Laura Kinney: X-23 Appreciation 2019

[Beaubier]

Honestly, is it REALLY all that big of a status quo change? If you look at the rosters, other than Hellions for the most part it's still the exact same characters as ever getting the focus. A book needs a New X-Man? Oh hey, look, it's Quentin @$%ing Quire and Glob.

It’s a status quo change in the sense that mutants aren’t facing yet another extinction event, and it’s not just more doom and gloom. But otherwise, I agree. The X-office hasn’t given us much in the way of unique rosters and are still “playing it safe” with rosters.

[pkingdom]

It’s a status quo change in the sense that mutants aren’t facing yet another extinction event, and it’s not just more doom and gloom. But otherwise, I agree. The X-office hasn’t given us much in the way of unique rosters and are still “playing it safe” with rosters.

I'd disagree with you on the doom and gloom and the extinction plot too. The series makes it seem like extinction is inevitable and all of the stuff they are doing is to try to prevent it. People keep saying its hopeful and optimistic, except it really isn't? They're hated more than ever and have given up on even really trying to fix that.

[Tycon]

I'd disagree with you on the doom and gloom and the extinction plot too. The series makes it seem like extinction is inevitable and all of the stuff they are doing is to try to prevent it. People keep saying its hopeful and optimistic, except it really isn't? They're hated more than ever and have given up on even really trying to fix that.

No, they aren’t. There are cults across the world worshipping them, groups of human allies that work alongside Xavier, and countries that recognize their legitimacy. A lot of these Krakoa ires are based in headcanon.

[DAHX]

I'd disagree with you on the doom and gloom and the extinction plot too. The series makes it seem like extinction is inevitable and all of the stuff they are doing is to try to prevent it. People keep saying its hopeful and optimistic, except it really isn't? They're hated more than ever and have given up on even really trying to fix that.

Given that all of the dead mutants who were killed in genocide are alive again, and every mutant who lost someone is together with their loved ones, I think we can say that the current state is hopeful and optimistic. We haven't really seen how the outside world thinks of Krakoa yet or that the extinction that Moira think is inevitable will ever happen. Just because there are some groups who want the end of Krakoa and keep attacking them doesn't mean they will succeed. Hickman said he doesn't want to do that destruction that the previous writers did, so I think we just need to wait a few years or for the end of the era to know for sure what direction it really goes.

[pkingdom]

Given that all of the dead mutants who were killed in genocide are alive again, and every mutant who lost someone is together with their loved ones, I think we can say that the current state is hopeful and optimistic. We haven't really seen how the outside world thinks of Krakoa yet or that the extinction that Moira think is inevitable will ever happen. Just because there are some groups who want the end of Krakoa and keep attacking them doesn't mean they will succeed. Hickman said he doesn't want to do that destruction that the previous writers did, so I think we just need to wait a few years or for the end of the era to know for sure what direction it really goes.

That's fair. I wish we were seeing people reuniting with loved ones and just being together again. Parties don't count. That's why I said it feels more told not shown. And it also depends on how you view the clones. If they are legit resurrections that's optimistic. If its fake clones programed to act like dead people, that's dark as hell.

Reminds me of the Vision family miniseries a while back. Vin Vision died, and Vision explicitly decided not to 'revive' him by making an imprint of him on a new robot body because he knew it wouldn't really be him.

[Tycon]

-Banshee and Emma
-Esme, Sophie, and the Three-In-One
-Tag and Hellions
-Wither and Hellions
-Synch and Gen X
-Skin and Gen X
-Banshee and Gen X
-Wolf Cub and Academy X
-Wolfsbane and Cypher
-Mondo and Black Tom
-Vanisher and Elixir
-Sunspot and New Mutants
-Strong Guy and Multiple Man
-Multiple Man and Monet
-Multiple Man and Layla Miller
-Daken and X-23
-Caliban and Warpath
-Bedlam and Domino
-Esme and Honey Badger
-Mammomax and Erg
-Siryn and Monet


I get the desire to see all these reunions and reconnections but....what book do y’all think that’s happening in? Why spend so much time trying to do so much fanservice rather than move forward and just know that everyone’s back and on the same page. It’s a reasonable trade-off for every dead mutant being back in the land of the living.

[Malachi]

-Banshee and Emma
-Esme, Sophie, and the Three-In-One
-Tag and Hellions
-Wither and Hellions
-Synch and Gen X
-Skin and Gen X
-Banshee and Gen X
-Wolf Cub and Academy X
-Wolfsbane and Cypher
-Mondo and Black Tom
-Vanisher and Elixir
-Sunspot and New Mutants
-Strong Guy and Multiple Man
-Multiple Man and Monet
-Multiple Man and Layla Miller
-Daken and X-23
-Caliban and Warpath
-Bedlam and Domino
-Esme and Honey Badger
-Mammomax and Erg
-Siryn and Monet


I get the desire to see all these reunions and reconnections but....what book do y’all think that’s happening in? Why spend so much time trying to do so much fanservice rather than move forward and just know that everyone’s back and on the same page. It’s a reasonable trade-off for every dead mutant being back in the land of the living.

Don't see it as fanservice. It's payoff for stories being told over years. I think there is more off an reaction because we have seemingly gone in a extreme direction with close to zero interactions. The same if we had some writer compulsively showing us every character reunions.

[Tycon]

Don't see it as fanservice. It's payoff for stories being told over years. I think there is more off an reaction because we have seemingly gone in a extreme direction with close to zero interactions. The same if we had some writer compulsively showing us every character reunions.

We’ve barely opened up the new era, what zero interactions are you talking about? We can still see interactions between characters but that’s not what people are upset about, it’s that there are no reunions between revived characters and their friends. But we see with titles like New Mutants that mutants like Synch and Monet are still close and their relationship is still treated as important.

[spirit2011]

Don't see it as fanservice. It's payoff for stories being told over years. I think there is more off an reaction because we have seemingly gone in a extreme direction with close to zero interactions. The same if we had some writer compulsively showing us every character reunions.

I don't need to see it all, but they are important. How much time Logan is back and we still don't have a scene with him, Laura and Gabby?
it become a really big joke at this point

[Tycon]

I don't need to see it all, but they are important. How much time Logan is back and we still don't have a scene with him, Laura and Gabby?
it become a really big joke at this point

I don’t get me wrong, X-Office really flopped by not giving us well-meaning reunions with Ororo and Logan or Logan and his kids, but it would fill up too much time to do so many reunion beats. I’m sure Percy will give Laura, Daken, Gabby, and Logan some great family moments. Hopefully...

[Malachi]

We’ve barely opened up the new era, what zero interactions are you talking about? We can still see interactions between characters but that’s not what people are upset about, it’s that there are no reunions between revived characters and their friends. But we see with titles like New Mutants that mutants like Synch and Monet are still close and their relationship is still treated as important.

I'm talking about reunions.

Hickman has stated that he will not focus on these reunions in interviews. He has given us the vague non-answer that they might do so in flashbacks in the future. Now he has every right to do what he wants. It's pretty clear where his priorities lies and as the showrunner on X-men he has greatly influenced this "policy". Perhaps mostly by choosing writers who seem to share his storytelling vision/sensebility.

[Tycon]

I'm talking about reunions.

Hickman has stated that he will not focus on these reunions in interviews. He has given us the vague non-answer that they might do so in flashbacks in the future. Now he has every right to do what he wants. It's pretty clear where his priorities lies and as the showrunner on X-men he has greatly influenced this "policy". Perhaps mostly by choosing writers who seem to share his storytelling vision/sensebility.

I’m aware of all of this.

[Digifiend]

That's fair. I wish we were seeing people reuniting with loved ones and just being together again. Parties don't count. That's why I said it feels more told not shown. And it also depends on how you view the clones. If they are legit resurrections that's optimistic. If its fake clones programed to act like dead people, that's dark as hell.

Reminds me of the Vision family miniseries a while back. Vin Vision died, and Vision explicitly decided not to 'revive' him by making an imprint of him on a new robot body because he knew it wouldn't really be him.

Presumably this is also why Jonas Vision of the Young Avengers wasn't brought back? He and Cassie Lang both died in Avengers: The Children's Crusade. Cassie was later resurrected (by Doctor Doom, who killed her in the first place!) but Jonas wasn't, even though being a synthezoid, it ought to be much easier. The original Vision was actually dead throughout the time Jonas was active (that's why Jonas was killed off, the original Vision had just been rebuilt and editorial didn't want two of them running around) - so Vision is actually a hypocrite, since he certainly doesn't think he isn't the same person he was before Avengers Disassembled.

[spirit2011]

Presumably this is also why Jonas Vision of the Young Avengers wasn't brought back? He and Cassie Lang both died in Avengers: The Children's Crusade. Cassie was later resurrected (by Doctor Doom, who killed her in the first place!) but Jonas wasn't, even though being a synthezoid, it ought to be much easier. The original Vision was actually dead throughout the time Jonas was active (that's why Jonas was killed off, the original Vision had just been rebuilt and editorial didn't want two of them running around) - so Vision is actually a hypocrite, since he certainly doesn't think he isn't the same person he was before Avengers Disassembled.

Well Tony Stark is revealed dead and the one that is in the books now i sonly a AI

I don’t get me wrong, X-Office really flopped by not giving us well-meaning reunions with Ororo and Logan or Logan and his kids, but it would fill up too much time to do so many reunion beats. I’m sure Percy will give Laura, Daken, Gabby, and Logan some great family moments. Hopefully...

Yeah it was wrong skip reunions. People have been waiting for it for some time. I really hope Percy can give the wolverine family good interactions

[Dthirds3]

It just hit me but thanks to history of the marvl university, adamantium agenda retcon has been retconed