Black Panther Appreciation 2019

[Marvell2100]

Lol. No one’s trying to make y’all feel bad so you can get off of your sad high horse, sir. And no you are correct, there are Storm fans who consistently read(and purchase/give monetary validity) to books where Storm was consistently not well written. I’d say that their incessant cyclical whining over something they know is not going to just going change with a new issue was nonsensical too. It’s the expectation that something will change about the way a writer portrays your favorite character that surprises me lol. As if you’d catch me dead, acknowledging and reviewing and pouring over every issue of X-men: Gold, which as far as I’m concerned, was not featuring Storm at all due to her horrible characterization. It was less so me saying that y’all “shouldn’t” read your own title character book and more so me not understanding why as BP fans would you keep supporting/reading a book that you claim on the monthly does you and T’challa dirty?

Anyway. This will no doubt be taken poorly since as a “Storm fan” I should keep my opinions on BP out of the BP thread, as many of you have requested. That’s fine. But just know that as a fan of Storm and BP, I actually do want them BOTH to be written well. I actually do agree with a lot of your qualms with the book in regards to it’s exhaustingly long winded storylines that seem to meander between dull at some points and not great showings for T’challa at other points. It seems stagnant at times and I agree that he has drastically altered Wakanda’s mythological, economic, and cultural landscape much to the chagrin of a lot (not all) of you. I read through this thread every day just as I do with the Storm thread so I do see all of your opinions when it comes to these things. So I’m not just coming over here because Storm had a good showing and saying “i just get why y’all don’t like it”. I do get it. I just assumed that you were buying and reading the book anyway. Which seemed counterproductive and confusing to me if you really want a change in writer? Believe it or not, I actually want you all to enjoy Black Panther’s title book. It’s more fun as fans of both characters when the fandoms are happy and enjoying the storyline. Alas, I shall see myself out before I’m asked to. Just wanted to clarify my initial post since many responded to it and seemingly took it the wrong way.

Well if you want to engage in serious conversation, leave the "sad "(C'mon, was that even necessary to make your point?) attitude at the door.

The same talking points you bring up about BP fans are the same things happening in the Storm thread and any other appreciation thread where fans feels that the characters aren't being done the they way they feel is right.

This thread has a long history of praising and criticizing any creative team on BP so that won't stop anytime soon. Why do we continually critique something we don't like? To let the PTB know that we don't blindly accept whatever they put out just because we like the character. Sometimes, silence is consent. If you don't say anything, then they assume everything must be good and will continue to feed your garbage. Believe me, word is getting back to these creators. Whether that changes anything or not, we've let our opinions be known.

In order to properly critique any material, you need to read it. If it's good, you need to speak to what's good about it and if it's garbage, the same applies. We had one BP "fan" who used to post here and would criticize a particular BP writer. He/she would say all kinds of nonsense and we eventually found out that this poster never even read the stuff he/she was criticizing. They flat out admitted it.

And you don't have to pay for it to read it. There are some LCS that will let you check out title or two without purchasing it.

Your post is not being taken poorly by me and I would welcome you to come back in this thread and bring up any points you like. I would be happy to keep the conversation going. And I would be more than happy to talk more Storm with you in her thread.

Thank you for engaging in the conversation.

[Hypestyle]

Maybe this is old news, but looks like Disney executive Bob Iger is "outing" Ike Perlmutter as the Disney/Marvel manager who was blocking Black Panther (and Capt. Marvel) at one point...

https://www.cbr.com/marvel-exec-bloc...aptain-marvel/

I’ve been in the business long enough to have heard every old argument in the book, and I’ve learned that old arguments are just that: old, and out of step with where the world is and where it should be. We had a chance to make a great movie and to showcase an underrepresented segment of America, and those goals were not mutually exclusive. I called Ike and told him to tell his team to stop putting up roadblocks and ordered that we put both Black Panther and Captain Marvel into production.

[KOSLOX]

I think everyone in this thread said Perlmutter was the problem YEARS before Black Panther was even announced.

[Marvell2100]

I saw where someone posted this in the Cap thread.

[Cville]

I saw where someone posted this in the Cap thread.

Celestial Power Punches.

[Ororo101]

Well if you want to engage in serious conversation, leave the "sad "(C'mon, was that even necessary to make your point?) attitude at the door.

The same talking points you bring up about BP fans are the same things happening in the Storm thread and any other appreciation thread where fans feels that the characters aren't being done the they way they feel is right.

This thread has a long history of praising and criticizing any creative team on BP so that won't stop anytime soon. Why do we continually critique something we don't like? To let the PTB know that we don't blindly accept whatever they put out just because we like the character. Sometimes, silence is consent. If you don't say anything, then they assume everything must be good and will continue to feed your garbage. Believe me, word is getting back to these creators. Whether that changes anything or not, we've let our opinions be known.

In order to properly critique any material, you need to read it. If it's good, you need to speak to what's good about it and if it's garbage, the same applies. We had one BP "fan" who used to post here and would criticize a particular BP writer. He/she would say all kinds of nonsense and we eventually found out that this poster never even read the stuff he/she was criticizing. They flat out admitted it.

And you don't have to pay for it to read it. There are some LCS that will let you check out title or two without purchasing it.

Your post is not being taken poorly by me and I would welcome you to come back in this thread and bring up any points you like. I would be happy to keep the conversation going. And I would be more than happy to talk more Storm with you in her thread.

Thank you for engaging in the conversation.

You know what, thank you for this and I would like to apologize for the sad comment too, you are correct it was unnecessary. I honestly just didn’t understand why my initial post was being apparently taken sideways by some here when in all reality I am in agreement with y’all. T’challa is being super mopey and acting depressed, which is different from how I viewed him before. And even worse yet for me it makes him seem cold, distant, and unaffectionate to Ororo and I expected more from him at their reunion and then again in this last issue. If I saw the man/woman I love for the first time in 5 years after “dreaming” of her from across the galaxy, let’s just say I would have a bit more pep in my step. As I was saying in the Storm thread as well, besides her breadcrumb development in this Godhood story and the parts with Bast and T’challa on their way back to Wakanda Prime this storyline has been progressing paiiiiiinfully slow. I know that if as a secondary fan could notice his attitude/personality is off then you guys must have too. I mean there’s stoic and then there’s this. So I really was just curious as to why so many of you kept buying/supporting the title if it’s not doing T’challa any service. The only think that speaks to Marvel is dollars and I’d rather have you guys happy with where the story is going than come over here every month to see how jaded you still are with your favorite character’s book. I’ve been there MANY times as a Storm fan, trust me lol. What I didn’t realize though was that some of you could read it otherwise, which makes much more sense now to me than continuing to buy a book that you dislike so severely.

[Marvell2100]

You know what, thank you for this and I would like to apologize for the sad comment too, you are correct it was unnecessary. I honestly just didn’t understand why my initial post was being apparently taken sideways by some here when in all reality I am in agreement with y’all. T’challa is being super mopey and acting depressed, which is different from how I viewed him before. And even worse yet for me it makes him seem cold, distant, and unaffectionate to Ororo and I expected more from him at their reunion and then again in this last issue. If I saw the man/woman I love for the first time in 5 years after “dreaming” of her from across the galaxy, let’s just say I would have a bit more pep in my step. As I was saying in the Storm thread as well, besides her breadcrumb development in this Godhood story and the parts with Bast and T’challa on their way back to Wakanda Prime this storyline has been progressing paiiiiiinfully slow. I know that if as a secondary fan could notice his attitude/personality is off then you guys must have too. I mean there’s stoic and then there’s this. So I really was just curious as to why so many of you kept buying/supporting the title if it’s not doing T’challa any service. The only think that speaks to Marvel is dollars and I’d rather have you guys happy with where the story is going than come over here every month to see how jaded you still are with your favorite character’s book. I’ve been there MANY times as a Storm fan, trust me lol. What I didn’t realize though was that some of you could read it otherwise, which makes much more sense now to me than continuing to buy a book that you dislike so severely.

No problem and I understand the point you're trying to get across. And to continue to post in here and express your opinion. I'll do the same in the Storm thread.

I think practically everyone in the thread agrees with the mopey, depressing characterization of BP. That's not being stoic, that is writing him like he's a cardboard cut-out. T.is title is bleeding readers and Coates can't or doesn't know how to course correct.

Fortunately, for BP fans, he's in Avengers and in Agents of Wakanda where he's being handled much better. But frak, we can't get a better showing in his own solo. Most of us are just hoping Coates run ends soon.

Surprisingly, Coates writes a good Captain America.

[butterflykyss]

No problem and I understand the point you're trying to get across. And to continue to post in here and express your opinion. I'll do the same in the Storm thread.

I think practically everyone in the thread agrees with the mopey, depressing characterization of BP. That's not being stoic, that is writing him like he's a cardboard cut-out. T.is title is bleeding readers and Coates can't or doesn't know how to course correct.

Fortunately, for BP fans, he's in Avengers and in Agents of Wakanda where he's being handled much better. But frak, we can't get a better showing in his own solo. Most of us are just hoping Coates run ends soon.

Surprisingly, Coates writes a good Captain America.

do you think he doesnt have a reason to be written as such considering all that has happened? there is one thing to not like it but in context of the story do you understand why he would be depressed or mopey?

[Marvell2100]

do you think he doesnt have a reason to be written as such considering all that has happened? there is one thing to not like it but in context of the story do you understand why he would be depressed or mopey?

For 36+ issues?

His sister was dead and he got her back. Was he happy? No

His mother was attacked and nearly killed. Was he angry? No.

She survived and got better. Was he happy? No.

His country was in a "civil war" and they came back together with him still as leader. Was he happy? No.

He made amends with Storm and they are back together. Was he elated, excited, energized? No.

He just brought down the Empire and blew up the Death Star. Did he even say "Yahoooo!"? No.

He should just kill himself.

[terrancejameson]

For 36+ issues?

His sister was dead and he got her back. Was he happy? No

His mother was attacked and nearly killed. Was he angry? No.

She survived and got better. Was he happy? No.

His country was in a "civil war" and they came back together with him still as leader. Was he happy? No.

He made amends with Storm and they are back together. Was he elated, excited, energized? No.

He just brought down the Empire and blew up the Death Star. Did he even say "Yahoooo!"? No.

He should just kill himself.

When you put it like this you definitely hit the point home. Granted, he's laughed with Storm, but i could totally use more laughter in his life. Mopey boots is NOT something T'Challa ever was.

[Cville]

do you think he doesnt have a reason to be written as such considering all that has happened? there is one thing to not like it but in context of the story do you understand why he would be depressed or mopey?

I don't. He's seen the end of the universe and is one of the few people who can talk about it. He stares down Galactus without flinching and is able to bring gods(tiger god) under his control. He can be reflective, but mopey won't cut it.

Thinking about why he sent the team out in the first place, its explained that he was worried about his enemies getting Vb. He already has a kill switch for it so it's not really a threat.
Then Storm tells the reader that he is really just running away from responsibility when he decided to go investigate.

So this whole arc us built on paranoia and cowardice.

[Marvell2100]

When you put it like this you definitely hit the point home. Granted, he's laughed with Storm, but i could totally use more laughter in his life. Mopey boots is NOT something T'Challa ever was.

That was manic laughter.

He's clinically depressed at this point.

[Ororo101]

For 36+ issues?

His sister was dead and he got her back. Was he happy? No

His mother was attacked and nearly killed. Was he angry? No.

She survived and got better. Was he happy? No.

His country was in a "civil war" and they came back together with him still as leader. Was he happy? No.

He made amends with Storm and they are back together. Was he elated, excited, energized? No.

He just brought down the Empire and blew up the Death Star. Did he even say "Yahoooo!"? No.

He should just kill himself.

When you put it like this you definitely hit the point home. Granted, he's laughed with Storm, but i could totally use more laughter in his life. Mopey boots is NOT something T'Challa ever was.

I don't. He's seen the end of the universe and is one of the few people who can talk about it. He stares down Galactus without flinching and is able to bring gods(tiger god) under his control. He can be reflective, but mopey won't cut it.

Thinking about why he sent the team out in the first place, its explained that he was worried about his enemies getting Vb. He already has a kill switch for it so it's not really a threat.
Then Storm tells the reader that he is really just running away from responsibility when he decided to go investigate.

So this whole arc us built on paranoia and cowardice.

That was manic laughter.

He's clinically depressed at this point.

Agreed and co-signed. One of my biggest grievances with Coates’ interpretation of T’challa.

[butterflykyss]

For 36+ issues?

His sister was dead and he got her back. Was he happy? No

His mother was attacked and nearly killed. Was he angry? No.

She survived and got better. Was he happy? No.

His country was in a "civil war" and they came back together with him still as leader. Was he happy? No.

He made amends with Storm and they are back together. Was he elated, excited, energized? No.

He just brought down the Empire and blew up the Death Star. Did he even say "Yahoooo!"? No.

He should just kill himself.

See I see it differently.

1. His sister was dead and she was brought back YET he regretted leaving her to die in the first place. He felt like he abandoned her. I can understand him being sad about that. It's a real life term I dont know the exact name but it's a form of trauma dealing with the guilt of being a survival after a tragic event happens to friends and or family.

2. His mother was nearly killed and he went after the people who perpetuated the acts.

3. He was happy. He even expressed this to his mother shortly after date night. He felt like he could finally breathe. This was the issue where Eden transport Tchalla to Ororo when she was headmistress.

4. Again, there was definitely a period where he was happy but how could he celebrate when his nation was still dealing with threats from Sefako and then also from Klaw??

5. He was very happy and wanted more from Ororo but she shut it down and said they dont need labels. I mean if you were a man that wanted to make your lover your official gf only for her to respond with not having labels, could you not understand how that would deflate any excitement he would have had?

6. Why would he celebrate when he knows there are still so many who are still suffering btw because of a decision he made to send some explorers into space?

7. He shouldn't. He has a lot on his shoulders and hes figuring his way through this. He will come out on top.

[XPac]

I thought Tchalla was unhappy in the first and third seasons, justifiably so given the circumstances. But I don't agree he was mopey in the second season. He seemed genuinely happy to be with Storm again.