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  1. #9751
    Astonishing Member Cville's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skyvolt2000 View Post
    A comic book store near my school is doing any book Before November 2019 is a dollar. Now through Wednesday.

    Would it be worth trying any of the BP lead books? Since they are a dollar.

    And no Shuri, Killmonger, BP vs Deadpool or Rise of Panther is there-all sold out.

    I think they did this sale to get rid of all those X-book, Legion, Superman & Batman books.
    Ghost Panther was good. The second Avengers arc.

  2. #9752
    The Professional Marvell2100's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DigiCom View Post
    For me, that's the crux of the matter. Frankly, straight super-heroics bore me, and have for some time, which is why I don't bother with Avengers or any of their subsidiary books.

    Gimme something _different_, and you'll get my custom. Right now, the book just isn't that interesting to me.

    (This may be because, unlike many of my BPAT brothers, I don't get excited over "feats". Or maybe I'm just jaded. )
    I can understand that part .

    It shouldn't be just feats only. But that's where I lay the blame on the solo. Coates has done nothing with T'Challa as far as characterization or feats. If anything he's taken steps backwards. Everyone else gets some kind of development or they move forward. He did it with his pet characters which no one cared about because the book isn't about them.

    T'Challa outside of his solo should be about 70% feats and 30% characterization. I'm not saying no character development but major stuff should not occur outside the solo. Any major character development should come from his solo and any other titles should take the characterizations cues from the solo and do majority feats, just like they do with Steve, Tony, Thor etc.

    Except, in this case, Coates has done such a crappy job on the solo that everyone else is just ignoring his stuff which is a good thing.


  3. #9753
    Invincible Member XPac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DigiCom View Post
    Then don't call it an espionage book?
    Really, in a comic book context an espionage book basically just means you have super heroes working for the government.

  4. #9754
    Be Seeing You… DigiCom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cville View Post
    But if you add Kirby too it doesn't that imply it wont be secret mission style? More like weird and crazy missions.
    Kirby did all sorts of weird isht, including the pre-Steranko Nick Fury stuff. He even did some work on a Prisoner graphic novel.

    Quote Originally Posted by XPac View Post
    Really, in a comic book context an espionage book basically just means you have super heroes working for the government.
    I disagree. It's only creative laziness that reduces everything to heroes punching villains (or, more recently, heroes punching other heroes). A smart writer can pen a story that does both… the Warren Ellis run on Secret Avengers had some nice examples, IIRC.

  5. #9755
    The Professional Marvell2100's Avatar
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    Honestly, I don't think it's a matter of being starved for good stories, I think it's as simple as the solo being a failure. I don't think there's anything wrong with AoW, it's a fun action book like Zub said.

    The problem is that the solo is such a frak-fest that people are looking elsewhere for development and characterization of BP and Wakanda and they don't see it in AoW. Which imo shouldn't be the case.

    If WoW wasn't the bomb that it was, handled it's premise better than the stupid plot of Two Wakandan Girls in New York, then that could have been the perfect complimentary book to a BP solo. Neither Coates nor his friends should ever be given a BP book to write again.

  6. #9756
    Be Seeing You… DigiCom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marvell2100 View Post
    Honestly, I don't think it's a matter of being starved for good stories, I think it's as simple as the solo being a failure. I don't think there's anything wrong with AoW, it's a fun action book like Zub said.

    The problem is that the solo is such a frak-fest that people are looking elsewhere for development and characterization of BP and Wakanda and they don't see it in AoW. Which imo shouldn't be the case.

    If WoW wasn't the bomb that it was, handled it's premise better than the stupid plot of Two Wakandan Girls in New York, then that could have been the perfect complimentary book to a BP solo. Neither Coates nor his friends should ever be given a BP book to write again.
    I can agree with this, especially the highlighted.

  7. #9757
    CBB 4 LIFE Mr MajestiK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marvell2100 View Post
    Yeah, there can be more Wakandans definitely. But like I said before, the title says Agents of Wakanda not Agents from Wakanda, they are proxies that BP is using.

    On one hand people want A-listers on the team and then on the other people want more Wakandan's on the team. There's already an A-lister on the team, T'Challa. Zub has characters coming in and out, using a rotating cast, probably people he can use and get away with somethings.

    As far as the N'Yami ships are concerned, they're more of Wakandan military so I don't expect them to be used as this team is not connected to the Wakandan military. T'Challa created new ships and tech for this team which is something we should be happy about. Anyone notice how T'Challa was in space in just the regular habit without a spacesuit unlike the other team members? All he had was a breather, it's little nods like that that I like seeing.

    I think Zub has built a better foundation with AoW than any other BP spin-off and he's only issues in. BP isn't chumped, he's doing isht and it's got action.
    Agents of SHIELD was a close to all American enterprise so there's really no tangible reason why Agents of Wakanda should be anything but Wakanda complete with tech that showcases Wakandan bespoke designs, applications and uniqueness.

    As things stand now, there's very little if anything that distinguishes AoW from any other team based book that Marvel's putting out currently.

    Yeah, T'Challa looks good in this book at least up until he starts dropping silly passwords and codes that make him look like a chump.

    I for one, remain sick and tired of settling for scraps from the singularly uncreative House of Ideas.

    The Hellicarrier will always be synonymous with Nick Fury and SHIELD.

    T'Challa needs something unique to his world regardless of whether it's in his core solo book or one ostensibly titled Agents of Wakanda.
    Enjoying the camraderie of friends and family is all that matters in the world.

    Mr MajestiK took a short hiatus and the Chaos Bringer was reborn.

  8. #9758
    CBB 4 LIFE Mr MajestiK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marvell2100 View Post
    To me, they just branded it wrong and too many people are hooked on to the espionage aspect. This is a recon/mobile strike team type book and there's nothing wrong with that.

    I'll just ask, what about the stories seem bad other than it's not espionage? We already knew going in that Zub was going to do two-parters, so that can't be an issue. T'Challa's not sitting at home giving orders while everyone else does the heavy lifting. C-list characters? Again, T'Challa is leading the Avengers so he already has an A-list team. Zub doesn't have the clout Aaron does so he's getting characters that he can probably do things and get away with.

    Not enough Wakandans? I'll cede that but we can't complain about C-list characters and then want an entire Wakandan hit squad(which by the way should be in the solo where it belongs). Agents of Wakanda not from Wakanda.

    T'Challa is doing more isht on this book than in his solo. He's not doing street isht, he's not relegated to being a background character and he's taking on big threats. I don't se these stories as being average or below average. I think they are action packed stories and not here to develop T'Challa's character but rather his skills and feats.

    What are some other the threats that this team should face?
    I hate to say this but to be honest, the AoW lineup totally sucks.

    I haven't seen anything remotely commendable about this book at all.
    Enjoying the camraderie of friends and family is all that matters in the world.

    Mr MajestiK took a short hiatus and the Chaos Bringer was reborn.

  9. #9759
    The Professional Marvell2100's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr MajestiK View Post
    Agents of SHIELD was a close to all American enterprise so there's really no tangible reason why Agents of Wakanda should be anything but Wakanda complete with tech that showcases Wakandan bespoke designs, applications and uniqueness.

    As things stand now, there's very little if anything that distinguishes AoW from any other team based book that Marvel's putting out currently.

    Yeah, T'Challa looks good in this book at least up until he starts dropping silly passwords and codes that make him look like a chump.

    I for one, remain sick and tired of settling for scraps from the singularly uncreative House of Ideas.

    The Hellicarrier will always be synonymous with Nick Fury and SHIELD.

    T'Challa needs something unique to his world regardless of whether it's in his core solo book or one ostensibly titled Agents of Wakanda.
    I don't see the helicarrier being synonymous with SHIELD anymore sine they've been gone for so long. If they called it something else it wouldn't matter. As far as we can tell, AoW is not as expansive as SHIELD was and they are dealing with things that SHIELD didn't or couldn't handle.

    I agreed earlier that there can be more Wakandans on this team for sure. There is no set line-up as agents come and go depending on the mission. T'Challa in a book not chumping him out and he's doing feats and tech? I'm good with that. Passcodes don't faze me. He could have said shitstorm for all I care on that one. Not a problem for me.

    Again, AoW is not a bad book. The problem is that the solo should be giving us all the things we're looking for and we're not getting it. I don't expect AoW to go too in-depth about Wakanda, that's what the solo is there for and that is the failure, not what's happening in AoW.

  10. #9760
    Astonishing Member Cville's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marvell2100 View Post
    I don't see the helicarrier being synonymous with SHIELD anymore sine they've been gone for so long. If they called it something else it wouldn't matter. As far as we can tell, AoW is not as expansive as SHIELD was and they are dealing with things that SHIELD didn't or couldn't handle.

    I agreed earlier that there can be more Wakandans on this team for sure. There is no set line-up as agents come and go depending on the mission. T'Challa in a book not chumping him out and he's doing feats and tech? I'm good with that. Passcodes don't faze me. He could have said shitstorm for all I care on that one. Not a problem for me.

    Again, AoW is not a bad book. The problem is that the solo should be giving us all the things we're looking for and we're not getting it. I don't expect AoW to go too in-depth about Wakanda, that's what the solo is there for and that is the failure, not what's happening in AoW.
    I didnt even think Tchalla would be a prominent character. I figured he be a face on a video screen. Okyoe should be the most upset. She's the director and he keeps coming along. Lol

    I'm getting more than what I anticipated. My expectation was short self contained stories with different team mashups around the world.

  11. #9761
    The Professional Marvell2100's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cville View Post
    I didnt even think Tchalla would be a prominent character. I figured he be a face on a video screen. Okyoe should be the most upset. She's the director and he keeps coming along. Lol

    I'm getting more than what I anticipated. My expectation was short self contained stories with different team mashups around the world.
    WoW and BP & The Crew left that bad taste.

  12. #9762
    Extraordinary Member Ezyo1000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marvell2100 View Post
    To me, they just branded it wrong and too many people are hooked on to the espionage aspect. This is a recon/mobile strike team type book and there's nothing wrong with that.

    I'll just ask, what about the stories seem bad other than it's not espionage? We already knew going in that Zub was going to do two-parters, so that can't be an issue. T'Challa's not sitting at home giving orders while everyone else does the heavy lifting. C-list characters? Again, T'Challa is leading the Avengers so he already has an A-list team. Zub doesn't have the clout Aaron does so he's getting characters that he can probably do things and get away with.

    Not enough Wakandans? I'll cede that but we can't complain about C-list characters and then want an entire Wakandan hit squad(which by the way should be in the solo where it belongs). Agents of Wakanda not from Wakanda.

    T'Challa is doing more isht on this book than in his solo. He's not doing street isht, he's not relegated to being a background character and he's taking on big threats. I don't se these stories as being average or below average. I think they are action packed stories and not here to develop T'Challa's character but rather his skills and feats.

    What are some other the threats that this team should face?
    for me it's teo things, the agenda and the Characters. Indontnwsnt Zub to pull an Ewing ie interviews saying the book is one thing then actual content is something else entirely. If he just wants to do high octane make that the mission statement from the jump.

    Second is Characters. I'm fine with wasp, and Roz
    But again if it's espionage then get spy characters. And add Kasper ad a new HZ operative.

    Vehicle's I can look past it but if like an N'Yami 2.0

  13. #9763
    Invincible Member XPac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DigiCom View Post
    Kirby did all sorts of weird isht, including the pre-Steranko Nick Fury stuff. He even did some work on a Prisoner graphic novel.



    I disagree. It's only creative laziness that reduces everything to heroes punching villains (or, more recently, heroes punching other heroes). A smart writer can pen a story that does both… the Warren Ellis run on Secret Avengers had some nice examples, IIRC.
    I won't say comic books can't be more than heroes punching villains... but if that's not something a reader is particularly interested in then they're mostly barking up the wrong tree for a book like this.

  14. #9764
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr MajestiK View Post
    I hate to say this but to be honest, the AoW lineup totally sucks.

    I haven't seen anything remotely commendable about this book at all.
    I wouldn't go that far, but the team is lacking There is no theme behind any of the members, and most of them seem to have been selected because they are faves of Jason Aaron (Broo, Gorilla Man, Fat Cobra, American Eagle, Dr. Nemesis)

  15. #9765
    Extraordinary Member Ezyo1000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marvell2100 View Post
    Honestly, I don't think it's a matter of being starved for good stories, I think it's as simple as the solo being a failure. I don't think there's anything wrong with AoW, it's a fun action book like Zub said.

    The problem is that the solo is such a frak-fest that people are looking elsewhere for development and characterization of BP and Wakanda and they don't see it in AoW. Which imo shouldn't be the case.

    If WoW wasn't the bomb that it was, handled it's premise better than the stupid plot of Two Wakandan Girls in New York, then that could have been the perfect complimentary book to a BP solo. Neither Coates nor his friends should ever be given a BP book to write again.
    This i agree with 100%. Its why we were so bothered by wow, long live, abd the Crew. All failures, all relied on shade throwing, biting the hand that feeds them, and were just overall isht unoriginal stories. Rise should of been the first spin off, followed by AoW, then the fun ones BP vs do ghost Panther, sound of fury etc should of been next. Abd the one shot of Kasper should of been mini

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