Page 632 of 744 FirstFirst ... 132532582622628629630631632633634635636642682732 ... LastLast
Results 9,466 to 9,480 of 11160
  1. #9466
    CBB 4 LIFE Mr MajestiK's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    London
    Posts
    8,212

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Kasper Cole View Post
    Before the first Avengers film Marvel did a good job of crediting T'Challa with the creation of the Quinnjets.
    Yep, they definitely did that in the comics.

    Unfortunately, after the first Iron Man movie, practically all tech advancements in SHIELD and the Avengers were firmly ascribed to Tony Stark.
    Enjoying the camraderie of friends and family is all that matters in the world.

    Mr MajestiK took a short hiatus and the Chaos Bringer was reborn.

  2. #9467
    CBB 4 LIFE Mr MajestiK's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    London
    Posts
    8,212

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Ezyo1000 View Post
    More so T'Challa does akot of on the fly tech or itd vibranium based creations
    Which is all well and good, but in a visual medium where signature weapons, tech and feats associated with strong protagonists and antagonists are important, the lack thereof of same in T'Challa's recognised and established wheelhouse is glaring.

    It's a bit like his much vaunted mastery of multiple martial arts skills and physical prowess which post Hudlin, Liss and Hickman one rarely gets to see on full display.
    Enjoying the camraderie of friends and family is all that matters in the world.

    Mr MajestiK took a short hiatus and the Chaos Bringer was reborn.

  3. #9468
    CBB 4 LIFE Mr MajestiK's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    London
    Posts
    8,212

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    T'Challa wasn't the only one who thought Bucky was guilty. Why do you think there was a worldwide manhunt for the guy? T'Challa is smart but he isn't psychic. There was plenty of evidence to suggest Bucky was guilty.

    As for letting Zemo live, it isn't like the guy went unpunished. If anything, killing Zemo would have been giving the man what he wanted. Letting him live the rest of his days in prison unable to reunite with his family in the afterlife was arguably a better punishment.
    Agreed 100%.
    Enjoying the camraderie of friends and family is all that matters in the world.

    Mr MajestiK took a short hiatus and the Chaos Bringer was reborn.

  4. #9469
    BANNED
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Posts
    718

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr MajestiK View Post
    And when I question the "we" you reference, I do so in the full knowledge that I and many of my peers both on and offline, have always revered the Black women in our lives long before it became faux fashionable to do so.

    Comic book Shuri was never portrayed as a genius level intellect on par with her brother even though she was a Physicist in her own right so there were ZERO reason for Coogler to have stopped T'Challa of one of his primary character traits and splice same onto his sister in the movie.

    The question I clearly posed in my original post was why T'Challa is the only MU character to have lost this particular genius level distinction in his MCU translation, when this has not been the case where the likes of Stark, Banner and even Hank Pym as portrayed within the MCU is concerned.

    It's a posed question that still remains unanswered by anyone currently posting in this thread which in itself, is quite revealing.

    I remain nonplussed as to what point you're attempting to make in relation to T'Challa's interpersonal relationships with the women that have been featured in the BP mythos long before Coates arrived in the scene with his Rape Camps, misogynistic mischaracterising of Wakandan society and overarching Boko Haram type denigration of the BP mythos?

    And I say this for the simple fact, that women were always integral to the BP mythos and portrayed as equal to their male counterparts right from day one in tales, storylines and depictions where known one was thrown under the proverbial bus on some wholly manufactured gender imbalance/conflict that was non-existent prior to Coates ongoing derailment of the BP mythos.

    Most posters familiar with me in this thread no that there is no greater appreciator of Shuri in here than me but here's the thing, I appreciated Shuri for who she was as written by Hudlin, Maberry, (initially) Liss and Hickman when she was clearly portrayed as being fiercely loyal to Wakanda in an uncompromising manner that wasn't even embodied by her own brother post Hudlin.

    T'Challa's masculinity is not in question here as regards his general portrayal in the MU/MCU, it's his depiction as a completely lacklustre background character in his current solo book that remains irksome.

    And as regards the portrayal of the eponymous King in the BP movie when compared to his initial introduction to the MCU via Captain America: Civil War, I'm going to boldly state that apart from the beginning of the BP movie wherein I personally felt T'Challa was portrayed very well, the rest was pure milquetoast moreso for the fact, that I found every other supporting cast member than the main character, a lot more compelling and relevant to the overall movie.

    I've never felt that way about any other comicbook character portrayed in movies other than Blade when he was put all back of the bus behind Ryan Reynolds character and the Nightstalkers in the Blade:Trinity movie.
    You're absolutely free to question my use of "we" in regards to accepting, appreciating and/or revering the black women in your life. I admire every single black man that does so. There's more to that story tho. And it's also the reason I emphasize community the way I do. This next part doesn't exactly apply to you, but given the turn of the discussion, it's worth mentioning. There's a reason I reference modern day hip hop the way I do as well.

    I consider Hip Hop modern day mentralsy. From the rampant use of "kill these niggas", "bitches ain't shit" or "pop a pill culture" there's very little regard for the black women some of these men (not all) try and pursue. There's even less regard for the women that are deemed unattractive. I say it all to say that many claim to have regard for black women until she has an opinion. The minute some black women start voicing opinions that don't quite fall in line with whatever man feels entitled to their loyalty, then the words against said black woman turns hostile. For this next part of our discussion, a closer examination of the rapper known as T.I. offers up the perfect segway.

    He claims to be part of the new wave of old school rappers. He's a married man with a black family, raising black children. There's no taking that away from him. He's raising black sons and black daughters. I can only assume he loves them unconditionally. I honestly believe he respects and reveres the black women in his life. He just recently was under fire for suggesting that he accompanies his daughter to the gynecologist to make sure she's still a virgin. I cannot speak to his real motivations. His wording is what's problematic. The implications behind his statement could be taken completely the wrong way, but have no way of knowing his relationship with his daughter. No way. What I do know is that his words came across possessive of her virginity in a way that was NOT applied to his sons.

    It's important that I stress just how much I don't know his relationship with his two daughters or his wife, mother or sister. However, I'm well aware of his relationship and interactions with miss Candace Owens. In case you are unaware as to what interactions I'm specifically referencing, I'm talking about the revolt summit. That's where T.I. got up on stage, showed his ass and highlighted just how much respect he feels black women that disagree with actually deserve. This supposed meeting of black minds across the spectrum was designed to show differing opinions in the black community, but its main purpose was to find a way to take a little piece of everyone and apply it in a way that benefits OUR majority.

    I'm not one that easily falls for negative stereotypes and/or white supremacist propaganda when it comes to the black family. The revolt summit wasn't meant for any of that. It was supposed to be for US, by US and speaking directly to US. No one tricked or bamboozled T.I. into behaving the way he did. He had no shortage of ignorant people in the audience cheering and applauding his behavior. The real kicker is Killer Mike had to shut him and the ignorant asses in the audience. Only through Killer Mike's beautiful retort were we able to get a greater sense of clarity on why many of the things Candace says have merit. She frequently regurgitates talking points from the great Minister Farrakhan, but most hip hop heads and fans of T.I. wouldn't know that. Candace wasn't completely sure. Killer Mike had to enlighten her as well. She herself was unaware of the connections he was ready to highlight. He did so with respect tho, T.I. absolutely did not.

    The point I was making in reference to T'Challa's interpersonal relationships with the women in his life is that he's most notably NOT that. He's more of a Killer Mike type of black man. Both in the movie and his current solo, THAT is the type of man that I see. Hopefully that better explains what I'm talking about.

    Whatever your point was about T'Challa losing certain qualities just because Shuri is shown to rival him, I'm sure I still don't understand it. I'm a firm believer that men and women that behave in the manner I described towards other black people that disagree with them don't actually champion black people the way they believe themselves to. I personally couldn't be happier that my idea of T'Challa falls much more in line with his current comic and movie portrayals.

  5. #9470
    Extraordinary Member Ezyo1000's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Posts
    7,930

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr MajestiK View Post
    Which is all well and good, but in a visual medium where signature weapons, tech and feats associated with strong protagonists and antagonists are important, the lack thereof of same in T'Challa's recognised and established wheelhouse is glaring.

    It's a bit like his much vaunted mastery of multiple martial arts skills and physical prowess which post Hudlin, Liss and Hickman one rarely gets to see on full display.
    I agree with the tech thing that there needs to be a highlight of it. My solution is actually very simple. If he doesn't have time to be in the lab creating tech then play on the scene between him and Shuri from the first movie.

    T'Challa: "Shuri, I made some upgrades and added some additional features to the habit. I'm uploading the schematics to your kimoyo beads now."

    Shuri: "Upgrades? Additional features?? The habit works perfectly though.

    T'Challa: "How many times do I have to teach you that just because something works doesn't mean it cannot be improved?"

    Shuri: "Hey hey, don't you use my saying against me. I taught that to you!

    Enter more banter between the two. But it's a very simple solution. It showcases T'Challas genius without having to have him in the lab. Or that same scene could take place in her lab with T'Challa working in it himself. Either way I think it would be ba fun call back and running joke between them with them playfully trying to outdo each other

  6. #9471
    Extraordinary Member Ezyo1000's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Posts
    7,930

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by terrancejameson View Post
    You're absolutely free to question my use of "we" in regards to accepting, appreciating and/or revering the black women in your life. I admire every single black man that does so. There's more to that story tho. And it's also the reason I emphasize community the way I do. This next part doesn't exactly apply to you, but given the turn of the discussion, it's worth mentioning. There's a reason I reference modern day hip hop the way I do as well.

    I consider Hip Hop modern day mentralsy. From the rampant use of "kill these niggas", "bitches ain't shit" or "pop a pill culture" there's very little regard for the black women some of these men (not all) try and pursue. There's even less regard for the women that are deemed unattractive. I say it all to say that many claim to have regard for black women until she has an opinion. The minute some black women start voicing opinions that don't quite fall in line with whatever man feels entitled to their loyalty, then the words against said black woman turns hostile. For this next part of our discussion, a closer examination of the rapper known as T.I. offers up the perfect segway.

    He claims to be part of the new wave of old school rappers. He's a married man with a black family, raising black children. There's no taking that away from him. He's raising black sons and black daughters. I can only assume he loves them unconditionally. I honestly believe he respects and reveres the black women in his life. He just recently was under fire for suggesting that he accompanies his daughter to the gynecologist to make sure she's still a virgin. I cannot speak to his real motivations. His wording is what's problematic. The implications behind his statement could be taken completely the wrong way, but have no way of knowing his relationship with his daughter. No way. What I do know is that his words came across possessive of her virginity in a way that was NOT applied to his sons.

    It's important that I stress just how much I don't know his relationship with his two daughters or his wife, mother or sister. However, I'm well aware of his relationship and interactions with miss Candace Owens. In case you are unaware as to what interactions I'm specifically referencing, I'm talking about the revolt summit. That's where T.I. got up on stage, showed his ass and highlighted just how much respect he feels black women that disagree with actually deserve. This supposed meeting of black minds across the spectrum was designed to show differing opinions in the black community, but its main purpose was to find a way to take a little piece of everyone and apply it in a way that benefits OUR majority.

    I'm not one that easily falls for negative stereotypes and/or white supremacist propaganda when it comes to the black family. The revolt summit wasn't meant for any of that. It was supposed to be for US, by US and speaking directly to US. No one tricked or bamboozled T.I. into behaving the way he did. He had no shortage of ignorant people in the audience cheering and applauding his behavior. The real kicker is Killer Mike had to shut him and the ignorant asses in the audience. Only through Killer Mike's beautiful retort were we able to get a greater sense of clarity on why many of the things Candace says have merit. She frequently regurgitates talking points from the great Minister Farrakhan, but most hip hop heads and fans of T.I. wouldn't know that. Candace wasn't completely sure. Killer Mike had to enlighten her as well. She herself was unaware of the connections he was ready to highlight. He did so with respect tho, T.I. absolutely did not.

    [U]The point I was making in reference to T'Challa's interpersonal relationships with the women in his life is that he's most notably NOT that. He's more of a Killer Mike type of black man. Both in the movie and his current solo, THAT is the type of man that I see. Hopefully that better explains what I'm talking about.

    Whatever your point was about T'Challa losing certain qualities just because Shuri is shown to rival him, I'm sure I still don't understand it. I'm a firm believer that men and women that behave in the manner I described towards other black people that disagree with them don't actually champion black people the way they believe themselves to. I personally couldn't be happier that my idea of T'Challa falls much more in line with his current comic and movie portrayals.[u/]
    Thing is, that's already been a thing in his solo. Coates isn't doing any new groundbreaking work because T'Challa has always been like that. Since the start BP has always treated women with respect, women were equals to men. Coates actually started the whole women are being treated as lesser then went on to "fix" it. A problem that he created for his story that went against the mythos established continuity.

    As for the movie, I get why they made Shuri a genius, and I am fine with that. Given what Okoye and Nakia were about, Shuri needed something to make her stand out from those two, however, that does not mean that T'Challa can't have scene's that highlight his genius brain.

    We got a snippet with the beads and the habit comments in the movie but I would like to see more. Reread my above comment on a fun way to integrate his genius without taking anything away from Shuri and giving them both shine.

    Ultimately, I understand what your trying to say about respecting Black women, and I agree that there should be more of it and more praise to black women as well. I don't agree however, with this notion that the only way tondo that, is by Black men being used as a stepping stool to do so because that another issue that happens, where black men and women are pitted against one another because people act like they both can't shine together. One has to look like isht to make the other look good.

  7. #9472
    Astonishing Member Cville's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Posts
    4,275

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr MajestiK View Post
    So in your opinion, what are the defining characteristics that make up T'Challa's character and overall background?

    And for arguments sake, how does T'Challa's apparently acceptable lack of self generated personal technology play into the hands of non-fans who love to diminish his character as a matter of course?
    In the words of Shannon Sharpe " He's the King"!! Lol. But for me his genius isnt big for me because like Stark, Reed, and Moongirl, it's natural intelligence. He didnt have to struggle to learn, it came easy. I feel his important characteristics are his reagalness, leadership, honor, dignity, and the confidence which he carries himself. Those are attributes that can be achieved and replicated by his fans. That's why the poor decision making from post Liss forward are so glaring.

    From what I've seen unfans dont go after his tech. They go after the failings from my list of attributes above.

  8. #9473
    Extraordinary Member Ezyo1000's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Posts
    7,930

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Cville View Post
    In the words of Shannon Sharpe " He's the King"!! Lol. But for me his genius isnt big for me because like Stark, Reed, and Moongirl, it's natural intelligence. He didnt have to struggle to learn, it came easy. I feel his important characteristics are his reagalness, leadership, honor, dignity, and the confidence which he carries himself. Those are attributes that can be achieved and replicated by his fans. That's why the poor decision making from post Liss forward are so glaring.

    From what I've seen unfans dont go after his tech. They go after the failings from my list of attributes above.
    I would add his Characteristics also include being the shrewdest man alive, always being prepared, and looking at the big picture. He is a tech genius but his highlights come From using the tech he has already created in an unorthodox manner (shutting down a helicopter with the daggers as a thrown emp, transporting Monica through the kimoyo card) or using common products to beat advanced tech (Windex against starks suit) as well as his scientific stuff.

    He can keep up with Reed, Stark and the like no problem but he doesn't rely on tech like they do. It's an extension of himself like a sword, instead of a crutch or a suit of armor

  9. #9474
    Incredible Member KingNomarch's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2017
    Posts
    580

    Default

    Avengers: Endgame Cut a Black Panther Fight Scene From the Finale

    "We didn’t really shuffle it around a lot. I remember we did have a much more elaborate sequence with [Thanos’s henchman, Ebony] Maw," Ford told /Film. "His battle with Panther was longer. I remember we took it down because when they come through the portals, they kind of introduce all these characters into the story that haven’t been in the movie yet…Panther and Maw felt like, that’s not the story that we’re tracking, so maybe we reduce that stuff."
    https://www.cbr.com/avengers-endgame...ne-cut-finale/

    I feel that we were robbed of something that could've been great.
    Last edited by KingNomarch; 11-07-2019 at 07:34 AM.

  10. #9475
    Mighty Member dkrook's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    Pittsburgh
    Posts
    1,163

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by KingNomarch View Post
    Avengers: Endgame Cut a Black Panther Fight Scene From the Finale



    https://www.cbr.com/avengers-endgame...ne-cut-finale/

    I feel that we were robbed of something that could've been great.
    Lol, hell yes! You beat me to it. I thought this was criminal think of how this could have displayed just how good Panther is to battle and defeat above his punching weight class. Simultaneously it sets T'challa up as the new central figure of the next phase, while feeding the growing hype around him. Seriously I loved the movie but there was so much chew in it that didn't even need to be included, and they made a decision to leave THIS out?? Just makes one question why is the first impulse to diminish an alpha black Male character. I say this even though Panther's portal entry scene gave me goosebumps, what better way to follow it up with him getting his own fight scene. Narrative wise it would have made sense just due to getting payback for invading his country first.

  11. #9476
    Fantastic Member Klaue's Mixtape's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2018
    Posts
    464

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by terrancejameson View Post
    When I say ďweĒ itís more of an acknowledgement that WE as a culture are not ready to acknowledge the greatness of the black female form. With all due respect, this post of yours goes a long way to reinforcing my beliefs. Iím not sure how the sudden emergence of Shuriís genius level intellect would somehow suggest that that aspect of TíChallaís essence was stripped away? How did you come to that conclusion? I certainly didnít. The king I saw was more than capable of keeping up with his little sister in the science lab. Why does Shuriís new station appear to infringe upon TíChallaís in your opinion? Iím not saying that we couldnít use more emphasis on his brand of genius level intellectual flexing, but Iím also not going to say that it was completely absent from the movie.

    I need to bring the focus back to Nakia for a bit. In order to fully accept and acknowledge her place of importance in MCU Wakanda, itís vital that we highlight that HERS is the only viewpoint that allowed for TíChalla is take the moral high ground away from Erik Killmonger. Only through Nakiaís guidance, his reverence for her and the wisdom to open his heart and follow her are we then able to truly see his genius at play. Nakia and Killmonger both have the same plan, but Erikís is a twisted version designed to bring out the ugly side of Wakanda. Nakiaís plan is to highlight Wakandaís beauty.

    MCU TíChalla speaks to me because his sense of community informs his actions. Heís a man that wants to see the best in the people around him, but his brain wonít allow him to ignore that ugliness that comes along with human nature. We literally see the boy in him die as he loses that child like reverence for his father. He becomes a man as he sees his father as a deeply flawed man thatís worked his whole life trying to be a good king.

    Ultimately, I believe MCU TíChalla has no peer because of the way that he champions his community. I honestly believe that was Cooglerís critique on black people as a whole, he just didnít hit us over the head with it. The women are important because they hold up every aspect of society. First we have Bast, the great goddess and the most divine female form and clear proof the god is a black woman. Okoye and the Doraís are the warrior essence and the teeth of Wakanda. Shuri was Wakandaís innovative spiritual essence. And Nakia represents the warmth, the heart and the nurturing side of Wakanda. TíChalla the imperfect man and impeccable king is made richer for the wealth of women in his life and the sense of community he possesses. Heís not worried about flexing on fools and ďone-upping a niggaĒ,. Neither is he bent on seeing a man that looks like him and being overcome with a powerful urge to kill this reflection of himself before it does the same to him. Heís not on his American hip hop shit that glorifies moving outta the hood (and away from the community) only to move into neighborhoods that have been redlined specifically to keep them out. He also isnít the type of black man that blindly turns twists himself into a pretzel to over the idea of appearing masculine. It all just radiates off him because heís being himself, he isnít being this idea of what society says he should be. To me he represents all for one and one for all. MCU TíChalla is all about building up his community in Wakanda and the disenfranchised across America. He still had the presence of mind to honor his cousin by giving back to HIS community.

    That last part is especially poignant with MU TíChalla with the way me made Wakanda a beacon and safe haven for black heroes all over the MU. I may not be the best judge of character, but Iím pretty sure the white majority that Coates supposedly caters to would be hard pressed to highlight these aspects of Damisa-Sarki.
    This is a really great post. Even if don't 100% agree with it.


    Also people overlook what Coogler did with Okoye/W'Kabi/Killmonger.

    Killmonger kills his girlfriend in order to carry out his plans for Wakanda.
    Okoye willing to kill her husband FOR Wakanda (yet there is still some restraint because she was raised in a place of love)
    W'Kabi traumatized by his parents death just like Killmonger. Yet, it was the image of black men and women destroying each other that made him put down his weapon.


    The writing of this movie was very deep. Didn't have the perfect execution in how it was shot, lit, CGI, etc.

  12. #9477
    CBB 4 LIFE Mr MajestiK's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    London
    Posts
    8,212

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by terrancejameson View Post
    You're absolutely free to question my use of "we" in regards to accepting, appreciating and/or revering the black women in your life. I admire every single black man that does so. There's more to that story tho. And it's also the reason I emphasize community the way I do. This next part doesn't exactly apply to you, but given the turn of the discussion, it's worth mentioning. There's a reason I reference modern day hip hop the way I do as well.

    I consider Hip Hop modern day mentralsy. From the rampant use of "kill these niggas", "bitches ain't shit" or "pop a pill culture" there's very little regard for the black women some of these men (not all) try and pursue. There's even less regard for the women that are deemed unattractive. I say it all to say that many claim to have regard for black women until she has an opinion. The minute some black women start voicing opinions that don't quite fall in line with whatever man feels entitled to their loyalty, then the words against said black woman turns hostile. For this next part of our discussion, a closer examination of the rapper known as T.I. offers up the perfect segway.

    He claims to be part of the new wave of old school rappers. He's a married man with a black family, raising black children. There's no taking that away from him. He's raising black sons and black daughters. I can only assume he loves them unconditionally. I honestly believe he respects and reveres the black women in his life. He just recently was under fire for suggesting that he accompanies his daughter to the gynecologist to make sure she's still a virgin. I cannot speak to his real motivations. His wording is what's problematic. The implications behind his statement could be taken completely the wrong way, but have no way of knowing his relationship with his daughter. No way. What I do know is that his words came across possessive of her virginity in a way that was NOT applied to his sons.

    It's important that I stress just how much I don't know his relationship with his two daughters or his wife, mother or sister. However, I'm well aware of his relationship and interactions with miss Candace Owens. In case you are unaware as to what interactions I'm specifically referencing, I'm talking about the revolt summit. That's where T.I. got up on stage, showed his ass and highlighted just how much respect he feels black women that disagree with actually deserve. This supposed meeting of black minds across the spectrum was designed to show differing opinions in the black community, but its main purpose was to find a way to take a little piece of everyone and apply it in a way that benefits OUR majority.

    I'm not one that easily falls for negative stereotypes and/or white supremacist propaganda when it comes to the black family. The revolt summit wasn't meant for any of that. It was supposed to be for US, by US and speaking directly to US. No one tricked or bamboozled T.I. into behaving the way he did. He had no shortage of ignorant people in the audience cheering and applauding his behavior. The real kicker is Killer Mike had to shut him and the ignorant asses in the audience. Only through Killer Mike's beautiful retort were we able to get a greater sense of clarity on why many of the things Candace says have merit. She frequently regurgitates talking points from the great Minister Farrakhan, but most hip hop heads and fans of T.I. wouldn't know that. Candace wasn't completely sure. Killer Mike had to enlighten her as well. She herself was unaware of the connections he was ready to highlight. He did so with respect tho, T.I. absolutely did not.

    The point I was making in reference to T'Challa's interpersonal relationships with the women in his life is that he's most notably NOT that. He's more of a Killer Mike type of black man. Both in the movie and his current solo, THAT is the type of man that I see. Hopefully that better explains what I'm talking about.

    Whatever your point was about T'Challa losing certain qualities just because Shuri is shown to rival him, I'm sure I still don't understand it. I'm a firm believer that men and women that behave in the manner I described towards other black people that disagree with them don't actually champion black people the way they believe themselves to. I personally couldn't be happier that my idea of T'Challa falls much more in line with his current comic and movie portrayals.
    My dude, where do I start with responding to this post of yours?

    Okay, now here's the thing, as brother Ezyo and myself have already pointed out, the BP thread has been totally devoid of animosity towards females in general and black females in particular, dating back to the very first BP Appreciation thread.

    No one who's spent time over the years posting in BP appreciation threads herein, has ever exhibited any kind of disrespect towards female characters within the BP mythos, so I can't for the life of me understand why you seem to be on some sort of crusade to champion respect for sisters in here as if it's something brand new.

    What does TI or whatever shenanigans that occur within the HipHop wor,d got to do with T'Challa as King of Wakanda in particular or the BP mythos in general?

    And to make matters worse, please tell me that you weren't attempting to paint Candace Owens as being some kind of shrinking violet damsel in distress being menaced by big, bad TI?

    Candace Owen's, one of the biggest trolls in the known universe?

    Really?

    Let's just stick to debating BP here and leave all these unnecessary detours where they belong.

    My point regarding T'Challa having the genius level intellect of his character stripped away or downplayed for the sole purpose of splicing same onto Shuri to supposedly give her more prominence within the movie, stands solid and immovable for the simple fact that as I pointed out previously, no other MCU character has been nerfed in a similar manner.

    I'm not sure what aspect of this fact, you're finding hard to comprehend.

    And after almost said and done, T'Challa still remains milquetoast under Coates pen.
    Last edited by Mr MajestiK; 11-07-2019 at 11:36 AM.
    Enjoying the camraderie of friends and family is all that matters in the world.

    Mr MajestiK took a short hiatus and the Chaos Bringer was reborn.

  13. #9478
    Mighty Member Blind Wedjat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2016
    Posts
    1,723

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    T'Challa wasn't the only one who thought Bucky was guilty. Why do you think there was a worldwide manhunt for the guy? T'Challa is smart but he isn't psychic. There was plenty of evidence to suggest Bucky was guilty.

    As for letting Zemo live, it isn't like the guy went unpunished. If anything, killing Zemo would have been giving the man what he wanted. Letting him live the rest of his days in prison unable to reunite with his family in the afterlife was arguably a better punishment.
    I'm gonna argue that there was no real good reason why Bucky would have killed T'Chaka, even though there was evidence to suggest it.

    The only thing the world knew about Wakanda was that it was an isolationist, Third-world country that had lost all of its tiny amount of Vibranium after it was stolen by Klaue and used up by Ultron. As far as the world was concerned, Wakanda was a backwards banana republic that didn't know what to do with the strongest metal on Earth, still operating under a monarchy, were arrogant enough to refuse aid and was inaccessible. T'Chaka was just beginning to crack the isolationist policy by sending Wakandan scientists to Lagos and supporting the Sokovia Accords. He wasn't important by any means. He wasn't vital in getting the Accords passed.

    Why would anyone want to kill him?

    Let us consider how the intelligence community should have handled this (keeping in mind Natasha had released SHIELD's files to the public). If Bucky was indeed the culprit, why would he want to kill T'Chaka? If he was acting as a lone wolf, why would he do it? He had no known history with Wakanda. If he was acting under Hydra, why would they do it? They knew nothing of Wakanda, nor was it a threat. The only reason Hydra would have wanted T'Chaka dead is if they knew what Wakanda possessed and if they saw that as a threat. We know they didn't (because nobody found out after the files were leaked).

    There should have been doubt of motive. If the world intelligence community wasn't going to see that, then Wakanda should have. T'Challa should have, but he doesn't because the movie needed him to be angry. Which is fine, but I'm not going to act like that's how T'Challa acts in the comics. And I'm not going to act like the Russos or Markus and McFeely somehow get the character better than Coogler when at every opportunity they have had to present him as one of the smartest individuals in his universe, they have failed to do so again and again. I think T'Challa is a very well written character in both films (as I pride well written characters over comic book accurate characters), but if we're going to argue about which was more T'Challa or which was a better character, I'm seriously going to disagree with the answer being the one from Civil War. The only things I'd praise regarding the character in that are Chadwick's performance (which doesn't get enough praise for how nuanced it has been throughout) and how his fighting style was invented.

    You want to talk about being accurate, where the hell were his enhanced senses in that film? Bucky literally vanished from him during their second fight when T'Challa should have been able to track him. Where was his advanced technology? If he was attempting to kill one of the most feared assassins in the world he should have been prepared. Where was his deductive reasoning? He only found out Zemo killed T'Chaka because he followed Iron Man to Serbia with the intention of killing Bucky (again).

    Regarding Zemo, T'Chaka and 11 others were killed, but going with the film's dialogue he seemed to be the most important figure (as he was the intended target). He should have been given to Wakanda at the end of the film if T'Challa wasn't going to kill him. This probably didn't happen because the Russos nor Feige had any plans to turn Zemo into a Black Panther villain. And why should they, really? "He killed my father because he wanted the world's premier superhero team to fight each other!" is a pretty weak gripe to have with a villain from a storytelling perspective, and I'd argue such a disrespectful crime should be punished by death. And even if that's what Zemo wanted, I'd argue he would have wanted to die by his own hands.

    But my larger point is that the MCU did not prepare for T'Challa's arrival properly. Too many things were taken away from his mythos. Klaue was his arch nemesis, but by taken away how he lost his arm and changing who killed T'Chaka and when, he's merely an annoyance. Which is why I think Coogler killed him off because he had been severely neutered by other writers. You would think given how many complain about how writers have been handling the mythos in comics lately more people would see this. Yet I seem to be the only one that does.

    Which is why I can say that as an MCU fan the ending of the Infinity Saga is bittersweet, but as a BP fan I'm glad it's over. Because now, T'Challa can actually lead this universe, rather than follow, play second fiddle to others and make-do with what has been thrown his way.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr MajestiK View Post
    So in your opinion, what are the defining characteristics that make up T'Challa's character and overall background?

    And for arguments sake, how does T'Challa's apparently acceptable lack of self generated personal technology play into the hands of non-fans who love to diminish his character as a matter of course?
    I don't think the bolded is the way to think about this (though I understand it of course). The idea should always be thinking about what would make T'Challa a great character, not what can be used to one-up salty haters.

    Regarding the first question, I've always asserted T'Challa is a warrior above everything else. It is the idea that he is a warrior that should frame every other facet of his being. Everything he has been taught has been applied to making him Wakanda's best warrior (and as a result, their chosen king because it is determined through combat). Yes, T'Challa is often more liberal than past BPs because he genuinely believes he can help make the world a better place, but he understands that there will always be threats and those with nefarious intentions. Thus he has to make that balance which leads to conflict.

    Therefore T'Challa uses and understands how advanced technology works to be a better warrior and protector of Wakanda. He does not use it to compensate for what he may lack as a fighter (because he lacks almost nothing), as a thinker (because he's that smart) or as a leader. He uses it to complement his abilities instead.

    I mean ask yourself, why is that T'Challa as an inventor hasn't stuck or gone anywhere significant, but him as an outsmarter, an excellent strategist, tactician and fighter has?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cville View Post
    In the words of Shannon Sharpe " He's the King"!! Lol. But for me his genius isnt big for me because like Stark, Reed, and Moongirl, it's natural intelligence. He didnt have to struggle to learn, it came easy. I feel his important characteristics are his reagalness, leadership, honor, dignity, and the confidence which he carries himself. Those are attributes that can be achieved and replicated by his fans. That's why the poor decision making from post Liss forward are so glaring.

    From what I've seen unfans dont go after his tech. They go after the failings from my list of attributes above.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ezyo1000 View Post
    I would add his Characteristics also include being the shrewdest man alive, always being prepared, and looking at the big picture. He is a tech genius but his highlights come From using the tech he has already created in an unorthodox manner (shutting down a helicopter with the daggers as a thrown emp, transporting Monica through the kimoyo card) or using common products to beat advanced tech (Windex against starks suit) as well as his scientific stuff.

    He can keep up with Reed, Stark and the like no problem but he doesn't rely on tech like they do. It's an extension of himself like a sword, instead of a crutch or a suit of armor
    And cosign is all I have to say. Lol.

  14. #9479
    CBB 4 LIFE Mr MajestiK's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    London
    Posts
    8,212

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Ezyo1000 View Post
    I agree with the tech thing that there needs to be a highlight of it. My solution is actually very simple. If he doesn't have time to be in the lab creating tech then play on the scene between him and Shuri from the first movie.

    T'Challa: "Shuri, I made some upgrades and added some additional features to the habit. I'm uploading the schematics to your kimoyo beads now."

    Shuri: "Upgrades? Additional features?? The habit works perfectly though.

    T'Challa: "How many times do I have to teach you that just because something works doesn't mean it cannot be improved?"

    Shuri: "Hey hey, don't you use my saying against me. I taught that to you!

    Enter more banter between the two. But it's a very simple solution. It showcases T'Challas genius without having to have him in the lab. Or that same scene could take place in her lab with T'Challa working in it himself. Either way I think it would be ba fun call back and running joke between them with them playfully trying to outdo each other
    Beautiful post my brother.
    Enjoying the camraderie of friends and family is all that matters in the world.

    Mr MajestiK took a short hiatus and the Chaos Bringer was reborn.

  15. #9480
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    21,530

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Blind Wedjat View Post
    I'm gonna argue that there was no real good reason why Bucky would have killed T'Chaka, even though there was evidence to suggest it.

    The only thing the world knew about Wakanda was that it was an isolationist, Third-world country that had lost all of its tiny amount of Vibranium after it was stolen by Klaue and used up by Ultron. As far as the world was concerned, Wakanda was a backwards banana republic that didn't know what to do with the strongest metal on Earth, still operating under a monarchy, were arrogant enough to refuse aid and was inaccessible. T'Chaka was just beginning to crack the isolationist policy by sending Wakandan scientists to Lagos and supporting the Sokovia Accords. He wasn't important by any means. He wasn't vital in getting the Accords passed.

    Why would anyone want to kill him?

    Let us consider how the intelligence community should have handled this (keeping in mind Natasha had released SHIELD's files to the public). If Bucky was indeed the culprit, why would he want to kill T'Chaka? If he was acting as a lone wolf, why would he do it? He had no known history with Wakanda. If he was acting under Hydra, why would they do it? They knew nothing of Wakanda, nor was it a threat. The only reason Hydra would have wanted T'Chaka dead is if they knew what Wakanda possessed and if they saw that as a threat. We know they didn't (because nobody found out after the files were leaked).
    As you yourself point out below, T’Chaka wasn’t the only one killed and it wasn’t so much that he was the main target as he was just one of many who died in the explosion. T’Challa didn’t care about why T’Chaka was killed only who actually did it and all signs pointed to Bucky whom as far the world knew was still the infamous Winter Soldier and the man whom Captain America failed to capture.
    And I can’t think of many people who would start thinking like an intelligence agent when their parent is killed. Even if they are superheroes.
    And I'm not going to act like the Russos or Markus and McFeely somehow get the character better than Coogler when at every opportunity they have had to present him as one of the smartest individuals in his universe, they have failed to do so again and again. I think T'Challa is a very well written character in both films (as I pride well written characters over comic book accurate characters), but if we're going to argue about which was more T'Challa or which was a better character, I'm seriously going to disagree with the answer being the one from Civil War. The only things I'd praise regarding the character in that are Chadwick's performance (which doesn't get enough praise for how nuanced it has been throughout) and how his fighting style was invented.
    For the record, I don’t believe the Russos or Markus and McFeely got T’Challa better than Coogler did. I just wanted to point out there are believable reasons for T’Challa to go after Bucky.

    Regarding Zemo, T'Chaka and 11 others were killed, but going with the film's dialogue he seemed to be the most important figure (as he was the intended target). He should have been given to Wakanda at the end of the film if T'Challa wasn't going to kill him. This probably didn't happen because the Russos nor Feige had any plans to turn Zemo into a Black Panther villain. And why should they, really? "He killed my father because he wanted the world's premier superhero team to fight each other!" is a pretty weak gripe to have with a villain from a storytelling perspective, and I'd argue such a disrespectful crime should be punished by death. And even if that's what Zemo wanted, I'd argue he would have wanted to die by his own hands.
    That’s my point; by denying Zemo what he wanted he was truly punished. And you yourself stated that the rest of the world doesn’t know much about Wakanda or think it is very important so why would they care about its leader being killed over the numerous others that died in the explosion Zemo set off?

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •