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  1. #10501
    Mighty Member Redjack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ezyo1000 View Post
    Erase things of past or current events? No nation they view as a threat, be it of the nations they know of or just I general, as in, what would their thoughts be of in regards to latveria abd Doom? Are you also saying that T'Challa would be less akin to Priest version in going out to study abroad and more like Hudlins Shuri who stayed and learned in Wakanda?

    Integration of human spies could easily lead to the creation of the hatute zerazi as I feel that fits into the role of CIA meets seals meets James Bond spies.

    I like the idea of Wakanda being that confident (hopefully not to set up a "humbling" experience like has been the case of late) but again this falls into is this Wakandas mindset that T'Challa doesn't himself follow due tk the nature of what happens to T'Chaka or does he too feel that way in Your version
    here's how it plays in my head (and how it played on Black Panther's Quest too, btw).

    10k years ago: Wakanda is founded around the vibranium mound, providing a technological jumpstart for the nation and creating early friction with its neighbors.

    After struggles against other African nations as well as Lemurians and any other weirdness from the magical realm and maybe the odd space alien, Wakanda closes its doors on the world FOREVER. The policy of staying inside the borders becomes a religious and fanatical cultural attribute as does murdering any outsiders who attempt to come across.

    Over the next 9k+ years Wakandans DO sometimes leave the kingdom but for only two reasons.

    1) once in a while a dangerous object in the larger world comes to light (something like the Evil Eye or the Serpent's Crown) and the ruler of the time sends out a small strike force to find the object, secure it and bring it home to place in wakanda's vaults. The Outsiders are just too primitive to be allowed to have access to such powers.

    2) Yemandi, the Leonardo of this already advanced culture, does a walkabout to "test her new technology" and to also secure dangerous items that the primitives outside wakanda shouldn't have.



    She runs afoul of various great powers in antiquity, including Morgan LeFay and the Deviants. Eventually she returns to Wakanda and stays.

    That's it. Aside from these, NO ONE leaves Wakanda, AT ALL, ever, until T'Chanda (you guys will say Azzuri but Chanda predates Azzuri and I added the T' to keep things cleaner) meets Captain America during WW2.



    Cap convinces him to provide aid against the Axis powers but, even then, Wakandans do NOT participate in the activities of the outside world. It is only after the USA explodes nukes in Japan that T'Chanda says, "Okay, the children are juggling hand grenades in a pool of gasoline. We need to step in."

    Observers are dispatched (like 20, max) to set up shop around the world, keep an eye on these fools and, if they get too close to wiping everything out, step in.

    T'Chaka, being privy to his dad's POV decides it's time to break with tradition a little. Wakanda needs a real diplomatic presence in the modern world so he opens the doors SOMEWHAT. Very limited access to Wakanda for specific outsiders with still nearly zero interest or interaction with outsiders from Wakandans themselves.

    T'Chaka's trying to slow-walk Wakanda's integration into the modern world (from both sides) to give everyone time to catch up. It seems to be working but, when he's assassinated, everything goes crazy. The Wakandan Council wants to close the doors again- to hell with the barbarians. if they kill themselves off, Wakanda will still be safe. T'Challa, who has grown up at his father's side, traveling with him from time to time and seeing how the outside world is goes the other way. Rather than closing the doors, he decides he needs to get a CLOSE, PERSONAL look at these fools. he contacts the Fantastic Four and ultimately joins the Avengers to spy on everything himself.



    After some years with them he deems the outside world Mostly Harmless and continues his father's open door policy. he's still slow walking the integration but moving faster than T'Chaka was. Also, he, like Yemandi, feels a bit tied down by his duties as king and keeps finding reasons to go on adventures. This causes frictions at home.

    This is the foundation I'd base my BP on. Some version of this. It's basically how we set things up on the show.

    This is just the BACKSTORY, not the plot of what I'd actually do.
    Last edited by Redjack; 12-11-2019 at 11:19 AM. Reason: spelling/clarity

  2. #10502
    Astonishing Member Cville's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ezyo1000 View Post
    It was okay, basic yes, bot how i was expecting it to end and left a little more to be desired, but not a terrible issue.

    Though I do wonder if we his got another tech feat when spoilers:
    T'Challas habit lit up abd he seemingly free ibto the chasm to stop John, i honestly expected hin to use the kinetic wave to give the planet energy as well as the gem
    end of spoilers overall average issue 6.5-7/10 still way better then anything out of the solo.
    I was looking at that too, but without gravity, I assume it'd make a substitute for thrust in its normal form. But it would explain why his suit didn't have a jetpack attached.

  3. #10503
    Extraordinary Member Ezyo1000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Redjack View Post
    here's how it plays in my head (and how it played on Black Panther's Quest too, btw).

    10k years ago: Wakanda is founded around the vibranium mound, providing a technological jumpstart for the nation and creating early friction with its neighbors.

    After struggles against other African nations as well as Lemurians and any other weirdness from the magical realm and maybe the odd space alien, Wakanda closes its doors on the world FOREVER. The policy of staying inside the borders becomes a religious and fanatical cultural attribute as does murdering any outsiders who attempt to come across.

    Over the next 9k+ years Wakandans DO sometimes leave the kingdom but for only two reasons.

    1) once in a while a dangerous object in the larger world comes to light (something like the Evil Eye or the Serpent's Crown) and the ruler of the time sends out a small strike force to find the object, secure it and bring it home to place in wakanda's vaults. The Outsiders are just too primitive to be allowed to have access to such powers.

    2) Yemandi, the Leonardo of this already advanced culture, does a walkabout to "test her new technology" and to also secure dangerous items that the primitives outside wakanda shouldn't have.



    She runs afoul of various great powers in antiquity, including Morgan LeFay and the Deviants. Eventually she returns to Wakanda and stays.

    That's it. Aside from these, NO ONE leaves Wakanda, AT ALL, ever, until T'Chanda (you guys will say Azzuri but Chanda predates Azzuri and I added the T' to keep things cleaner) meets Captain America during WW2.



    Cap convinces him to provide aid against the Axis powers but, even then, Wakandans do NOT participate in the activities of the outside world. It is only after the USA explodes nukes in Japan that T'Chanda says, "Okay, the children are juggling hand grenades in a pool of gasoline. We need to step in."

    Observers are dispatched (like 20, max) to set up shop around the world, keep an eye on these fools and, if they get too close to wiping everything out, step in.

    T'Chaka, being privy to his dad's POV decides it's time to break with tradition a little. Wakanda needs a real diplomatic presence in the modern world so he opens the doors SOMEWHAT. Very limited access to Wakanda for specific outsiders with still nearly zero interest or interaction with outsiders from Wakandans themselves.

    T'Chaka's trying to slow-walk Wakanda's integration into the modern world (from both sides) to give everyone time to catch up. It seems to be working but, when he's assassinated, everything goes crazy. The Wakandan Council wants to close the doors again- to hell with the barbarians. if they kill themselves off, Wakanda will still be safe. T'Challa, who has grown up at his father's side, traveling with him from time to time and seeing how the outside world is goes the other way. Rather than closing the doors, he decides he needs to get a CLOSE, PERSONAL look at these fools. he contacts the Fantastic Four and ultimately joins the Avengers to spy on everything himself.



    After some years with them he deems the outside world Mostly Harmless and continues his father's open door policy. he's still slow walking the integration but moving faster than T'Chaka was. Also, he, like Yemandi, feels a bit tied down by his duties as king and keeps finding reasons to go on adventures. This causes frictions at home.

    This is the foundation I'd base my BP on. Some version of this. It's basically how we set things up on the show.

    This is just the BACKSTORY, not the plot of what I'd actually do.
    Interesting, this is also somewhat similar to the MCU version in a manner of speaking while also keeping things tied to previous incarnations. So I'm assuming T'Chanda himself helps cap a little but not Wakanda. And eveb theb cap is kept at arm's length.

    Wakanda has spied on the world via satellites and drones essentially throughout time and knows general workings in the developed nations but more on a surface level. Maybe T'Chanda theb is the one who introduces the very first hatute zerazi (20 man team sounds like a good start) and sends them out, thus giving more detailed information to what the other nations are doing as well as satellite and drone spying.

    He contacts the FF, to test himself im assuming still to see how he fares in a world of superheroes as his entry then further assesses himself and the world through joining the Avengers, this could also serve as his own personal walkabout similar to yemandi, with many adventures with the Avengers.

    In the end, his assessment is that given the enemies they faced and world ending threats, he still feels Wakanda would've been/is strong enough to face them head on and win so he continues to open up, this leading us into Priest version of Wakanda, with Hudlins version of T'Challa (Priest Wakanda was basically indifferent to outsiders but will be polite unless threatened, with Hudlins version of T'Challa who was pretty chill, almost like a cool uncle thst everyone wanted to hang with but could switch to badass mode at a moment's notice) kind of deal.

    Is that a fair analysis of what your kinda getting at? What does your version think of Doom and Latveria?
    Last edited by Ezyo1000; 12-11-2019 at 12:06 PM.

  4. #10504
    Extraordinary Member Ezyo1000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cville View Post
    I was looking at that too, but without gravity, I assume it'd make a substitute for thrust in its normal form. But it would explain why his suit didn't have a jetpack attached.
    Ah I was kinda wondering if that's what they were going for but wasn't too sure. That would actually make sense abd which case an unorthodox way to utilize tech (which is a good thing) but I still wish he would of done the other part too. The issue needed a little more.. something. It just felt like it lacked a good resolution so it ended soft

  5. #10505
    Astonishing Member Cville's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ezyo1000 View Post
    Ah I was kinda wondering if that's what they were going for but wasn't too sure. That would actually make sense abd which case an unorthodox way to utilize tech (which is a good thing) but I still wish he would of done the other part too. The issue needed a little more.. something. It just felt like it lacked a good resolution so it ended soft
    I like the ending. It felt like a mission the Ultimates would have done to reach a none violent solution. And Tchalla saying we're not going to tell anybody and leave a smiley face on the moon for the world to see was funny.

  6. #10506
    Extraordinary Member Ezyo1000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cville View Post
    I like the ending. It felt like a mission the Ultimates would have done to reach a none violent solution. And Tchalla saying we're not going to tell anybody and leave a smiley face on the moon for the world to see was funny.
    I guess to me it just had this big set up last issue abd this one kinda just. Fizzled. It seemed like there could of been higher stakes while still leading to a nonviolent finish for me personally. It wasn't a bad issue, but so far the weakest of the 4

  7. #10507
    Get Hectic! FLEX HECTIC's Avatar
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    I'm really liking Redjack's thought process because he recognizes certain realities of the myth of Wakanda and how it's inner workings should transpire year to year!


    Like B.C. and A.D. there is a before the 1.3 Billion Dollars MCU debut and an after which demands specific adjustments to this intellectual property in the here and now!


    Once upon a time black comics didn't sell...


    https://www.deviantart.com/black-com...Sell-219324141


    With that now in the rearview mirror going forward there is absolutely nothing wrong with a think tank Manhattan Project type independent editorial office focused on fixing/cleaning areas that really are not even necessary to Black Panther in general!


    There is nothing terrible about trimming the fat where needed as long as it enhances the overall escapist feel of what story arc you are telling!


    Things like the Dora wives in training or an actual prince taking a walkabout risking losing the royal bloodline stand out like sore thumbs!


    However, a prince turned king with enhanced abilities and protective tech doing heroic things as a grown man is different in the same manner as Thor of Asgard!


    If Black Panther and Wakanda are needed on the battlefield because Skrulls or Thanos is coming then they have to share the wealth to help save the planet that they live on!


    Rape camps and Storm/Ororo baby mama drama are more or less a drag on the franchise that should be too far above those type of petty depictions!


    Spiderman stays teen age while Batman remains dark no matter how many reboots and it's proven lucrative so Black Panther should have reboots nearly the same!


    Once Shakespeare is established the basic stories stay consistent regardless of time and place, directors or actors on stage or film and then you go collect a paycheck end of!
    Get Hectic!

  8. #10508
    Incredible Member Vibranium Weave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Redjack View Post
    here's how it plays in my head (and how it played on Black Panther's Quest too, btw).

    10k years ago: Wakanda is founded around the vibranium mound, providing a technological jumpstart for the nation and creating early friction with its neighbors.

    After struggles against other African nations as well as Lemurians and any other weirdness from the magical realm and maybe the odd space alien, Wakanda closes its doors on the world FOREVER. The policy of staying inside the borders becomes a religious and fanatical cultural attribute as does murdering any outsiders who attempt to come across.

    Over the next 9k+ years Wakandans DO sometimes leave the kingdom but for only two reasons.

    1) once in a while a dangerous object in the larger world comes to light (something like the Evil Eye or the Serpent's Crown) and the ruler of the time sends out a small strike force to find the object, secure it and bring it home to place in wakanda's vaults. The Outsiders are just too primitive to be allowed to have access to such powers.

    2) Yemandi, the Leonardo of this already advanced culture, does a walkabout to "test her new technology" and to also secure dangerous items that the primitives outside wakanda shouldn't have.



    She runs afoul of various great powers in antiquity, including Morgan LeFay and the Deviants. Eventually she returns to Wakanda and stays.

    That's it. Aside from these, NO ONE leaves Wakanda, AT ALL, ever, until T'Chanda (you guys will say Azzuri but Chanda predates Azzuri and I added the T' to keep things cleaner) meets Captain America during WW2.



    Cap convinces him to provide aid against the Axis powers but, even then, Wakandans do NOT participate in the activities of the outside world. It is only after the USA explodes nukes in Japan that T'Chanda says, "Okay, the children are juggling hand grenades in a pool of gasoline. We need to step in."

    Observers are dispatched (like 20, max) to set up shop around the world, keep an eye on these fools and, if they get too close to wiping everything out, step in.

    T'Chaka, being privy to his dad's POV decides it's time to break with tradition a little. Wakanda needs a real diplomatic presence in the modern world so he opens the doors SOMEWHAT. Very limited access to Wakanda for specific outsiders with still nearly zero interest or interaction with outsiders from Wakandans themselves.

    T'Chaka's trying to slow-walk Wakanda's integration into the modern world (from both sides) to give everyone time to catch up. It seems to be working but, when he's assassinated, everything goes crazy. The Wakandan Council wants to close the doors again- to hell with the barbarians. if they kill themselves off, Wakanda will still be safe. T'Challa, who has grown up at his father's side, traveling with him from time to time and seeing how the outside world is goes the other way. Rather than closing the doors, he decides he needs to get a CLOSE, PERSONAL look at these fools. he contacts the Fantastic Four and ultimately joins the Avengers to spy on everything himself.



    After some years with them he deems the outside world Mostly Harmless and continues his father's open door policy. he's still slow walking the integration but moving faster than T'Chaka was. Also, he, like Yemandi, feels a bit tied down by his duties as king and keeps finding reasons to go on adventures. This causes frictions at home.

    This is the foundation I'd base my BP on. Some version of this. It's basically how we set things up on the show.

    This is just the BACKSTORY, not the plot of what I'd actually do.
    Do your mean T'Chanda predates Azzurri just in your version or in the actual Marvel Comics Universe (MCU lol).

    I ask because Roy Thomas came up with T'Chanda in 1993 but Jack Kirby came up with Azzuri in the 70s (It was spelled "Azzari" for some reason)
    Last edited by Vibranium Weave; 12-11-2019 at 02:56 PM.

  9. #10509
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    Quote Originally Posted by Redjack View Post
    Even at that point, there's no way they'd choose spies as a response because the entire rest of the world was controlled by white people or asian people. See many black Africans in the halls of power in those days? See many black people of any kind? Nope. Spies need to blend. Any necessary surveillance would have to be to make sure that the Western and Eastern powers didn't catch up technologically with Wakanda or, tangentially, wipe out the planet in a nuclear exchange.
    While I'm not disagreeing with you in any real detail (your ideas are quite intriguing, even where we disagree) I would note that there almost certainly WERE black people in those places, completely ignored. Nobody ever pays attention to the janitorial staff, waiters, and/or drivers.

  10. #10510
    The Professional Marvell2100's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DigiCom View Post
    While I'm not disagreeing with you in any real detail (your ideas are quite intriguing, even where we disagree) I would note that there almost certainly WERE black people in those places, completely ignored. Nobody ever pays attention to the janitorial staff, waiters, and/or drivers.
    Good point.

  11. #10511
    Astonishing Member Cville's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DigiCom View Post
    While I'm not disagreeing with you in any real detail (your ideas are quite intriguing, even where we disagree) I would note that there almost certainly WERE black people in those places, completely ignored. Nobody ever pays attention to the janitorial staff, waiters, and/or drivers.
    I believe that is the way Hudlin went in either Flags or Black to the Future.

  12. #10512
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cville View Post
    I believe that is the way Hudlin went in either Flags or Black to the Future.
    It's only logical, really. James Bond may be a fun character, but he's really a crap spy. He attracts FAR too much attention with his flashy cars et al.

    Effective spies are the ones you never notice.

  13. #10513
    Mighty Member Redjack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vibranium Weave View Post
    Do your mean T'Chanda predates Azzurri just in your version or in the actual Marvel Comics Universe (MCU lol).

    I ask because Roy Thomas came up with T'Chanda in 1993 but Jack Kirby came up with Azzuri in the 70s (It was spelled "Azzari" for some reason)
    technically correct.

    Kirby MENTIONS Azzari but we don't see him. Chanda APPEARS before Azzari does as T'Challa's grandfather. Thomas's story is a massive retcon as it casts Chanda as the first black panther when we know that was Bashenga. It was spelled Azzari because that's how Kirby wanted it.

    T'Chanda is my version.

  14. #10514
    Mighty Member Redjack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DigiCom View Post
    While I'm not disagreeing with you in any real detail (your ideas are quite intriguing, even where we disagree) I would note that there almost certainly WERE black people in those places, completely ignored. Nobody ever pays attention to the janitorial staff, waiters, and/or drivers.
    none of those people are getting anywhere near the real rooms of power. zero chance.

  15. #10515
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    Quote Originally Posted by Redjack View Post
    none of those people are getting anywhere near the real rooms of power. zero chance.
    In reality, probably not, no. But I keep thinking of the buffet in the war room in DOCTOR STRANGELOVE

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