Namor the Sub-Mariner Appreciation 2019

[ImperiusWrecked]

People have kicked around the idea of the Rock being Namor for a long time. This is one of the reasons I've been weary of a Sub-Mariner film being made at all, as I just don't see Hollywood casting him right. I love the Rock, but he's an awful choice for Namor.

I could see him as Attuma or maybe Krang but not as Namor.

In my head canon, Namor on screen should have the voice and presence of the Namor '60s cartoon. Regal, noble and cultured sounding. Maybe Rock could do that, but I doubt it and also he's now too old, in my opinion. Namor needs to be rather timeless looking.

I love that cartoon, I would be very happy to get a classic subby on screen, and yeah I agree with that, Namor is nearly immortal, we don't know how long he will live, even the preview from Invaders confirms he will be around after most of the normal humans he knows grows old and die. Even with the cgi tech we have now, if we had a younger actor then it would still be years before any cgi was needed depending on the number of movies. heh, here I am hoping for a decade of Namor movies but they won't even give him a solo. :/

[Oberon]

I hate that I 'm always behind on comics reading. I maybe get to the LCS once a month but on average it might be 5 to 6 weeks.

I think I last read Invaders #2 and was really enjoying what they seem to be doing.

I don't remember how Namor's story in Avengers ended (maybe I didn't get/read?)

And seem to have missed on Defenders reissue? Whatever can I do.

So how far along is Invaders now? Is there a Defenders and how does it tie into either the Avengers story or the Invaders one.

thanks if you can help!

[DragonsChi]

....not to divert the discussion but .....

Since Wave was introduced I have kinda been wondering/speculating that Marvel maybe on their usual BS and thinking about replacing Namor with her as their water premier character.

I know it is WAAAAY to soon to be worrying about that but part of me feels like some of the Marvel Comics creative may have wised up slightly on how to intro characters. Thereby giving Wave a slow burn on taking the role. I mean with Namor's rights potentially tied up and the huge success that was the Aquaman movie there is little to no way that the MCU team is not at the very least considering a counter.

Marvel Comics has also been placing Wave in a few marketing places over some of the other Agents of Atlas characters in the last couple of months, which is suspicious considering two (Luna and Crescent) are already in mobile games but aren't taking center stage. It's somewhat suspicious.

Then there's this:


Has Namor ever been in one of these? Either way these tend to highlight the characters who get most of the focus throughout the year so off the back we know the company wants us to be interested in her.

I don't know...I hate being negative. Especially, when it comes to Marvel but my faith in them as consumer, supporter, and fan is all but gone. I'm hanging on by finger nails at this point and a move where Wave gets a film or a larger push over Namor would probably end in having me throw up hands in defeat.

What do you guys think?

[ImperiusWrecked]

I hate that I 'm always behind on comics reading. I maybe get to the LCS once a month but on average it might be 5 to 6 weeks.

I think I last read Invaders #2 and was really enjoying what they seem to be doing.

I don't remember how Namor's story in Avengers ended (maybe I didn't get/read?)

And seem to have missed on Defenders reissue? Whatever can I do.

So how far along is Invaders now? Is there a Defenders and how does it tie into either the Avengers story or the Invaders one.

thanks if you can help!

Ok so Defenders was a mini where each member got a book and then one team up book and its over now, Namor's solo included him and the Vodans, where Namor went out to seek them and convince them to join him, he met Princess Kataw who followed and aided him when he was sent on a quest by King Okun to prove himself. Okun betrays Namor by going back on his deal and attempts to kill him, but he threatened Atlantis and Namor's people while he was strangling him and Namor snapped, he flew Okun out of the ocean into space because the vodan world was a water planet. He kills Okun while Kataw watches from the water, unable to stop him, then he floats in space dying before the silver surfers board saves him and we have silver surfer Namor, the board takes him to where the other defenders are in Defenders: The Best Defense and together they win the day, saving Vodan which was the next planet in line to be destroyed. In the process Kataw sacrifices herself to save her planet from freezing when it was knocked out of orbit. The train was stopped with Hulk and Doctor Strange, Mephisto showed up to claim the one who made a deal with him, and at that point doctor strange's astral form was fading and hulk was still stuck in space so strange cut a deal with mehpisto to return hulk, meanwhile Namor returns through the water portal on vodan back to Atlantis after one final talk with Norrin and he drops a line about Shawarma, which is of course a reference to the Avengers movie, and Norrin sets off to talk to Galactus.

Namor the Best Defense:

namorthebestdefense.jpg

namorsilversurfer.jpg

Defenders the Best Defense:

defendersthebestdefense.jpg

[ImperiusWrecked]

Invaders #3 has Tony all fired up saying that Namor needs to be stopped now and he wants to attack Atlantis now that they know a bomb is being made, and Steve is telling him to hold off, then Steve and Jim visit a navy base where they have been creating underwater weapon and plans for warfare. Steve takes center stage as he tries to talk with Admiral who tells him to just smile for the pictures that the personal want from him and that he doesn't have any jurisdiction there. Meanwhile Bucky sneaks in while Steve is making a distraction to find out what he can and also find the piece of equipment Namor needs to finish his bomb, however he gets caught by a woman scientist, Bucky tries to gain her trust by handing her his gun and she helps him but when his back is turned she shoots him. Meanwhile Randall is dying and Jim and Steve go back to see him one last time, but Nay has contacted Namor who comes in and confronts Steve and Jim, he tosses Steve out into the ocean and Jim flies after him to save him from drowning, meanwhile Randall comes out and talks to Namor one last time before dying in his arms. Namor flies off in tears after Randalls death and Nay agrees to tell Steve and Jim everything about what happened with Namor in the past and why Professor X was there.

Invaders #3
invaders.jpg
invaders1.jpg
invaders2.jpg

[ImperiusWrecked]

Invaders #4 is the secret history of Namor and was there some good art there by Butch. Its mainly told in flashbacks, Nay tells Steve and Jim what happened: Namor showed up at her home when she was child and her family took him in since he felt there was no place for him, but eventually atlantis calls him back, then years later Nay is grown and she meets Namor again but this time he is homeless, Chip didnt do any retcon of what happened with Destiny and Namor and so that is all still the same, Namor slowly regains his memory and lives with Petersons, he is close to Nay's son Roman (who as we found out in issue 3 was working with the woman scientist who shot bucky, Roman was a officer at the base) however at this time Professor X shows up and convinces Namor to help him search for more mutants since at that point there was no xmen, and charles was young, throughout their years of searching Charles had been influencing Namors mind to keep him calm whenever he had flares of his PTSD and anger. Namor is at his breaking point when they come to yet another small town, there they find a mutant who can change a person genetics, Charles wants to use him to speed up the evolution of Mutants and Namor is very against this, but it doesnt matter because the cops have closed in and they shoot the mutant killing him, meanwhile Namor is done, he attacks the cops who are shooting at them and then Charles enters his mind to stop him from rampaging, there he instills the memory of Tommy from issue one, to act as a therapist and find an way to stop Namor's issues, but Charles didnt count on Namor being so strong willed, enough to push professor x out his mind but tommy stayed, hidden and then later warped into machan. Machan is still talking to Namor in his head, and stil influencing him, but how much we can only speculate.

So it turns out Charles had messed with Namor's mind years ago and only now its coming to light, I suspect because of what happened in Avengers, Atlantis destroyed and the children who died on the beach, also Namor hasnt shown up so far in Avengers after he killed the roxxon people except for free comic book day where he was fighting the S.S.

invaders3.jpginvaders4.jpginvaders6.jpg

I hope that helps!

[ImperiusWrecked]

....not to divert the discussion but .....

Since Wave was introduced I have kinda been wondering/speculating that Marvel maybe on their usual BS and thinking about replacing Namor with her as their water premier character.

I know it is WAAAAY to soon to be worrying about that but part of me feels like some of the Marvel Comics creative may have wised up slightly on how to intro characters. Thereby giving Wave a slow burn on taking the role. I mean with Namor's rights potentially tied up and the huge success that was the Aquaman movie there is little to no way that the MCU team is not at the very least considering a counter.

Marvel Comics has also been placing Wave in a few marketing places over some of the other Agents of Atlas characters in the last couple of months, which is suspicious considering two (Luna and Crescent) are already in mobile games but aren't taking center stage. It's somewhat suspicious.

Then there's this:


Has Namor ever been in one of these? Either way these tend to highlight the characters who get most of the focus throughout the year so off the back we know the company wants us to be interested in her.

I don't know...I hate being negative. Especially, when it comes to Marvel but my faith in them as consumer, supporter, and fan is all but gone. I'm hanging on by finger nails at this point and a move where Wave gets a film or a larger push over Namor would probably end in having me throw up hands in defeat.

What do you guys think?

I follow Greg Pak on Twitter and so far people seem to like Wave, I think she is an interesting character, how popular she will be I have no clue, however often new characters, unless they are crazy popular like Ms Marvel etc, rarely make it out of a year or two of focus until they change writers or teams in my opinion, since I believe they said Agents of Atlas was a mini? (not sure) As for anyone taking over Namor's spot I would place my bets on Attuma before a newcomer since Marvel clearly only considers Atlantis good for waging war on the surface world and already gave Attuma a role in the black panther cartoon as the leader of the Atlanteans (im still salty about that) also I did listen to Chip's interview about Namor and the Invaders which I posted here in this thread, and it really is just editorial who don't have any faith in Namor, Invaders only happened because Chip couldnt get the green light for a Namor series he was trying to get and pitching around, they told him he needed to add more characters in and Chip went back and wrote Invaders which Marvel greenlighted. Honestly I am still angry about that, yet another writer is actively wanting to write a namor solo but the powers that be said NO.

So unless Wave makes a huge splash and is insanely popular I'm not worried, even if she was she isn't Namor and she would just have her own book like Ms Marvel or Squirrel Girl or something. However my hopes of Namor having a solo anytime soon is none, I feel we will get this year of Namor and the Invaders for however long this run lasts before Namor is sent back to cameos and guest starrings, until yet another writer asks to use him in their book, honestly if Chip hadn't kept pushing for a Namor book and then finally had to settle on an Invaders I can bet there would have been zero Namor this year except for him popping up in Avengers every now and then.

Also I do see Black Cat on there, doesn't she have a solo mini coming out? So it makes sense for her to be there.

Unless there is shown to be a real big interest in Namor we aren't getting more than what we have now I think, but I have been asking people to write into Marvel to get them to keep extending Invaders and also I'm asking for a Namor solo in emails but we will see if anything comes of it.

[Reviresco]

I can see the Rock as Attuma but he would be the worst Namor Hollywood could offer in my opinion.

Oooh. I didn't think of of Attuma. Yes. That would be a nice!

Agreed and agreed, not to knock on The Rock, but I just feel Namor needs a actor who can do subtle really well too, because he isn't all action all the time, there are quiet moments that need to be captured and I mainly know Johnson from action movies. Just my opinion but casting him as Namor wouldn't work out.

I actually love the Rock and most of his movies. But like you, I just don't see him as Namor.

I would be loving this news since I think the Rock would make an even better Namor than Momoa right now but what puts a stop to my optimism is The Rock's age and his longevity looking like a Namor. You want an actor that can hold the part for at least 10 years down the road, hopefully more and the Rock is a case like Downy Jr. that will be already looking like a grandpa after 10 years even if he maintains a fabulous physical condition, he will look more like King Neptune than Namor. Downey is 54 right now and Johnson even though he looks younger than Downey is 47, in ten years he will be close to 60!

I knew you'd like the casting for his physique. But yes, I agree on the age. Though, I had no idea that Johnson was 47. But considering how long he's been around, I should have guessed.

People have kicked around the idea of the Rock being Namor for a long time. This is one of the reasons I've been weary of a Sub-Mariner film being made at all, as I just don't see Hollywood casting him right. I love the Rock, but he's an awful choice for Namor.

My sentiments exactly. I'm very dubious about Hollywood getting the casting right.

In my head canon, Namor on screen should have the voice and presence of the Namor '60s cartoon. Regal, noble and cultured sounding. Maybe Rock could do that, but I doubt it and also he's now too old, in my opinion. Namor needs to be rather timeless looking.

I love that cartoon, I would be very happy to get a classic subby on screen, and yeah I agree with that, Namor is nearly immortal, we don't know how long he will live, even the preview from Invaders confirms he will be around after most of the normal humans he knows grows old and die. Even with the cgi tech we have now, if we had a younger actor then it would still be years before any cgi was needed depending on the number of movies. heh, here I am hoping for a decade of Namor movies but they won't even give him a solo. :/

I do enjoy those cartoons, and the voice, but I have to wonder how much of formal and regal Namor we would get. Marvel and the MCU seems determined to go with a more jokey and informal take. I wonder if they would reduce it to Namor talking in third person constantly and play it for a joke?

[Reviresco]

....not to divert the discussion but .....

Since Wave was introduced I have kinda been wondering/speculating that Marvel maybe on their usual BS and thinking about replacing Namor with her as their water premier character.

I know it is WAAAAY to soon to be worrying about that but part of me feels like some of the Marvel Comics creative may have wised up slightly on how to intro characters. Thereby giving Wave a slow burn on taking the role. I mean with Namor's rights potentially tied up and the huge success that was the Aquaman movie there is little to no way that the MCU team is not at the very least considering a counter.

Marvel Comics has also been placing Wave in a few marketing places over some of the other Agents of Atlas characters in the last couple of months, which is suspicious considering two (Luna and Crescent) are already in mobile games but aren't taking center stage. It's somewhat suspicious.

Then there's this:


Has Namor ever been in one of these? Either way these tend to highlight the characters who get most of the focus throughout the year so off the back we know the company wants us to be interested in her.

I don't know...I hate being negative. Especially, when it comes to Marvel but my faith in them as consumer, supporter, and fan is all but gone. I'm hanging on by finger nails at this point and a move where Wave gets a film or a larger push over Namor would probably end in having me throw up hands in defeat.

What do you guys think?

Yes, Namor has been on at least one, maybe two of those before, back during AvX. But I usually find those things disheartening. They really show how Marvel is only pushing the movie / tv / animation properties. This one IS unusual for having the gaming characters and Wave.

I hate to break it to you, but Wave WILL get a bigger push than Namor, cause Marvel isn't pushing Namor at all, IMO. But I don't think Wave is going to be pushed as Marvel's premier water character. Marvel has ZERO interest in their water characters. Nor is she going to be pushed as a replacement for Namor, because, well, Marvel doesn't think Namor sells. Strictly my opinion, not really based off anything but observations, is that Wave, and the Agents of Atlas game characters, etc., are getting a push because CB is interested in pushing Marvel in Asia.

So, I'm fine with Wave. She represents for a part of the world that usually gets ignored in the MU. And if she gets people interested in ocean stuff, even better. She's additive, at this point, not replacing. I've seen several folks asking about interactions with Namor too.

Marvel's "solution" to Namor's rights situation is to replace him with a more Namor like Attuma, as we've seen in all the cartoons.

[Oberon]

You've been immensely helpful. The story has been really good. Just sorting it out.

I realize now that Roman is 'Nay''s son, not Namor's. Thanks !

[ImperiusWrecked]

You've been immensely helpful. The story has been really good. Just sorting it out.

I realize now that Roman is 'Nay''s son, not Namor's. Thanks !

You're welcome! Glad I could help

[Reviresco]

I follow Greg Pak on Twitter and so far people seem to like Wave, I think she is an interesting character, how popular she will be I have no clue, however often new characters, unless they are crazy popular like Ms Marvel etc, rarely make it out of a year or two of focus until they change writers or teams in my opinion, since I believe they said Agents of Atlas was a mini? (not sure)

Yes, pretty much this.

As for anyone taking over Namor's spot I would place my bets on Attuma before a newcomer since Marvel clearly only considers Atlantis good for waging war on the surface world and already gave Attuma a role in the black panther cartoon as the leader of the Atlanteans (im still salty about that) also I did listen to Chip's interview about Namor and the Invaders which I posted here in this thread, and it really is just editorial who don't have any faith in Namor, Invaders only happened because Chip couldnt get the green light for a Namor series he was trying to get and pitching around, they told him he needed to add more characters in and Chip went back and wrote Invaders which Marvel greenlighted. Honestly I am still angry about that, yet another writer is actively wanting to write a namor solo but the powers that be said NO.

Been saying it for decades. They don't have faith in Namor nor do they have interest in Namor. It's always been the creatives that have seen how awesome the character is. However, it's the same line they used about Doctor Strange, and they sure changed their tune once he got a movie. It will be the same for Namor. Which annoys me no end, as he deserves it NOW.

So unless Wave makes a huge splash and is insanely popular I'm not worried, even if she was she isn't Namor and she would just have her own book like Ms Marvel or Squirrel Girl or something. However my hopes of Namor having a solo anytime soon is none, I feel we will get this year of Namor and the Invaders for however long this run lasts before Namor is sent back to cameos and guest starrings, until yet another writer asks to use him in their book, honestly if Chip hadn't kept pushing for a Namor book and then finally had to settle on an Invaders I can bet there would have been zero Namor this year except for him popping up in Avengers every now and then.

We also got the Defenders mini-series, which yes, Chip wrote, but I think was more of Jason Latour or Al Ewing's baby. This year we were bound to get SOMETHING, because of the anniversary, but thank goodness it was more than just the one shot. Hopefully, the new appearances are enough that it inspires other writers and artists. We've had Gail Simone, Christian Ward and Patrick Zircher all express interest this year, as well as our patron Subby Saint, Kris Anka. I'm keeping my fingers crossed for more good things this year.

Also I do see Black Cat on there, doesn't she have a solo mini coming out? So it makes sense for her to be there.

Because she's also getting a movie. It's all about the movies, now.

Unless there is shown to be a real big interest in Namor we aren't getting more than what we have now I think, but I have been asking people to write into Marvel to get them to keep extending Invaders and also I'm asking for a Namor solo in emails but we will see if anything comes of it.

EXCELLENT idea. What address are you using?

[Reviresco]

Is this the only time Namor appears in this issue? Why do the writers always have to come back to this, seriously S.S. vs Atlantis is old, haven't they done enough, how many times do they need to destroy it?

I think so. I didn't actually get a copy either. I imagine it means we'll see more of this mess in Avengers 19 or 20.

After Robinson's awful SS, if I don't see Namor mop the floor with Hyperion and company, I'm not interested.

Went to my LCBS just to get this one but every store is already out of it everywhere, should have been there earlier. I'm guessing its only this one panel and they don't even show how the fight went which is sad. Always wanted a rematch where Namor cleans up the clock of Hyperion but I guess that won't happen.

I'm pretty sure it is only this one panel and apparently they just drive the Defenders of the Deep out of the US waters.

[ImperiusWrecked]

EXCELLENT idea. What address are you using?

It's was posted last week on the new fyeahinvaders blog and I hope the new followers there will write in, I will be posting it again this week and trying my best to get some kind of interest going. The email address is: mheroes@marvel.com and I totally agree that Namor needs a series now, he should have had one already.

[Thor-El]

It's was posted last week on the new fyeahinvaders blog and I hope the new followers there will write in, I will be posting it again this week and trying my best to get some kind of interest going. The email address is: mheroes@marvel.com and I totally agree that Namor needs a series now, he should have had one already.

Thanks for posting this address. Just added my voice, erm e-mail. Marvel's first superheroe deserves to have his solo series.