to make an inaccurate comparison to kitty and gold and ororo and black panther. you tried to imply that storm got all the shine in black panther which isnt true. and I disagree about this not centering around him. this has been about his journey in fighting an imperialist wakandan empire, restoring his memories and correcting the war he was indirectly responsible in creating. let's not forget him navigating through the "no one man" story. nevertheless, it may not be the development you want to see but as I mentioned many times before tchalla has to deal with the demons of leaving his sister, the destruction of wakanda and now the creation of this evil empire. he will come out on top but it is much like ororos life death story where she had to lose it all to truly appreciate all of who she is. its the same with this story.

4. contradictions exist in life. and all the time. there are people who condemn homosexuality yet they engage in homosexual behavior. and all humans or men may not feel that way but from ororos perspective they do.

So the ultimate answer is no. In all these years at the helm of BP you can't provide one thing where something positive is said about Tchalla or his character. Not he's a good man without a but. Nothing. Everything you mention is in relation to others not the man himself. Yet you still can't see the problem here. Thats cool. I have a cleared picture on things now. BP's fans have to look at how he treats others to get any insight into the main character of his own book. Ok. But i'm glad you like Hadari Yao and Coates. I'll stick to my Storm.

[butterflykyss]

So the ultimate answer is no. In all these years at the helm of BP you can't provide one thing where something positive is said about Tchalla or his character. Not he's a good man without a but. Nothing. Everything you mention is in relation to others not the man himself. Yet you still can't see the problem here. Thats cool. I have a cleared picture on things now. BP's fans have to look at how he treats others to get any insight into the main character of his own book. Ok. But i'm glad you like Hadari Yao and Coates. I'll stick to my Storm.

incorrect. I found positive things which you chose to ignore because it doesnt fit your narrative which is fine. he chose to be happy and live the life he wanted to live irrespective of his title. how do you not see the positive in that ? but in either case we can agree to disagree (^_^)

[jwatson]

incorrect. I found positive things which you choose to ignore because it doesnt fit your narrative which is fine. he chose to be happy and live the life he wanted to live irrespective of his title. how do you not see the positive in that ? but in either case we can agree to disagree (^_^)

Where is the positive stuff about his character? lol. Where is the one factual statement made that's postive about HIM? That he looks happy. lmao. I hope Storm never gets treated the way you are ok with BP being treated in his own book.

[jwatson]

incorrect. I found positive things which you chose to ignore because it doesnt fit your narrative which is fine. he chose to be happy and live the life he wanted to live irrespective of his title. how do you not see the positive in that ? but in either case we can agree to disagree (^_^)

And quite frankly if Storm wasn't in Coates run you wouldn't be reading it. And once she leaves the book i feel your done with it. And i can't say you would even follow any of his other marvel work so it doesn't feel authentic when you act like he is "Doing that thing." as opposed to fitting the narrative YOU want. but all that is spec on my part but it makes me feel like i waste energy when i even go too far into because i don't think you believe it. But time will tell.

[butterflykyss]

Where is the positive stuff about his character? lol. Where is the one factual statement made that's postive about HIM? That he looks happy. lmao. I hope Storm never gets treated the way you are ok with BP being treated in his own book.

he chose his own path. he didnt allow anyone else to dictate his happiness. how many other ways can I say that? lolol

And if ororo was actually allowed to choose her own path instead of doing whatever Kate or Xavier or Magneto or Emma wanted I think she would be far better off than she is now. Just saying.

And quite frankly if Storm wasn't in Coates run you wouldn't be reading it. And once she leaves the book i feel your done with it. And i can't say you would even follow any of his other marvel work so it doesn't feel authentic when you act like he is "Doing that thing." as opposed to fitting the narrative YOU want. but all that is spec on my part but it makes me feel like i waste energy when i even go too far into because i don't think you believe it. But time will tell.

since you are being frank how about I also do the same. your feelings have no basis in reality as it pertains to me. your feelings have no bearing in what I read or dont read so do not make ill-informed presumptions about me. whether I come across authentic or not is of no relevance. the issue here is that you, for some reason or another, only see the negative aspects of his writing and that is a reflection of you not me.

[jwatson]

since you are being frank how about I also do the same. your feeling have no basis in reality as it pertains to me. your feelings have no bearing in what I read or dont read so do not make ill-informed presumptions about me. whether I come across authentic or not is of no relevance. the issue here is that you, for some reason or another, only see the negative aspects of his writing and that is a reflection on you not me.

Fair enough. I prefer frank anyway. And your right it is a reflection on me and i'm proud of it. So thanks. ^_^ Though it's funny that now that i'm not drinking the kool-aid i've only ever seen the "negative" in his writing. The real you is fun.

[butterflykyss]

Fair enough. I prefer frank anyway. And your right it is a reflection on me and i'm proud of it. So thanks. ^_^ Though it's funny that now that i'm not drinking the kool-aid i've only ever seen the "negative" in his writing. The real you is fun.

it's ok. it's no judgment just an observation. I do not see how you or anyone else can read his entire run and see no positive unless you do not like what he is doing. outside of him leaving the book I dont think he could do anything to please some readers.

Looking forward to reading your opinion on XXM. Hands down one of my fave runs of all time (not perfect but Claremont wrote the hell out of Storm and her team). His Excalibur vol.2 with Octo-Callisto was a good read as well. No Storm but well written for the cast he had. Lol on the AvX BP/Storm post break up scans. As much as I appreciated Aaron noting StormÂ’s martial combat and, escape artist and lock picking skills he should never get his hands on her again lol. She was hella petty (funny & friendly scene though...).

I think Coates, specifically in this last issue, captured StormÂ’s emotional vulnerability and frustrations but also her strength. There is a lot of complicated history between Storm and the men she has loved over the years (BP most of all) so its interesting to read that scene and feel that there is a toll being taken on her.

ooh I will let you know when I get to it. I'm just at issue 314 so I have a good while before I get done with all of the original uncanny run. I'm trying to check out all the main xbooks so im not sure when i will get to excalibur. and baby dont you dare get me started with Aaron. his storm was abysmal lolol but I like to see ororo have a bit of personality and be petty especially when it comes to matters of the heart.

hmmm I never looked at it in this way. do you see her response more of grandstanding??

[jwatson]

it's ok. it's no judgment just an observation. I do not see how you or anyone else can read his entire run and see no positive unless you do not like what he is doing. outside of him leaving the book I dont think he could do anything to please some readers.

more fake narrative. Its okay, the convo is done we can move on. Your false grand assumptions are saying more about you than I. I don't care enough to produce receipts but it's a really weak attempt.

[butterflykyss]

more fake narrative. Its okay, the convo is done we can move on. Your false grand assumptions are saying more about you than I. I don't care enough to produce receipts but it's a really weak attempt.

I answered all your questions with receipts which you didnt think were good enough. lol again, if a man choosing his own path versus allowing his birthright to says volumes in relation to positivity. there are so many men who would benefit from such a message: living and being your authentic self. that is the message I saw from it. however you dont because coates is incapable of depicting men a positive light right? dont even let me get into the conversation with thunderball and tchallas belief he could be something more than a petty henchman.