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  1. #1411
    Mighty Member 9th.'s Avatar
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    I thought Venditti was praised for writing John in GLC, was that a different person? ��
    Reading list: Far Sector (DC), Marauders (Marvel), X-Force (Marvel), X-Men (Marvel), Miles Morales: Spider-Man (Marvel), Venom (Marvel), My Hero Academia (VIZ), Killadelphia (Image), Bitter Root (Image), Black Hammer: Age of Doom (Darkhorse)

  2. #1412
    Extraordinary Member Johnny's Avatar
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    According to the DC collections catalogue, John will appear in second volume of the Green Lantern Earth One series. Not surprising given that Gabriel Hardman previously said he was a fan of the character and planned to use him in a potential sequel.



    Hal Jordan and John Stewart must team up to save the last Green Lantern Guardian from an evil force!

    Manhunters, alien races, rings of power--it's a lot for the people of Earth to absorb. Especially when an interplanetary incident forces their protector, Hal Jordan, to leave on a rescue mission that results in the discovery that there's a new player in the galaxy: Yellow Lanterns!

    While they seem a benign force for peace, Jordan can't get comfortable with how much power they wield, or their bizarre, lockstep behavior. When fellow Earthling John Stewart ends up with a yellow ring, he and Hal must work together to confront the being who destroyed the original Green Lantern Corps--the last surviving Guardian.

    Corinna Bechko and Gabriel Hardman feature two of the most famous DC characters, Hal Jordan and John Stewart, like you've never seen them before!

  3. #1413
    Incredible Member Vampire Savior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 9th. View Post
    I thought Venditti was praised for writing John in GLC, was that a different person? ��
    You're probably thinking of Van Jensen, who did a pretty good job of writing John Stewart. Although, I'm not as enthusiastic about his work as some. There are some problems I have with it. I think the Durlans weren't really a strong antagonist, or at least were not presented as strongly as they could have been. Part of the problem was that there were no central characters among the Durlan villains to connect with. They were just an amorphous group, and they weren't presented strongly enough to work well like that...like, say, the antagonists in Aliens were. That's a problem Green Lantern often has. Qwardians are just a group with basically no notable characters among them. Ditto the Manhunters and Spider Guild. I have my criticisms of Geoff Johns, but at least he knew not to stuff his gangs like the Sinestro Corps and Red Lanterns with nothing but a bunch of faceless mooks. I think that hurt Jensen's work and he should have done better there. Antagonists are vitally important for stories like these, and if you screw them up...well...your story is a lot weaker for it.

    There were some things out of his control that really hurt his run, like having to go along with Robert Venditti's dumb "Lights Out" event, and having to get sidetracked by things like Batman Zero Year and Futures End. I don't really blame him for that stuff, but it hurts the run, regardless.

    All that said, I'd say Van Jensen's run is pretty essential for someone looking for material with John Stewart in comics. It's not the best they would find, in my opinion (I think the 80s John-led Green Lantern comics and Mosaic are better), but it's still a pretty important run for John, if for no other reason than it's one of the rare stints where John Stewart actually gets to be the lead of something. Though, as is always the case, it doesn't last very long, relatively speaking. Speaking generally, I think the Jensen run is just "pretty decent". Somewhere above "Okay", but lesser than "Great" or even "Really Good." Though someone specifically looking for John Stewart would no doubt get an added boost of enjoyment just from seeing him leading the comics.

  4. #1414
    Mighty Member Iconic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny View Post
    According to the DC collections catalogue, John will appear in second volume of the Green Lantern Earth One series. Not surprising given that Gabriel Hardman previously said he was a fan of the character and planned to use him in a potential sequel.

    Hmm...I wasn’t interested in volume one but I may have to pick volume two up.

  5. #1415
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iconic View Post
    Hmm...I wasn’t interested in volume one but I may have to pick volume two up.
    I have the opposite reaction. John as second fiddle and yellow lantern? Pass. The Earth One Superman books, Batman books, and Teen Titans book weren't good. DC flubbed the opportunity IMO.

  6. #1416
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 9th. View Post
    I thought Venditti was praised for writing John in GLC, was that a different person? ��
    He definitely wrote John better then he wrote Hal at times (pre-Rebirth).

  7. #1417
    Extraordinary Member Johnny's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SecretWarrior View Post
    I have the opposite reaction. John as second fiddle and yellow lantern? Pass. The Earth One Superman books, Batman books, and Teen Titans book weren't good. DC flubbed the opportunity IMO.
    I think it's still worth mentioning the power rings don't work the same way in this version. In this story the Lanterns aren't chosen by the rings, Hal just stumbled upon it and used it to save his life. In E1 noone needs to be worthy of a power ring and be able to overcome fear, it's literally used as a weapon that anyone can come across and abuse their power if they wanted to. The yellow rings probably don't have the same function as the originals as well and likely don't operate on instilling fear, so it would be interesting to see how John would wield a ring with another color differently from the way Hal does.
    Last edited by Johnny; 11-20-2019 at 08:32 AM.

  8. #1418
    Astonishing Member Sodam Yat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vampire Savior View Post
    Me? Uh...why?

    Robert Venditti is a very poor writer. His pacing is slow as molasses. His stories are anti-climactic. His characterization is dull. His plots and concepts are bad (let me remind folks of the Emotional Reservoir). He's just bad. The best I can say about him is that he usually never does anything outrageously terrible...but, when I think about it...he does. Green Lanterns are destroying the universe every time they used their rings. WHAT!?!?!?!?

    I know I say a lot of bad stuff. I wish I could say more positive things, but DC just doesn't really give me a lot of reason to a lot of the time. And if little ol' me can literally do a better job than them, there's no way I'm going to, you know, let their stuff slide.

    Since you been very critical towards Scott Snyder, I was wondering would Robert Venditti be better in writing John Stewart, compared to Scott Snyder in this JL run.

  9. #1419
    Astonishing Member Sodam Yat's Avatar
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    As far as John Stewart making an appearance and playing some role in Green Lantern Earth One: Volume 2. Sounds nice, but I won't be supporting it and this writer.

    When John Stewart gets mentioned in these solicitations, sometimes it does sound promising, like when he was mentioned in that Darkseid War Special by Tom King. That shitty book was misleading. And it's very upsetting to see John Stewart being out of character just to make Hal Jordan look good. How do we know this won't be any different than that Darkseid War One Shot?

    The reason why I also won't be supporting this writer is because he prefers Hal Jordan over John Stewart. Nothing wrong with that. That's his right and his opinion. But there's been a history where these writers who prefer other Green Lanterns over John Stewart, is where there's always usually this same plot like John Stewart is in trouble and need to be rescued by X Green Lantern character! It's usually a tendency so their preferred white character to look superior over this black character. You seen this happened with Geoff Johns, Tom King, Tony Bedard, and Peter Tomasi.

    I also didn't like Gabriel Hardman's interview either. I felt it was a poor excuse. He should've just said that Hal Jordan is his favorite. Man up and admitted it. At least Ethan Van Sciver has.

    Also, considering how John Stewart is a yellow lantern is another red flag for me. They rather John to be something else other than a Green Lantern. I've heard similar comments from fans of Hal Jordan during the Robert Venditti era, where they wanted John to be some indigo lantern so Hal can be the only Green Lantern. I'm pretty sure this writer has the same thought process as well.

    So no, I won't be buying or supporting this book. I'm sure even if John has a decent role in it, he'll just play the black best friend supporting role one upping Hal everywhere in that book.

    I rather put my money elsewhere.

  10. #1420
    Incredible Member Vampire Savior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sodam Yat View Post
    Since you been very critical towards Scott Snyder, I was wondering would Robert Venditti be better in writing John Stewart, compared to Scott Snyder in this JL run.
    Oh. I feel my criticisms of Scott Snyder's Justice League run are 10,000% accurate, and I think this late in the game, people should be able to see that for themselves. I hope it goes to show when I make some "depressing" post or whatever, it's not just me saying stuff. I've read enough of these comics and enough of these characters to see certain...patterns, and I knew pretty early on that regardless of whatever Snyder may have said, he didn't have much at all in store for John Stewart and his JL run would be just another JL run with John Stewart not doing anything that matters.

    As for Robert Venditti, as I said, I think he's an exceptionally poor writer, but I don't know how he will handle John Stewart in Justice League. I would say expect more of the same. His run is probably going to be filler, so probably nothing too substantial will happen with anyone or anything. Even when he was trying to get John over in his Green Lantern comics by making him the leader of the GLC, he still managed to put forward an especially boring John Stewart. A cardboard black man with little emotion, no interest in anything besides leading the GLC, no sex drive, no relationships with anyone romantic or otherwise, no flaws, and he usually stayed in a command center. He was what I would call an incomplete character for someone who is supposed to be somewhat of a leading character. A boringly safe black man. You could even say a Gordon Goodbrother.

    When John Stewart gets mentioned in these solicitations, sometimes it does sound promising, like when he was mentioned in that Darkseid War Special by Tom King. That shitty book was misleading. And it's very upsetting to see John Stewart being out of character just to make Hal Jordan look good. How do we know this won't be any different than that Darkseid War One Shot?

    The reason why I also won't be supporting this writer is because he prefers Hal Jordan over John Stewart. Nothing wrong with that. That's his right and his opinion. But there's been a history where these writers who prefer other Green Lanterns over John Stewart, is where there's always usually this same plot like John Stewart is in trouble and need to be rescued by X Green Lantern character! It's usually a tendency so their preferred white character to look superior over this black character. You seen this happened with Geoff Johns, Tom King, Tony Bedard, and Peter Tomasi.
    What you said is actually surprisingly true if you go through the years of Green Lantern comics. John is often needing to be saved by Hal Jordan, Kyle Rayner, or someone. Like in this storyline, John is captured really early on, and he needs Hal and Guy to save him, who get to do the adventuring while John is incapacitated for most of the story.







    It's part of why it's difficult for me to really get behind a character like that. He's written too often as a supporting character to benefit another character's story, or he's generally incompetent, or written very boring, and he's depressing, forever going on about how his life sucks. That's just not fun to read.

  11. #1421

  12. #1422
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vampire Savior View Post
    Oh. I feel my criticisms of Scott Snyder's Justice League run are 10,000% accurate, and I think this late in the game, people should be able to see that for themselves. I hope it goes to show when I make some "depressing" post or whatever, it's not just me saying stuff. I've read enough of these comics and enough of these characters to see certain...patterns, and I knew pretty early on that regardless of whatever Snyder may have said, he didn't have much at all in store for John Stewart and his JL run would be just another JL run with John Stewart not doing anything that matters.

    As for Robert Venditti, as I said, I think he's an exceptionally poor writer, but I don't know how he will handle John Stewart in Justice League. I would say expect more of the same. His run is probably going to be filler, so probably nothing too substantial will happen with anyone or anything. Even when he was trying to get John over in his Green Lantern comics by making him the leader of the GLC, he still managed to put forward an especially boring John Stewart. A cardboard black man with little emotion, no interest in anything besides leading the GLC, no sex drive, no relationships with anyone romantic or otherwise, no flaws, and he usually stayed in a command center. He was what I would call an incomplete character for someone who is supposed to be somewhat of a leading character. A boringly safe black man. You could even say a Gordon Goodbrother.



    What you said is actually surprisingly true if you go through the years of Green Lantern comics. John is often needing to be saved by Hal Jordan, Kyle Rayner, or someone. Like in this storyline, John is captured really early on, and he needs Hal and Guy to save him, who get to do the adventuring while John is incapacitated for most of the story.







    It's part of why it's difficult for me to really get behind a character like that. He's written too often as a supporting character to benefit another character's story, or he's generally incompetent, or written very boring, and he's depressing, forever going on about how his life sucks. That's just not fun to read.
    I actually had to look up Gordon Goodbrother, lol!

    I did not realize a phrase existed for boring, but heroic black males in fiction.

    I tend to agree with a lot of your posts.

    John only felt unique with his first appearance, and when Steve Englehart wrote him back in the 1980's.

  13. #1423
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    It would be great if a writer can go back, and bring John's edge back. If you read his first appearance, John seemed very unpredictable. Even then, John was always a methodical planner, his abrasive nature was just his poker face.

    Funny enough, the abrasive nature was seemingly transferred over to Guy.

    Obviously, I can do without the over the top way Denny initially wrote John.

    I'd rather see a blending of the Denny/Neal Adams version with the Steve Englehart incarnation.

    The Englehart version was strong, smart, had a sense of humor, knew when to ask for help, and was open with his feelings.

    I can do without the Marine version.

  14. #1424
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony Shaw View Post
    I actually had to look up Gordon Goodbrother, lol!

    I did not realize a phrase existed for boring, but heroic black males in fiction.

    I tend to agree with a lot of your posts.

    John only felt unique with his first appearance, and when Steve Englehart wrote him back in the 1980's.
    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony Shaw View Post
    It would be great if a writer can go back, and bring John's edge back. If you read his first appearance, John seemed very unpredictable. Even then, John was always a methodical planner, his abrasive nature was just his poker face.

    Funny enough, the abrasive nature was seemingly transferred over to Guy.

    Obviously, I can do without the over the top way Denny initially wrote John.

    I'd rather see a blending of the Denny/Neal Adams version with the Steve Englehart incarnation.

    The Englehart version was strong, smart, had a sense of humor, knew when to ask for help, and was open with his feelings.

    I can do without the Marine version.
    His original outspoken appearance is what inspired his personality in the cartoon.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bruce Timm View Post
    Another reason why we chose him: literally, out of all the Green Lanterns we could have chosen, we all kind of liked the John Stewart character from the comics, especially the Denny O’Neil / Neal Adams version. When they first introduced him he was like the angry young black guy…you know, in 1969 and 1970. Even though that’s not really relevant today—like the whole Black Power movement and everything—we still wanted to keep that kind of edge and attitude with him.

    And so, just in banging around ideas of what to do with him, going back to the original idea of the Green Lantern Corps—where they’re basically Lensmen [the pulp characters created by E.E. “Doc” Smith]—they’re space cops, they’re space marines. We’re like, “Okay, he’s a military guy.” And then somebody said, “Louis Gossett Jr.—An Officer and a Gentlemen.” I said, “Yeah,” and I went, “Wait a minute—Samuel L. Jackson,” and everyone went, “Yeah!” So that’s kind of who he is. He’s a real rugged, no-nonsense, barking orders kind of Green Lantern—and we love him to pieces. We love him so much [that] he’s like in almost every episode. I predict that you guys are going to love him too.

    ...

    “We could have gone with Hal Jordan—and he was a great character in the comics—but, in terms of personalities, we wanted to make sure that we had a really good mix of some characters who were a little bit more jokey and some characters who were a little more, y’know, whatever. And so, we felt that having a Green Lantern with a real good, solid edge to him would be interesting for drama (courtesy of the Justice League: Justice on Trial DVD).”

    ...

    “One of the things we really wanted to avoid was having a group of characters who were all pretty much interchangeable. Going back and rereading a lot of the Silver Age Justice League comics, they really are all the same character—Batman [had] no different a voice than Superman or Flash. They’re all kind of the same character; the only thing that differentiates them is what colors they’re wearing and what powers they have. So we really wanted to make sure they had a much more interesting group dynamic than that and that they all had different personalities. Going back to the original version of John Stewart from Denny O’Neil and Neal Adams’ day, the thing that made him interesting to us was that he was quite a bit more of a badass. If you go back and read those, he comes across as a stereotypical, angry, young black man. We knew we didn’t want to do that exactly, but we still wanted to keep a little bit of that edge to him so that he would be one of the more strident of the characters. We hit upon the idea of the Green Lanterns being kind of a paramilitary force, so we said, ‘Ah, marine. Okay, Louis Gossett Jr., Samuel Jackson.’ So that became our take on him (courtesy of Modern Masters: Bruce Timm).”
    Quote Originally Posted by Phil LaMarr View Post
    “In my mind, the John Stewart on Justice League [still] the [character created by Denny O’Neil and Neal Adams]; he just has gone through a military life as well. I think he is a little older, but he still has that level of energy. He suffers no fools and he’s still very no-nonsense, but he’s also a little tempered. This is also a different time, too. The social wounds aren’t as raw, so the anger is not as present (courtesy of Back Issue Magazine).”
    http://jl.popgeeks.com/lantern/lantern.htm

    Yes, they're different, but both versions made John outspoken in their own way. Van Jensen brought this back in John's New 52 origin and in Zero Year.





    He had an edge in the 80s too:



    John's outspokenness is only played down when writers want to designate Hal or Guy as the outspoken one. I like that John can be thoughtful and diplomatic and that he prefers not to wing, but he definitely needs to show a range of emotion and to vocally oppose BS. I think that's the core of his original appearance anyway.
    Last edited by SecretWarrior; 11-20-2019 at 11:34 AM.

  15. #1425

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