John Stewart Appreciation 2019

[Vampire Savior]

You know, I remember a lot of fans complaining that John's inclusion was a similar slight to Hal in the same vein you're taking. Redoubled when he took Hal's usual moniker as the greatest GL.

John is a great character, but he's one of many Green Lanterns. Hell, Kyle WAS GL in that continuity and then they just went with John when it came time to do Justice League. It wasn't a slight to Kyle or Hal. John just fit better for their League.

There are multiple GLs and only Jessica fit the narrative they wanted to tell. It has nothing to do with the quality of story one can tell with John or his viability as a lead, both of which have been proven to be great in the right hands.

Come in off the ledge, bud.

The grievance has to do with people behind the scenes intentionally snubbing the character because someone back there does not like him. When it comes to this character, there is a very long suspicious looking history that suggests this may have been going on. Here we have a return to the DC Animated Universe Justice League, with the art style and voice actors of the popular show. Suspiciously, again, John Stewart is absent. In fact, the only time I've ever seen him appear in any of these direct to dvd films from DC is when he had a bit part in some Justice League Dark cartoon. I emphasize again, we now have a cartoon with a setting where we would expect to see him, and he's still absent. You think things like this keep happening to this major character from a very influential cartoon show just because? You think that DC somehow keeps passing over him to focus on characters who are WAY less recognized than him... because it just happens that way?
That's fine if you do, but I don't.

Rather than me "coming off the ledge", I think it would be better if DC treated one of their oldest, most recognized, and most popular Green Lanterns and POC characters better than they do. The constant passing over, bit parts, and rebuffs are very strange looking for a character of the stature of John Stewart, especially after his appearances on the Justice League cartoons.

[Cosmic Emerald 23]

The issue right now isn't really about them trying to replace John with Jessica, it's more about their odd (to say the least) way of handling their DCAU reunion movie. I believe so because Stewart wasn't the only one left out of this movie, it was also Flash, Hawkgirl, and Martian Manhunter.

HOWEVER, I'm keeping an eye on what they're doing because DC has already tried to kill John (not saying they're trying to kill him now) and replace him with another minority character (Simon Baz) in the past and the fans weren't havin' it. I wouldn't be surprised if they decided to place more emphasis on Jess in this new era of "wokeness", where a character having a vag automatically puts them at a higher advantage over all the other characters, just look at what they did to Finn in favor of Rey in the new Star Wars movies.

[Vampire Savior]

The issue right now isn't really about them trying to replace John with Jessica, it's more about their odd (to say the least) way of handling their DCAU reunion movie. I believe so because Stewart wasn't the only one left out of this movie, it was also Flash, Hawkgirl, and Martian Manhunter.

HOWEVER, I'm keeping an eye on what they're doing because DC has already tried to kill John (not saying they're trying to kill him now) and replace him with another minority character (Simon Baz) in the past and the fans weren't havin' it. I wouldn't be surprised if they decided to place more emphasis on Jess in this new era of "wokeness", where a character having a vag automatically puts them at a higher advantage over all the other characters, just look at what they did to Finn in favor of Rey in the new Star Wars movies.

I agree. I don't give these guys any wiggle room at this point. If they didn't have a super long history of bizarrely screwing over John Stewart, I wouldn't think anything of this.

But as I said before, if there is a GLC movie, and if Geoff Johns is writing it, don't be terribly surprised if the "rookie" winds up being Jessica Cruz instead of John Stewart. I'm not saying that will happen beyond a shadow of a doubt, but I definitely see the potential of it happening.

[Mr HardKnocks]

I agree. I don't give these guys any wiggle room at this point. If they didn't have a super long history of bizarrely screwing over John Stewart, I wouldn't think anything of this.

But as I said before, if there is a GLC movie, and if Geoff Johns is writing it, don't be terribly surprised if the "rookie" winds up being Jessica Cruz instead of John Stewart. I'm not saying that will happen beyond a shadow of a doubt, but I definitely see the potential of it happening.

I could see this but if it is John in the GLC movie then he’d be subservient to Hal Jordan. Geoff Johns doesn’t like John obviously and I imagine there will be parts in the film that make John look bad. Only way that’ll not happen if WB recognizes the value of John as DCs best black hero

[Vampire Savior]

I could see this but if it is John in the GLC movie then he’d be subservient to Hal Jordan. Geoff Johns doesn’t like John obviously and I imagine there will be parts in the film that make John look bad. Only way that’ll not happen if WB recognizes the value of John as DCs best black hero

People don't seem to want to believe this, but I have never seen anything to make me think otherwise. I guess we'll just have to wait and see how that will play out if the movie happens and if John is in it. But with John Stewart, his popularity doesn't seem to matter, his influential roles don't matter, how many actors want to play him doesn't seem to matter, DC doesn't ever seem to see much value in him. As for WB, I dunno'. I could see them differing to Geoff Johns, since they probably don't know anything about any of this Lantern stuff. And that should be quite alarming to a fan of John Stewart, since Johns has never displayed any care for the character, but loves Hal Jordan and has a vested interest in Jessica Cruz.

[Holt]

TBH, nothing about Jessica's creation ever struck me as having to do with undercutting or discrediting John. People have been pointing out none of the Earth Lanterns are women for years.

I could see this but if it is John in the GLC movie then he’d be subservient to Hal Jordan. Geoff Johns doesn’t like John obviously and I imagine there will be parts in the film that make John look bad. Only way that’ll not happen if WB recognizes the value of John as DCs best black hero

Johns is just the writer and the film will likely undergo rewrites since most scripts do anyway. It's all gonna come down to what the studio wants. If they are smart and want that Black Panther money, they're likely gonna insist on John not getting punked or made to look useless in his own movie.

[Frontier]

They didn't set out to make JLvsFF a DCAU movie. They were initially planning on using the Crisis on Two Earths designs (ironically a movie made from a re-purposed DCAU script), so the movie was never really planned to have anything to do with the DCAU until Timm thought it would be fun to re-use the designs and VA's.

TBH, nothing about Jessica's creation ever struck me as having to do with undercutting or discrediting John. People have been pointing out none of the Earth Lanterns are women for years.

Ironically we got a squirrel Green Lantern much sooner then we got an Earth woman

[Sodam Yat]

TBH, nothing about Jessica's creation ever struck me as having to do with undercutting or discrediting John. People have been pointing out none of the Earth Lanterns are women for years.

I'm leading to think it was part of an attempt to undermine the John Stewart character. And we're seeing it come full effect in JL vs FF. I think it's part of the reason why Johns created those characters. Johns never did anything for John Stewart during his nearly decade run on Green Lantern. The only time he used John Stewart was when he was written as a black best friend in Rebirth. These guys never wanted to capitalize on his character. He was the only one without a book, while Guy, Kyle, Hal had solos.

I don't have a problem with Jess being in media adaptions. What I have a problem with is that one of Johns' creations is being used as a replacement of John Stewart in one of the most beloved DCAU shows. Everyone knows that's the most popular role John ever had as a character. So it looks like they're trying to tear him down in the DCAU to make Jess more popular so everyone could get behind her and forget about John Stewart.

Johns is just the writer and the film will likely undergo rewrites since most scripts do anyway. It's all gonna come down to what the studio wants. If they are smart and want that Black Panther money, they're likely gonna insist on John not getting punked or made to look useless in his own movie.

I agree. I don't think Johns will get away hurting the character at WB, especially considering how minority leads are making bank in the box office these days.

[skyvolt2000]

Johns is just the writer and the film will likely undergo rewrites since most scripts do anyway. It's all gonna come down to what the studio wants. If they are smart and want that Black Panther money, they're likely gonna insist on John not getting punked or made to look useless in his own movie.

Bingo. See folks have to understand the comic book side can only get away with so much. The studio is not going to care about some direct to dvd film excluding folks. They will put that foot down when it comes to live action.


Jessica is filling in that void of the lack of females of color at DC that a long time ago Cassandra Cain held. She has nothing to do with John.

Remember Jessica co-starred in a 50 run book. A series that did BETTER than Hal's book in trades. She & Simon are not devaluing John.
When I sniff through bins-Jessica & Simon's run once you got past issue 7 and the final few with Hal did not pack bins. The Hal & TGLC PACKED bins. With some in those bins days after release.
Her run was the trades that got checked out at the libraries and sold here.
She is not devaluing John. She is in fact making a stronger case for John and the others. The public is saying we can support this franchise. Guess who is NOT listening.

You know, I remember a lot of fans complaining that John's inclusion was a similar slight to Hal in the same vein you're taking. Redoubled when he took Hal's usual moniker as the greatest GL.

Where is this stated that John is the greatest GL over Hal? Where is this book that has this along with Riri Williams was made to replace Storm, Duke Thomas ruined the Batman book and all the other made up stuff."

John Stewart fans are FED UP with excuses. They did EVERYTHING expected of them to support this character. Yet all they have seen over the last 15+ years is crap.

Where is the writer who is INTERESTED in John Stewart and is not just offering lip service. He or she MEANS it.

Why is this not an issue with Spider-man? Peter got a pack of books yet Miles fans are not throwing fits. Marvel is not burying SPider-Folks. When does BUSINESS take over fanboy love?

What is BEST for business of this franchise is EXPANSION. Not holding the franchise hostage forcing folks to choose certain GLs.
That cartoon show happened. Folks need to get over it. Jessica Cruz nor Hal nor Kyle is not going to get DC Black Panther money.

Folks are looking and asking why is there an issue with blacks on the comic book side of this company. Everyone else is stepping up but this company.
The crapping on Cyborg, Jason Rusch, John, Vixen & Duke is NOT helping.

We are not asking for solo books-we are asking for QUALITY usage.

Because that book is what SELLS the character. It gets you a line of folks wanting to write said character.
Bendis SOLD Luke Cage by using him. Priest sold Panther by using him. Kelly Sue Deconnick sold Carol Danvers.

Same needs to be done for not only John but a LOT of folks. Not flooding the market with Batman books.

[SecretWarrior]

[Mr HardKnocks]

I'm leading to think it was part of an attempt to undermine the John Stewart character. And we're seeing it come full effect in JL vs FF. I think it's part of the reason why Johns created those characters. Johns never did anything for John Stewart during his nearly decade run on Green Lantern. The only time he used John Stewart was when he was written as a black best friend in Rebirth. These guys never wanted to capitalize on his character. He was the only one without a book, while Guy, Kyle, Hal had solos.

I don't have a problem with Jess being in media adaptions. What I have a problem with is that one of Johns' creations is being used as a replacement of John Stewart in one of the most beloved DCAU shows. Everyone knows that's the most popular role John ever had as a character. So it looks like they're trying to tear him down in the DCAU to make Jess more popular so everyone could get behind her and forget about John Stewart.



I agree. I don't think Johns will get away hurting the character at WB, especially considering how minority leads are making bank in the box office these days.

Yes 100%, the greatest example is when they tried to kill John off years ago when Simon Baz was introduced and they received major backlash, even Phil Lamar spoke out. They may try again now that Baz and Cruz are taking off because there’s no variety in the Green Lanterns, 6 characters with the same powers and name can only go for so long somebody has to go or fade away.
Geoff Johns is going to do everything to push his favorite and his pet characters to the forefront. Justice League, Aquaman, Shazam, Wonder Woman 1/1984 were all involved with by Geoff Johns to some capacity. The screenplay of WW or being based on his comic runs JL, Shazam and Aquaman. I’m sure them royalty checks are high.

[Vampire Savior]

I believe Johns created Cruz because he couldn't achieve what he wanted with Baz. He upped the ante by creating a minority female with a mental disability.

I personally don't believe DC will try to kill John Stewart again. I think Guy Gardner, Kyle Rayner, or Simon Baz stand a much better chance of biting the dust. But I do think DC will go on not especially valuing the character, just using him in bit parts, and if he's lucky, he may be put on teams where he doesn't advance all that much as a character. Who knows what cinematic future John has, if he has one at all. I'm not especially excited about it, though.

If nothing else, the paranoia the fanbase has is a sign of the relationship DC has established with fans of this character. I don't put that on fans being weird and unreasonable. I think it's a natural response based on previous experience the fans have had with the company's use (or lack thereof) of the character... which isn't good. And having a wider view of things, I believe this is especially bad considering this is probably DC's most popular minority character.

[EsotericFailures]

Is there any evidence that Jessica Cruz was created to undermine John Stewart? Seems like someone decided it was a bad look for the Green Lantern franchise to only have guys at the centre stage (yes there are female members of the Corps but they're not human and therefore won't ever get the same attention) and Johns likes to create as much as possible so he'll be remembered for it. The latter bit seems to be the logic of Simon Baz as well, creating his own GL as his legacy just before he left. That was bad for Baz as he only got one arc of focus before being left in limbo for years. Cruz at least was developed in the main Justice League series.

Bruce Timm doesn't seem to care much about any of the individual Green Lanterns. He had Kyle Rayner originally in DCAU, then went to John Stewart, then made a Hal Jordan cartoon series and now has Jessica Cruz as the star in this movie. He seems fine with all of them, which is a healthier attitude for a creator to have than a super fanboy.

I wouldn't be surprised if Johns is rewriting the Green Lantern movie script for it to be about Jessica Cruz with Hal as a mentor. Female superhero movies do on average better than male superhero movies at this point and Johns likes having his work in these movies (it's all over Aquaman and Shazam). I don't think there's a conspiracy against Stewart but there aren't any people in DC who are pushing for him other than maybe Scott Snyder. It's downright criminal that Guy Gardner got more comics dedicated to him than John Stewart at the height of Green Lanternmania.

[Sodam Yat]

Yes 100%, the greatest example is when they tried to kill John off years ago when Simon Baz was introduced and they received major backlash, even Phil Lamar spoke out. They may try again now that Baz and Cruz are taking off because there’s no variety in the Green Lanterns, 6 characters with the same powers and name can only go for so long somebody has to go or fade away.
Geoff Johns is going to do everything to push his favorite and his pet characters to the forefront. Justice League, Aquaman, Shazam, Wonder Woman 1/1984 were all involved with by Geoff Johns to some capacity. The screenplay of WW or being based on his comic runs JL, Shazam and Aquaman. I’m sure them royalty checks are high.

Agreed. I think John Stewart is in a safer spot currently. I don't think they're going to try to kill him off. There's been a backlash about it and I don't see that happening again. The only reason why John Stewart is in a decent spot right now (in JL) is because you have a big writer decided to use him. Seeing what happened in JL vs FF, it seems like a real possibility that Geoff Johns would try to pitch WB to use Jess instead of John Stewart. He seems like the type of guy that would do something like that. It's making me nervous. I'm getting tired of him disrespecting John Stewart fans.

[The tall man]

When it comes to popular fiction, fantasy, sci-fi and comics in general who has had it the worst; female characters or black males? I would not put it past DC to play down John in favor of Jessica. He's currently in the background in JL while Jess is prominent in Odessey. Nowadays most movies, tv shows, books and comics feature female as the leads/stars than black males by a wide margin. So John Stewart fans have good reasons too be concerned when they see his character being marginalized in favor of newcomer Cruz. Especially when he has such a rich background that can be mined for great stories. But in this era of women empowerment and girl power black males like John will be stuck playing second fiddle.