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  1. #2146
    ♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦ Godlike13's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OWL45 View Post
    Tom King sacrificed Dick to further his own Batman story and has gotten a pass. What gets me is that DC seems to be jumping ship on his run but what he has done to Nightwing will take a lot to correct. The character has literally been set back and it doesn’t look like this will be an easy fix. That fact that they let him do this in the first place speaks volumes about the lack of value they see in the character.
    As does how they have let the Nightwing team produce such lazy trash, with no end in sight. Not even DC’s lowest performing characters see this kind of unopposed poor editorial and creative effort and performance. They have allowed these editors and their go to creators to take their top selling Bat family member and turn him into their lowest selling Bat family member. Dick is so screwed.
    Last edited by Godlike13; 05-25-2019 at 02:18 PM.

  2. #2147
    Incredible Member WonderNight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Godlike13 View Post
    As does the how they have let the Nightwing team produce such lazy trash, with no end in sight. Not even DC’s lowest performing characters see this kind of unopposed poor editorial and creative effort and performance. They have allowed these editors and their go to creators to take their top selling Bat family member and turn him into their lowest selling Bat family member. Dick is so screwed.
    move nightwing to another franchise or ip or something. The bat family is bloated and the office dont what him.

    It's like sports if the team doesn't want them trade him.
    Last edited by WonderNight; 05-23-2019 at 11:28 PM.

  3. #2148
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    At this point I agree. If no one in the current Bat office can find the time, or be bothered to put forth a real effort to try and produce a book with him of any real quality. Then put him in an office and under people who maybe can. Cause you can’t tell me the current people on his book are actually trying, and if they are well then DC has a different problem. But at the same time the Bat office probably don’t want to give Nightwing up. It’s still consistent work, and seemingly consistent work with no standards or accountability. Why would they want to give that up.

  4. #2149
    Incredible Member WonderNight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Godlike13 View Post
    At this point I agree. If no one in the current Bat office can find the time, or be bothered to put forth a real effort to try and produce a book with him of any real quality. Then put him in an office and under people who maybe can. Cause you can’t tell me the current people on his book are actually trying, and if they are well then DC has a different problem. But at the same time the Bat office probably don’t want to give Nightwing up. It’s still consistent work, and seemingly consistent work with no standards or accountability. Why would they want to give that up.
    Why would they give it up...dont know. Need ot give it up...hell yea! Plus nightwing leaving would on up more room with the other bat characters! Maybe kate could get a new book to go with her tv show or a new tim or daiman book etc. But nightwing would be free of the bat office that dont want him, the bloated family that leaves him with no niche (right now nightwing is just male batgirl or bat vigilante number 12) and stops him from being isolated from the rest of the dcu.

  5. #2150
    Spectacular Member Schumiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zaresh View Post
    I wouldn't give it too much thought in any case: the story is there to point other stuff, like Jason being stubborn and Dick being at odds with Bruce.

    That is the problem though, isn't it, Lobdell didn't give it any real thought or care. He wanted a "funny" store where Jason and Dick had a rough start from the beginning and have a bit of a rivary/misunderstanding thing going on and went with the first thing that popped in his mind without a care as to what it means overall, how it potrays Alfred and what it means for Dick and Jason's "place" in Bat-family... It is something very basic but fundamental that these boys have their own place - and a room is very much a symbol of it. They are not interchangable as "Robins". They were not just mere guests in Bruce's life staying in the "guest room" which can be used by anyone currently a "guest". It undermines their relationship and importance as a person. It is very much a big deal... And a writer should be able to see that and take care not to make such mistakes, it is their JOB as professionals to give their stories and characterization some deep thought. This was plain lazy.

    I don't know if this has to do with Lobdell simply hating writing for Dick and so tuning it in where Dick is concerned and just going with the first lazy idea that comes into his mind. He has more care with Jason and does a better job when he is writing just for him, but then he is Jason's permanent writer, it is his project. It would also explan why Ric is such a dismal story. Lobdell got handed a job to write for a character he could care less about at the last minute who he knows he won't have to write long term, just temporary fill in till DC finds some perm writer for it, and sure wasn't going to waste any time to delve deep into the character to really make a story about who he is at the core (as he was promising in the interviews). Instead he went for the basic thing he knew about the character "he is a circus boy!" and wrote him as a drifter with no direction and home or real job who just exists because he sees, I guess, that as a natural extension of being a "gypsy" and coming from the "circus" with muscle memory and Dick's tendency to be heroic thrown in, because this is comics and characters are expected to go into action and do something heroic from time to time even if reluctantly and all the time complaining about it.

  6. #2151
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    Quote Originally Posted by Restingvoice View Post
    Damian is the angry one.
    Dick being the generic leader is too kind. He's the sexy one.
    Is damian the angry one or is that Jason,

    due to him being 10-13 he tends to be just bratty and they wash over all his development over the years

    so yes its best when they are not all togther but becasue of that Tim and Dick interaction have been minimal over the 10 years
    which why Tim and Jason have been so buddy buddy

  7. #2152
    Spectacular Member Schumiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nightbird View Post
    Letís say that 90% of comic book writers actually bad writers. What characters represent and the world they live on is entertaining and addictive, but there is a reason, why comics lost their popularity these days. Story structure sucks, characters not consistent, logically a lot of moments make no sense, most of the times there is no emotional punch to whatís happening.
    What happened to Dick just quintessential moment why comics will never benefit from how popular movies based on them became nowadays.
    I don't know if they are really bad writers but there is certainly a problem... You have fanfic writers who are not professionals doing much better jobs than these so-called professionals in terms of characterizaton and continuity and logic after all. I don't know if it is because they have too many projects they need to deal with so are able to do only a half-assed job at most, or after a while they loose their zeal for writing (because editorial keeps shutting down their more creative ideas, because of workload, because after so many years in an industry you find yourself exhausted and bored etc etc) and just going through the actions of it for the paycheck...

  8. #2153
    Anyone. Anywhere.Anytime. Arsenal's Avatar
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    Lobdell cant hate Dick that much if he had an Amazon and Superman clone job to KGBeast so Dick can pull off the last minute save.

  9. #2154
    Spectacular Member Schumiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arsenal View Post
    Lobdell cant hate Dick that much if he had an Amazon and Superman clone job to KGBeast so Dick can pull off the last minute save.
    Using a character because you know he is likely to boost interest in your issue or because he works within that stroy is not same as being invested in that character or having particular care for him.. And the way I remember it, Dick failed to take down KGBeast and it was actually the Amazon and the Superman Clone who beat him in the end. Dick got to surprise attack him and won them time though.

  10. #2155
    Astonishing Member Pohzee's Avatar
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    Can we not pretend that feats are worth anything in regards to competency in writing a character?
    It's the Dynamic Duo! Batman and Robin!... and Red Robin and Red Hood and Nightwing and Batwoman and Batgirl and Orphan and Spoiler and Bluebird and Lark and Gotham Girl and Talon and Batwing and Huntress and Azreal and Flamebird and Batcow?

    Since when could just anybody do what we trained to do? It makes it all dumb instead of special. Like it doesn't matter anymore.
    -Dick Grayson (Batman Inc.)


  11. #2156
    Astonishing Member Pohzee's Avatar
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    https://www.dccomics.com/blog/2019/0...at-cat-romance

    Haha sounds like we get to look forward to more of the same for Nightwing! Yes!

    “We’re excited for fans to get more of what they love from DC,” said Harras. “With JoŽlle Jones continuing on CATWOMAN, a new creative team on BATMAN, plus titles like DETECTIVE COMICS, BATGIRL, NIGHTWING, RED HOOD: OUTLAW and BATMAN AND THE OUTSIDERS, our Gotham City protectors and the talent behind them will continue to offer great stories that cater to the tastes of as many Bat-fans as possible in 2020 and beyond.”
    Last edited by Pohzee; 05-24-2019 at 03:06 PM.
    It's the Dynamic Duo! Batman and Robin!... and Red Robin and Red Hood and Nightwing and Batwoman and Batgirl and Orphan and Spoiler and Bluebird and Lark and Gotham Girl and Talon and Batwing and Huntress and Azreal and Flamebird and Batcow?

    Since when could just anybody do what we trained to do? It makes it all dumb instead of special. Like it doesn't matter anymore.
    -Dick Grayson (Batman Inc.)


  12. #2157
    ♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦ Godlike13's Avatar
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    Well it’s his in house buddies reaping the benefits of Nightwing being a nothing no effort book. More work for them.
    Last edited by Godlike13; 05-24-2019 at 03:42 PM.

  13. #2158
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    At this point, we need to ask ourselves a serious question: will the Ric Grayson debacle end before Catwoman and Batman get married? Because there seems to be no end in sight for this nonsense to end.

  14. #2159
    Astonishing Member Pohzee's Avatar
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    Looks like Nicola Scott is doing a mockup 80 years of Dick Grayson like she did for the Trinity. Kinda cool
    https://twitter.com/nicolascottart/s...686907904?s=21


    It's the Dynamic Duo! Batman and Robin!... and Red Robin and Red Hood and Nightwing and Batwoman and Batgirl and Orphan and Spoiler and Bluebird and Lark and Gotham Girl and Talon and Batwing and Huntress and Azreal and Flamebird and Batcow?

    Since when could just anybody do what we trained to do? It makes it all dumb instead of special. Like it doesn't matter anymore.
    -Dick Grayson (Batman Inc.)


  15. #2160
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    Quote Originally Posted by king81992 View Post
    At this point, we need to ask ourselves a serious question: will the Ric Grayson debacle end before Catwoman and Batman get married? Because there seems to be no end in sight for this nonsense to end.
    I am giving it until October, since live action Nightwing is to debut by the years end
    I am down to two books I am pulling and one ends in two months

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