Black Panther Appreciation 2019

[XPac]

It recently occurred to me that some of M'Baku's children might have been Snapped. I wonder how that will affect his and T'Challa's relationship in the sequel if that were the case.



Well if it's any consolation that tendency to demolish exotic cultures probably won't protect Krakoa either.

It's almost a given Krakoa will be gone by the end of Hickmans story, just like every other mutant nation ever made (Avalon, Genosha, Utopia, Nation X, etc). These things are rarely if ever part of the legitimate status quo... they're just elements in a particular story being told that pretty much never outlast the story.

[DigiCom]

It recently occurred to me that some of M'Baku's children might have been Snapped. I wonder how that will affect his and T'Challa's relationship in the sequel if that were the case.



Well if it's any consolation that tendency to demolish exotic cultures probably won't protect Krakoa either.

Oh, Krakoa is toast. It's only a matter of time before it's torn apart by civil war or Sentinel invasion.

There are degrees to which you can ignore things. Wakanda have problems is ignorable. Wakanda being destroyed is not. THat's my point. Hickman can have Wakanda take a hit (losing a battle or causing some damage) ... but destroying it goes beyond the point where it can be ignored.

Nothing the Big Two surprises me, anymore. NOTHING.

[XPac]

Does it really matter if BP has a book or not though? The sales on his solo are trash and it’s obvious that if Hickman has a big Krakoan invasion of Wakanda that’s what most fans are gonna see. No one in the broader MU has really followed up on the changes Coates is making to the mythos so if a war does happen I fully expect whatever Hickman writes to be the status quo. Whether or not Coates chooses to incorporate would be his own prerogative.

Are we even gonna see why T’Challa said no to Krakoa this arc even though it looks like Storm is ready to break up with him over it? Apparently Krakoa already exists at the time she talks to Nakia, but yet she’s still helping out the kingdom and doesn’t seem to have discussed it with T’Challa. I think Hickman is the point man on Wakanda-Krakoa relations at this point, not Coates.

And I actually wouldn’t be surprised if he was on board with a major Wakandan defeat and was working with Hickman on something. He likes to write T’Challa from a position of weakness and emotional turmoil so his ex-wife leading the invasion of his kingdom would certainly have some appeal. And to seal the deal all Hickman has to do is let Storm get that fabled mini or date T’Challa after the big fight lol.

If everyone (writes and editors) is on board with it then yes... in theory Wakanda being destroyed is certainly a possibility.

That said, if we're talking about flat out destroying Wakanda then this becomes a very different situation. No way would Storm, or any of the non villianouse X-Men go along with destroying an entire nation. The reason the X-Men started turning on the P5 in AvX was precisely because of what happened to Wakanda. The X-Men at least aren't super villains... if that happen in the story a good deal of the X-Men themselves including Storm will switch sides.

[chief12d]

If everyone (writes and editors) is on board with it then yes... in theory Wakanda being destroyed is certainly a possibility.

That said, if we're talking about flat out destroying Wakanda then this becomes a very different situation. No way would Storm, or any of the non villianouse X-Men go along with destroying an entire nation. The reason the X-Men started turning on the P5 in AvX was precisely because of what happened to Wakanda. The X-Men at least aren't super villains... if that happen in the story a good deal of the X-Men themselves including Storm will switch sides.

I agree that the X-Men won’t destroy Wakanda, I’m talking about a war or raid. Even if the X-Men don’t seem 100% themselves I doubt Marvel would have them just desolate a country. Even Namor has the excuse of the Phoenix Force lol.

[Ezyo1000]

Well, if Hickman decides to go that route, it will only confirm Marvel Editorials ongoing fascination with undermining T'Challa and Wakanda's overall position of prominence within the MU/MCU.

I think a big problem that could make it easier to Target Wakanda like that, is because Coates isn't going to defend T'Challa or Wakanda. Just like with Spencer, when he had T'Challa punk Cap then turn around and have Wakanda lose to frakking Faustus, a z list nobody.. and Coates kept on with his useless story.. now if this was Priest or Hudlin? You know Krakoa would appear in his book getting punked hard. Coates? "Well this is a humbling experience for Wakandans and how they will be able to come back stronger"

[DigiCom]

I just had a remarkably stupid idea. So stupid, I could see Coates actually doing it:

spoilers:

What if he plans to make Okoye the new Black Panther?

end of spoilers

[Ezyo1000]

There are degrees to which you can ignore things. Wakanda having problems is ignorable. Wakanda being destroyed is not. THat's my point. Hickman can have Wakanda take a hit (losing a battle or causing some damage) ... but destroying it goes beyond the point where it can be ignored.

See the problem is, in secret empire Wakanda should not of lost period. A place like Wakanda resisting openly should of been the staging point for the heros to take their stand. They Could still let evil Steve get what he wanted while still losing his army in the process and not having Wakanda lose a battle, which is just as bad as taking any loss since prior to tro that never happened

[BlackClaw]

I just had a remarkably stupid idea. So stupid, I could see Coates actually doing it:

spoilers:

What if he plans to make Okoye the new Black Panther?

end of spoilers

I suggest you delete this before Coates sees this and makes it a reality.

[XPac]

See the problem is, in secret empire Wakanda should not of lost period. A place like Wakanda resisting openly should of been the staging point for the heros to take their stand. They Could still let evil Steve get what he wanted while still losing his army in the process and not having Wakanda lose a battle, which is just as bad as taking any loss since prior to tro that never happened

Eh... Wakanda won 2 out of 3 against Hydra, so I don't think Secret Empire really did Wakanda dirty. Given Hydra basically HAD to win in order to advance the story, they at least gave Wakanda its props.

[Ezyo1000]

I just had a remarkably stupid idea. So stupid, I could see Coates actually doing it:

spoilers:

What if he plans to make Okoye the new Black Panther?

end of spoilers

Don't even entertain that idea...

[Ezyo1000]

Eh... Wakanda won 2 out of 3 against Hydra, so I don't think Secret Empire really did Wakanda dirty. Given Hydra basically HAD to win in order to advance the story, they at least gave Wakanda its props.

Ah yes in the tell don't show fashion. Then when we do see them the lose.. in the dumbest manner I have ever seen. Literally PIS. You know how they could of handled that? Again the heroes go to Wakanda because they are resisting, causing other nations to resist as well. Theres a big battle. Steve's army loses.. however Steve uses the battle as the diversion to get the comic cube. Simple. Wakanda remains undefeated, Steve still accomplishes his goal

[XPac]

Ah yes in the tell don't show fashion. Then when we do see them the lose.. in the dumbest manner I have ever seen. Literally PIS. You know how they could of handled that? Again the heroes go to Wakanda because they are resisting, causing other nations to resist as well. Theres a big battle. Steve's army loses.. however Steve uses the battle as the diversion to get the comic cube. Simple. Wakanda remains undefeated, Steve still accomplishes his goal

Except you don't want Steve's army losing ... that's the point. You want to build up the bad guy to the point where it seems they can't win. You don't want readers going "Hydra is no bid deal... Wakanda has got this." You want them believing the heroes can't win. Wakanda probably did give hope... that hope needed to be snuffed out both in a meta and non-meta way for storytelling reasons.

If Wakanda still had it's undefeated streak intact, it's entirely possible more effort would have been made to work around that since it was a part of their identity. But since the whole unconquered thing no longer exists anyways, Wakanda didn't need to be protected to the same degree (though it still went out of its way to protect Wakanda a bit by having it repell Hydra multiple times). That's sort of the thing about ending an undefeated streak... once it happens once, it's no longer as big a deal to happen again.

[XPac]

I just had a remarkably stupid idea. So stupid, I could see Coates actually doing it:

spoilers:

What if he plans to make Okoye the new Black Panther?

end of spoilers

Would that really need spoilers warning?

Anyways, I'd assume if that was the idea it would have happened when he was in space. Shuri briefly got to be Black Panther again while that was happening.

[DigiCom]

Would that really need spoilers warning?

Anyways, I'd assume if that was the idea it would have happened when he was in space. Shuri briefly got to be Black Panther again while that was happening.

I like to leave little surprises.

[Ezyo1000]

Except you don't want Steve's army losing ... that's the point. You want to build up the bad guy to the point where it seems they can't win. You don't want readers going "Hydra is no bid deal... Wakanda has got this." You want them believing the heroes can't win. Wakanda probably did give hope... that hope needed to be snuffed out both in a meta and non-meta way for storytelling reasons.

If Wakanda still had it's undefeated streak intact, it's entirely possible more effort would have been made to work around that since it was a part of their identity. But since the whole unconquered thing no longer exists anyways, Wakanda didn't need to be protected to the same degree (though it still went out of its way to protect Wakanda a bit by having it repell Hydra multiple times). That's sort of the thing about ending an undefeated streak... once it happens once, it's no longer as big a deal to happen again.

Yeah.. that could of happened very easily. The point of it is that Steve's army is facing Wakanda on a big Battle. There's a reason that they have failed to beat Wakanda
All of sudden Wakanda is no big deal because Faustus had a PIS unexplained power? Bullisht. Wakanda repelled the super skrulls, Thanos army, countless invasion's including Hydra before. And now they get defeated by Faustus? No Wakanda is place that in alternate realities when earth is taken over. Wakanda is still around. Again Steve could of changed his strategy "Facing Wakanda in a head-on battle is a suicide mission. We don't need to win, we just need time to get the cube" they fight, it's back and forth, on the end Steve's army is retreating but where did Steve go? He used the Battle to go for the cube, heroes are there to stop him they get beaten he gets the cube. Because here's the thing. Just because Wakanda lost to Thanos, who had arguably the strongest army in the 616 universe, who required it's full strength, all it's generals, and Thanos himself AND 3 attempts to take Wakanda, doesnt all of a sudden mean anyone can beat Wakanda. That's not how that works, especially to a inferior force. That's lazy writing. There would be countless ways to make it Steve win without Wakanda losing a battle in B's fashion