Jean & Scott- The Phoenix & Cyclops Appreciation 2019

[Havok83]

Well, it's hard to have him react to Jean's "death" individually when not only she "died", but also Warren, Hank, Kurt, Rachel (he doesn't know about Ahab), Kitty, Ororo, Lorna, etc. All the X-men "dying" at once kinda makes any individual death seems almost minor.

No it’s not as Jean obviously holds a more special place in his heart and he wanted to go see her specifically before she “died”. Outside of their brief moment in PR, he hadn’t seen her in years which makes losing the opportunity to be around her that much worse. It’s nowhere near on the same level as dealing with the other X-men. He can be shown lamenting about the X-men as a whole but also reflecting on Jean as well

[PrezValentine]

Its too bad we didnt see Scott react at all to Jean's most recent "death"

Well, one of his goals is to "find the X-Men" as per his list, even after he assembled the current team. I'd say his on this weird place where he doesn't believe they're really dead, but also doesn't have any actual hope of finding them before ends up dead again.

[Omega Alpha]

No it’s not as Jean obviously holds a more special place in his heart and he wanted to go see her specifically before she “died”. Outside of their brief moment in PR, he hadn’t seen her in years which makes losing the opportunity to be around her that much worse. It’s nowhere near on the same level as dealing with the other X-men. He can be shown lamenting about the X-men as a whole but also reflecting on Jean as well

True, but it's understandable. Then again, Rosenberg being Rosenberg, I can only imagine the kind of bullshit he'd come up with. He already had his favorite character blaming Cyclops for all the X-men dying even though he was dead for a long time, and in fact the last times we've seen him alive he had conducted a MLK style march (UXM #600) and was essentially running a mutant nation (Time Runs Out).

[phoenixzero23]

No it’s not as Jean obviously holds a more special place in his heart and he wanted to go see her specifically before she “died”. Outside of their brief moment in PR, he hadn’t seen her in years which makes losing the opportunity to be around her that much worse. It’s nowhere near on the same level as dealing with the other X-men. He can be shown lamenting about the X-men as a whole but also reflecting on Jean as well

I agree, she was the first person he wanted to meet
JDW has said that the O5 remember their time on the future but as a distant memory so while jeen and tyke were alive at the same time until recently, that is not true for their adult selves, for them that was years ago.

[phoenixzero23]

I have to agree - Scott had worked out most of his Poccy possession issues before Morrison took over, except that Grant decided HE was going to be the one to tell that story and pushed the characterization reset button.

the issue is that progression is a complicated thing on these books. Eventually things have to go back to zero. For example Jean and Scott worked their issues and were a stable and mature couple, until suddenly they weren't. Then Marvel pushed that with Scemma and recently they have been backing from that too.
whatever future relationships they have will likely go throught the same the moment the writers or editors of the time get bored. this is how sadly this topic works on marvel.

[lancer]

I have to agree - Scott had worked out most of his Poccy possession issues before Morrison took over, except that Grant decided HE was going to be the one to tell that story and pushed the characterization reset button.

I blame Morrison for a lot. Not for that. Lobdell was just an interim writer. Morrison was coming in to be the main writer and set the direction for the characters. Not saying it was Lobdell's fault. I don't know what he was told about Morrison's plans. Maybe it was on editorial. But it was not a seamless transition regarding Cyclops' characterizatiom.

BTW, Lobdell did say he'd changed. However, the change was him becoming looser. It doesn't match what Morrison did. Lobdell didn't adress Jott. They barely interacted in his issues. it wasn't negative. There was no issue of marital issues. On the other hand, we never saw them interact as a couple. So I didn't see what Casey and then Morrison giving them troubles as a contradiction. More as a revelation. I mean a contradiction of Lobdell's 2001 run. The types of issues Morrison wound up giving them I felt contradicted a whole lot of earlier stories.

Again, though, I don't blame him for not lining up with what Lobdell did with Cyclops in 2001. Make no mistake in how much I disliked him. It's just that he was the new main handler for the character. For better or worse, it was his version of the character that was going to take precedent.

[Decoy]

No it’s not as Jean obviously holds a more special place in his heart and he wanted to go see her specifically before she “died”. Outside of their brief moment in PR, he hadn’t seen her in years which makes losing the opportunity to be around her that much worse. It’s nowhere near on the same level as dealing with the other X-men. He can be shown lamenting about the X-men as a whole but also reflecting on Jean as well

I chalk it up to if he lets himself dwell on it too long he’ll be a mess (think back to Jean’s.....or the Phoenix’s.....first death......he was broken enough to leave......), right now he’s focused on finishing off some loose ends, after that, unless they appear mid Final Battle when his team is slowly getting overrun, he’s liable to be a bigger mess (right now he’s got stubble and his hair is unruly)......add in my theory of a one two gut punch involving Emma either confirming that Kitty was right or there was another puppet master (Wyngarde......Either the Original, One of the daughters with his powers, or a new one, Madelyn, who would love to keep Jean out.....of.....the....way.......I thinks I’m onto something). Madelyn was so Psycho the first time they fought.....she’s back, as was her rival.....why not get rid of her hated foe somehow and ruin Cyclops once and for all.....(she probably wouldn’t know that the other team members are still alive, just stuck in a crap storyline)

[Decoy]

So, what would it take to win back half the fan base when it comes to Cyclops and Jean? Some sort of retcon? Have Scott and Jean spend time on a team up (together with against a common foe? Or a team up with The Avengers or The Starjammers)? Or just have them in a better place as Hickman’s Run starts, imply they had their much needed heart to heart, and they’re back to what they where before Morrison’s Run........and then do a Mini Series detailing how they ironed out their issues

I know some would prefer they move on.......however Scott is rather complicated when it comes to his background, while Jean herself has baggage (so perhaps they’d be best together)

Where would that leave Emma? Since AvX, Scott and Emma where just platonic (possibly some trying to plant the seeds for Jean’s Return.......) before his death, and right now she’s in charge of the Hellfire Club, though she’s apparently back by House/ Powers of X with a ongoing maybe.......I personally would just have Emma move on (kinda like what JDW implied, since it’s known where Scott’s heart lies, where it was even when Emma was with Scott......). I would perhaps have Emma try to find someone with less baggage then Scott and Jean’s relationship......perhaps, assuming they explain the mind wipe, someone like Havok (who was never as brooding as his brother), Warren (a bigger case of mental baggage but without the looming specter of Phoenix’s, Sinister, or Stryfe), Bishop (Random left field ), or even Hercules (someone who is a complete outsider), Namor (assuming he gets over his current anger issues)

With Marvel walking back some of their stupid calls concerning relationships and their heroes (Ben and Alicia, Peter and MJ, Wanda and Vision), there’s hope things work out here......

I’m of the mind to have a common foe that forces them to work out their lingering problems, like Mesmero, Arcade, the Shi’ar, Vulcan (who I don’t think Jean knows) Stryfe or Mojo (since he seems like the kind of lunatic to play councilor/ match maker lately

[phoenixzero23]

No more love triangles and making them work together, trust each other and having nice/funny interactions could be a start. (marvel has starved this ship for more than a decade)
I love this ship but yeah it has become synonimous of drama and nobody likes that.

people just want to read cute/positive/sexy stuff.

[Decoy]

No more love triangles and making them work together, trust each other and having nice/funny interactions could be a start. (marvel has starved this ship for more than a decade)
I love this ship but yeah it has become synonimous of drama and nobody likes that.

people just want to read cute/positive/sexy stuff.

Yeah, maybe if they return to this relationship (which is 50/50 at this point, but there’s hope.....sometimes hope is all even fictional characters need )they leave the drama for other couples, like Peter and MJ, let Scott and Jean be what they where......leave Emma out of it, or barely mention the dark years......(maybe they would get a Cyclops and Phoenix/ Marvel Girl/ Whatever Series......if only to have the cute/positive/ sexy (as sexy Marvel can get without Marvel Max having a X Book) couple stuff there, and have them operate as just teammates in a relationship in the Team Books......)

[Retcon]

I dunno about 50/50. I thought with the 05 Jott clearly into each other again and with Jean returning and actually still thinking about Scott that a Jott reunion would be inevitable. The writers clearly have other plans. I don’t understand how Scott being in a Bunker stopped Jean from finding him when she did a call to arms to all Mutants.

[Glio]

I dunno about 50/50. I thought with the 05 Jott clearly into each other again and with Jean returning and actually still thinking about Scott that a Jott reunion would be inevitable. The writers clearly have other plans. I don’t understand how Scott being in a Bunker stopped Jean from finding him when she did a call to arms to all Mutants.

Do we even know WHEN that bunker was?

Being Cable could be a 2118 bunker

[Omega Alpha]

Do we even know WHEN that bunker was?

Being Cable could be a 2118 bunker

Also, Kid Cable could just be blocking any telepathic contact. Plus, Jean just called people she knew were alive, hence why Logan didn't show up.

[Glio]

Also, Kid Cable could just be blocking any telepathic contact. Plus, Jean just called people she knew were alive, hence why Logan didn't show up.

Yes, Kid Cable was doing his horrible test, probably would have some measure so that Pixie would not come and take Scott to face Nate.

[Havok83]

Also, Kid Cable could just be blocking any telepathic contact. Plus, Jean just called people she knew were alive, hence why Logan didn't show up.

Jean knows Logan is alive.