Jean Grey: Marvel Girl, Phoenix Appreciation 2019

[PsychoEFrost]

That makes less sense. she went thought alot on blue and asn't this juvenile braty

But none of it involved the entity that the entire X-Men was terrified of.

[Havok83]

But none of it involved the entity that the entire X-Men was terrified of.

She literally faced the Phoenix in No More Humans and wasnt bratty and obnoxious there. Bunn may not have used the Phoenix in Blue but he did in Generations and his teen Jean wasnt bratty there either. That seemed to primarily be a Hopeless characterization. Its too bad the books were so disjointed bc Jean's view on the Phoenix seemed to conflict between her solo and that whereas Generations should have been development for her in her series

[phoenixzero23]

Teen Jean's portrayal was divided on two

-At the start when Jeen didn't want anything to do with Jean or anything Jean did. She was trying as hard as posible to be diferent. That was her main portrayal during her stance until some part of Blue. This Jean was interesting but she could be annoying sometimes
-On Blue and after adult Jean comes back, she stops avoiding her "destiny" and accepts who she.

[spirit2011]

So you wanted a character without defects or flaws who was millions times more capable than every person on the X-Men combined? Jeen was far more capable than Tott, Tarren, Tank, and Tobby combined, and it wasn't particularly close. They were all complete wallpaper, except Tott who was a stain on the wall.

Jeen had defects and flaws, everyone saw that on the writing.

If those other characters were badly written, it is the writer fault not Jeen. And Tyke was well written on Venom arc and on his solo.

She literally faced the Phoenix in No More Humans and wasnt bratty and obnoxious there. Bunn may not have used the Phoenix in Blue but he did in Generations and his teen Jean wasnt bratty there either. That seemed to primarily be a Hopeless characterization

Hopeless ignored the whole characterization of jeen

[TheDeadSpace]

A retcon conveniently released AFTER X-Factor #1 and the editorially mandated Maddie/Scott Break-up. So petty.

It's really weird, especially when you consider how successful this move was.

[Celestialbodies]

I long for Jean being characterized as assertive in her own drives and convictions and not as a means to fluff other characters.

[Soulsword323]

I long for Jean being characterized as assertive in her own drives and convictions and not as a means to fluff other characters.

Ugh, I love Morrison's Jean so much. He really is one of her best writers.

[Black Queen]

I loved the interactions with Ghost Jean and Emma, it was so much fun. They can be sarcastic with each other and still work together. I was really hoping Jean was going to be the one to bring Emma back into the X-Fold after Jean was resurrected.

How their interaction was fun all.....they argue about the miss used of the pheonix force and emma as per usual proud of committing adultery. In your right mind I asked which part was 'so much fun'

[WallStreeter]

So you wanted a character without defects or flaws who was millions times more capable than every person on the X-Men combined? Jeen was far more capable than Tott, Tarren, Tank, and Tobby combined, and it wasn't particularly close. They were all complete wallpaper, except Tott who was a stain on the wall.

You're absolute right. Characters with godly powers have certain lines they cannot cross, or it gets into evil/poor storytelling territory.

You cannot have Thor conquer the Earth (he could) and bring peace to Earth for example.

You cannot have the Scarlet Witch hex all her opponents to death.

You cannot have Phoenix/Jean destroy all weapons of mass destruction and any program that could target mutants, though she could with a thought.

You cannot have Magik kill off all humans who join anti mutant movements, though she can.

[WallStreeter]

But none of it involved the entity that the entire X-Men was terrified of.

That saved their butts so many times it wasn't funny! Yes Jean Grey saved the XMen and the entire universe during the original run. Jean used a Phoenix fragment to defeat a Celestial and save a planet including her original 5 teammates, Rachel/Phoenix saved them from the Beyonder. Jean/Phoenix saved them from Cassandra Nova. In No More Humans Phoenix helped save humans from Raze's crazy plan. Before that through Hope the Phoenix ignited mutant powers.

It looks like the X-Men are suffering from seriously faulty memory.

They weren't terrified of the Phoenix when they knew it was coming for Hope and knew she would be able to save mutants from Extinction. Oh, Hope channelled the Phoenix to defeat Bastion and his Nimrods.

We all know at some point in the future Jean will use the Phoenix to save the X-Men again.

Jeen, afraid of her destiny as the Phoenix, was still willing to go Black Vortex to save a planet and her friends.

[WallStreeter]

The sad thing is, I think Jeen will be completely forgotten as there's no reason going forward on why the X-Men should mention the timelost o5. Iceman coming out is the only permanent consequence. Right after the o5 went back they had the adult versions remember being their past selves, but this was Pre Hickman.

[powerpax]

Which is why the entire storyline was a pointless fucking lead balloon from the start which went on years too long.

[PsychoEFrost]

Which is why the entire storyline was a pointless fucking lead balloon from the start which went on years too long.

I think Jeen's presence was helpful for fans of Jean that hadn't seen her in person since Warsong/Endsong. But it should have ended at Battle of the Atom.

[Strong Girl Daken]

Jeen allowed for a really interesting character study on a character that had been dead for a decade. Her arc hinged on not accepting a destiny that seemed out of her control, which is a quintessential Jean Grey quality. It's the reason it took Jean and Cyclops so long to get married, it's the reason that Jean was hesitant to be motherly toward Rachel, and more recently it's the reason Jean rejected the Phoenix Force. Jeen allowed for a retrospective look at a character's 60 year publishing history and it had really interesting moments. The fact that the rest of the O5 were redundant and there was no plan for them because they were supposed to be the status quo made that chapter feel pointless now.

[powerpax]

Most of Bendis’ later Marvel career was built on running in place, improvising and surviving on banter and charm IMO. X-Men was the last example.

There was potential in mixing things up with the kids - Scott with Laura, Jeen with Hank, gay Bobby, etc. The more brash and impulsive take on Jean was interesting. But it could never last and they never committed to really changing up things with the overall O5 so I felt what I had from the beginning: that it was a pointless stunt on a road to nowhere.