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  1. #9496
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    Quote Originally Posted by Devaishwarya View Post
    True.
    But...
    If no one else decides to pick up where he left off...all that "development" (in quotes because the writer himself has done absolutely nothing to expand and expound on it, apparently) is just a foot note.
    And honestly...I won't fault HiX-Man or Duggan if they don't address/develop it further in their books simply because it's probably not that important or relevant to they stories they are telling overall.
    That’s true of everyone. If everybody ignored the Weapon X mini by Claremont and BWS, Logan wouldn’t be what he is today.

    I think it’s fair to not like what Coates is doing but faulting him for trying doesn’t make much sense to me.
    Last edited by The Quiet Councilor; 12-10-2019 at 04:38 PM.

  2. #9497
    Everything Fades Away... butterflykyss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by terrancejameson View Post
    No one said they need to reference Hadari Yao. Its Wakandan tongue anyway. Why in the world would anyone on Krakoa outside Nehzno call her that? That would be like Steve Rogers or Tony Stark calling T'Challa "Damisa-Sarki". How ridiculous would that be?

    All the X-books need to do is acknowledge her UNIQUE standing amongst mutants. She's in the same place she was after WAP. Only now she isn't a queen, she's a goddess. That's a title she earned through Wakandan faith, but it's hers by right of blood. She has open access to her mutant pride. How is she being held hostage? She's a black mutant woman in love with a black man, how in any way does that stop her from being developed in the X-books? If I'm not mistaken Moira, Kate, Emma, Jean, Betsy and Kwannon are given a lane.

    I'm kinda over the idea that Yost and Pak didn't take great care to leverage her importance given the changing mutant landscape. X-Men Red was the first X-men team book that paid homage Coates' Storm. Build on the connections she already has and tells stories about that unique perspective. How has Coates stopped Storm from leading that team? If Jean has enough sense to use the resources that are clearly at Ororo's disposal, then either Jean is more intelligent and intuitive than Storm or X-writers aren't really interested in building her the way you believe they are. That's just my opinion.
    again you are asking the hard questions. Jean can reach out to tchalla when she had zero interaction with him up to red but somehow ororo cant seem to even utter his name ?? and boom!!! you said that!!! they dont have interest in her and it's especially clear when you listen to that interview. she was like an afterthought lol.

    but I love how her being a mutant, black woman, and goddess is boring yet her getting dropped kicked on a boat is exciting and invigorating character development. how does hat work?

    Quote Originally Posted by terrancejameson View Post
    I love how many are inadvertently admitting that all Coates has done is have Ororo shot lightning and give speeches. She's a glorified "goddess" without much explanation as to what that really entails. I'll even admit as much.

    What I don't understand is how that small of a narrative as a supporting character in BP's solo could then be leveled as a reasonable explanation for portraying Storm as a leading voice in the mutant community with her own agency? Just so we're clear Coates has opened the door for boring conversations about what it means to be both mutant and black in America, and simultaneously hampering X-writers telling an interesting and believable story about her place in a new mutant nation? Are we being serious?

    It sounds a lot like many may be deathly afraid of that feeling of being left out of Morrison's run. If she can't run with the all white team, then her future endeavors are sure to be grim. I just can't shake the feeling that Storm's character was destined for this fate with or without the marriage. Monet and Bishop cannot be linked to a marriage with BP so what's the excuse for their poor showings?
    omg why are you hitting me with all the hard truths today??? excellent observation as it pertains to Monet and bishop. can you explain what noteworthy thing that ororo has done since dox/hox began that has pushed her character development any further than where she was before the event? she still seems to be background fodder to me.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Quiet Councilor View Post
    I think what some of you are missing is that Coates has added to her mythology in a meaningful way we havenĀ’t seen before. Between Hadari Yao and Blue, heĀ’s given Storm a a heritage and secret history outside of the X & BP. These dual paths play into StormĀ’s own dualities and stem from the two sides of her family. No, he hasnĀ’t fleshed all this out because BP isnĀ’t the place to do it. He has, however, done something nobody has done with the character in 30+ years: heĀ’s said something new.
    can you say this again louder QC!! Yall are really dropping these knowledge bombs today!!!
    Last edited by butterflykyss; 12-10-2019 at 04:09 PM.
    ALL HAIL THE HADARI YAO!!!! NOW AGAIN THE ONE TRUE AND ONLY GODDESS OF THE X-MEN AS CLAREMONT INTENDED!!!!!

  3. #9498
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Quiet Councilor View Post
    That’s true of everyone. If everybody ignore the Weapon X mini by Claremont and BWS, Logan wouldn’t be what he is today.

    I think it’s fair to not like what Coates is doing but faulting him for trying doesn’t make much sense to me.
    This. Especially considering the care he’s taken with her character shames the combined effort of the X-office over the past decade and half. What does Ororo have to show for herself with the X-men since AvX wrapped? The marriage realistically sidelined her in mutant affairs. She was not shown as an active proponent of mutant affairs. I get that. I just don’t understand how any of that matters to the stories available to her now. Jean Grey was able to make Wakanda work for her idea of a better future for mutants. Why wouldn’t Storm do that and more?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Havok83 View Post
    I think he means outside of Wakanda, who's gonna worship Storm? I cant see the X-men sitting around praying to her as that would be a bit much. Nor do I see the average citizen with no concept of the HY or believe in Storm as a god. Its a development with limited practical utilization within the X-books. Like you said, a Storm solo is the best chance that any of this to truly be explored
    Ororo has followers beyond just wakanda. Dont forget the stories of the white haired goddesses first came from within Kenya and who knows who else came to revere her because of this.
    ALL HAIL THE HADARI YAO!!!! NOW AGAIN THE ONE TRUE AND ONLY GODDESS OF THE X-MEN AS CLAREMONT INTENDED!!!!!

  5. #9500
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    I mean what are the xoffices intimidated by? Duggan mentioned that he didnt know about Franklin Richards but I'm most certain the F4 appeared in DoX/HoX. I'm not saying Tchalla is a package deal with Ororo but how she is written it would be as if she hasnt seen Tvhalla since their divorce. There are ways you can acknowledge others work without deviating from your main story. That is how shared universes should work.
    ALL HAIL THE HADARI YAO!!!! NOW AGAIN THE ONE TRUE AND ONLY GODDESS OF THE X-MEN AS CLAREMONT INTENDED!!!!!

  6. #9501
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    Quote Originally Posted by butterflykyss View Post
    again you are asking the hard questions. Jean can reach out to tchalla when she had zero interaction with him up to red but somehow ororo cant seem to even utter his name ?? and boom!!! you said that!!! they dont have interest in her and it's especially clear when you listen to that interview. she was like an afterthought lol.

    but I love how her being a mutant, black woman, and goddess is boring yet her getting dropped kicked on a boat is exciting and invigorating character development. how does hat work?



    omg why are you hitting me with all the hard truths today??? excellent observation as it pertains to Monet and bishop. can you explain what noteworthy thing that ororo has done since dox/hox began that has pushed her character development any further than where she was before the event? she still seems to be background fodder to me.



    can you say this again louder QC!! Yall are really dropping these knowledge bombs today!!!
    I think I understand, my friend. If playing up her BLACK roots is so boring then that must be the reason her solo bombed. Pak had the audacity to open it up with Ororo saving a whole village of black people from a tsunami. Her arrest by the FBI even sparked a crowd. Priest, Pak and Coates crafted stories of little black kids looking up to her. Those are things that stand out to me. None of those runs were the majors sellers that some would have us believe.

    Ororo’s most notable story beats since HOX/DOX got started is her status amongst the omegas and the quiet council. Given that her narrative as a black woman is boring and of no importance, I really don’t see what meaningful diversity she represents in either of those groups. But maybe if Coates wasn’t writing her she could be in more titles welcoming more mutants back to life.

  7. #9502
    Ultimate Member Havok83's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by butterflykyss View Post
    Ororo has followers beyond just wakanda. Dont forget the stories of the white haired goddesses first came from within Kenya and who knows who else came to revere her because of this.
    thats still within Africa and not a setting where X-men stories are typically told. This goes back to the point about this being explored within the pages of BP or a Storm solo

  8. #9503
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    Entertaining! Please, continue this intriguing discussion!


  9. #9504
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marvell2100 View Post
    Entertaining! Please, continue this intriguing discussion!

    You, Petty Son ova ..........
    Ororo Munroe(Bright Lady), Hadari Yao, The Cloud Runner, Goddess of the People.
    Goddess of the Storm.
    #StormsMootyPass
    #PlusUltra!!!
    #StormCaster
    The Piercing Light of AmunRa!!!!!
    MUTANT and PROUD
    #KRAKOA FOREVER

    #catchmutanthands

  10. #9505
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    Quote Originally Posted by stormphoenix View Post
    You, Petty Son ova ..........
    Petty is such a harsh word...but surprisingly apt .

  11. #9506
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    Quote Originally Posted by terrancejameson View Post
    I think I understand, my friend. If playing up her BLACK roots is so boring then that must be the reason her solo bombed.
    I don't that was the main issue.
    Storm suffers from the same issue Cyborg does at DC.
    Over her 40+ years- what stories would be considered the essential Storm centric stories? As a LEAD not the support of co-lead.
    Those stories where you say "YES I am proud to be a Storm fan because of this story right HERE!" Like Cyborg-she does not have that many especially in the late 90s-NOW.

    Now if her book came out the same time as she got married and was a companion book to Panther-like we saw with Tim Drake's Robin while he was in Batman. Panther shows her as a wife and queen and the solo shows her as a mutant/black woman.

    That is your bridge between franchises. There is a HUGE consequence to not fully developing a character especially one of color in team books.

    Also remember there are stores that take issue with SOME black female lead books.

    Some for legit business reasons (they don't sell-an issue that is HUGE with oversea stores)
    Some for racist reasons- Image's Motor Crush says HI.

    So remember that hurts sales. It's starting to change but we have a LONG way to go.

  12. #9507
    Everything Fades Away... butterflykyss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by terrancejameson View Post
    I think I understand, my friend. If playing up her BLACK roots is so boring then that must be the reason her solo bombed. Pak had the audacity to open it up with Ororo saving a whole village of black people from a tsunami. Her arrest by the FBI even sparked a crowd. Priest, Pak and Coates crafted stories of little black kids looking up to her. Those are things that stand out to me. None of those runs were the majors sellers that some would have us believe.

    Ororo’s most notable story beats since HOX/DOX got started is her status amongst the omegas and the quiet council. Given that her narrative as a black woman is boring and of no importance, I really don’t see what meaningful diversity she represents in either of those groups. But maybe if Coates wasn’t writing her she could be in more titles welcoming more mutants back to life.
    right? maybe the thing that isnt boring is running up behind the xmen being their token. of maybe it's her having the title of omega and being on the council while in actuality not having any meaningful impact to the overall direction of mutantkind. I see this with Emma, Sebastian, kitty, cyclops, wolverine, magneto, Xavier.... not so much with ororo. I'm sure you can see the pattern there.

    yea hopefully this will be last of the goddess and interactions in BP so that we can get more of her welcoming newborn mutants like the stereotypical "mammie midwife." I'm also hoping we get a nice serving of drop kicks in the torso too once coates is done with writing her. Her future is so bright within the xoffices!!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Havok83 View Post
    thats still within Africa and not a setting where X-men stories are typically told. This goes back to the point about this being explored within the pages of BP or a Storm solo
    that is not entirely accurate. even though it was a info page the mauraders were passing encrypted hard drives to mutants in Africa. however, I do agree this would be more suited in a mini or ongoing.
    ALL HAIL THE HADARI YAO!!!! NOW AGAIN THE ONE TRUE AND ONLY GODDESS OF THE X-MEN AS CLAREMONT INTENDED!!!!!

  13. #9508
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    Quote Originally Posted by butterflykyss View Post
    right? maybe the thing that isnt boring is running up behind the xmen being their token. of maybe it's her having the title of omega and being on the council while in actuality not having any meaningful impact to the overall direction of mutantkind. I see this with Emma, Sebastian, kitty, cyclops, wolverine, magneto, Xavier.... not so much with ororo. I'm sure you can see the pattern there.

    yea hopefully this will be last of the goddess and interactions in BP so that we can get more of her welcoming newborn mutants like the stereotypical "mammie midwife." I'm also hoping we get a nice serving of drop kicks in the torso too once coates is done with writing her. Her future is so bright within the xoffices!!!!



    that is not entirely accurate. even though it was a info page the mauraders were passing encrypted hard drives to mutants in Africa. however, I do agree this would be more suited in a mini or ongoing.
    Finally, thank you! let me enjoy my drop kicks to the gut. lol. I enjoyed that more than mother ororo acting like she had more than a telepathic education when it comes to schooling scholars on the world they grew up in and was around far longer than she. I'm done with the long speeches that start with, "Let me tell you what i know of..." ends with "And thats what i know of" and i still don't know nothing. lol
    Don't let anyone else hold the candle that lights the way to your future because only you can sustain the flame.

  14. #9509
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    Quote Originally Posted by jwatson View Post
    Finally, thank you! let me enjoy my drop kicks to the gut. lol. I enjoyed that more than mother ororo acting like she had more than a telepathic education when it comes to schooling scholars on the world they grew up in and was around far longer than she.
    Chile to each his on. Coates was actually pretty spot on with her voice. I take it if this bothered you much of the Claremont years and 90s storm you hated too, yes??
    ALL HAIL THE HADARI YAO!!!! NOW AGAIN THE ONE TRUE AND ONLY GODDESS OF THE X-MEN AS CLAREMONT INTENDED!!!!!

  15. #9510
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    Quote Originally Posted by butterflykyss View Post
    Chile to each his on. Coates was actually pretty spot on with her voice. I take it if this bothered you much of the Claremont years and 90s storm you hated too, yes??
    if you say so. the speech and the voice wasn't the same for me but cool. You can act like i wasn't here singing coates praises right along with you all you want for the longest time but *shrugs* some peeps don't know ya when you ain't on they team. lol
    Don't let anyone else hold the candle that lights the way to your future because only you can sustain the flame.

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