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  1. #286
    Latverian ambassador Iron Maiden's Avatar
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    I'll check out issue #4 and decide where to go from there. I suppose this is an ongoing series for now anyway. Next issue is supposed to feature Fin Fang Foom.

  2. #287
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kintor View Post
    Missed it the first time but I had to take another look at that panel. You're totally right, that throne is made from the Thing! It's such a brilliantly sadistic idea I'm surprised nobody has thought of it before in a Doom ruled future.
    In Unthinkable, Doom is shown torturing Ben Grimm and picking up chips of his rock skin, and he talks about wanting to skin Reed Richards and so on. And of course in that story, he has a armour made out of Valeria, the girl he loved and sacrificed because he wanted ultimate power or something.

    I've been on a Dr. Doom kick and reading a bunch of his great stories...and it's awesome how much there is.

    Doom is basically a sub-franchise unto himself. You could do a movie trilogy on him, you could make an open world narrative game about him.

    So I hear that Jonathan Hickman wrote Doom well but I've been told it's very arc based on him. Obviously Secret Wars is essential...but what about the stories leading to that. Anything standalone or individual that I can pick up and follow leading to that. Single issue, mini-arcs and so on?

  3. #288
    Kinky Lil' Canine Snoop Dogg's Avatar
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    That Dark Reign anthology one-shot where he fantasizes about slave Leia-ing Emma Frost and Loki.
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  4. #289
    Fantastic Member Coatl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snoop Dogg View Post
    That Dark Reign anthology one-shot where he fantasizes about slave Leia-ing Emma Frost and Loki.
    I loved that fantasy part because he was like. Yes! let's merciless kill those who dare to try to control Doom, but kept your Buddy (Namor) safe because he is competent and useful and well let's also kept the chicks because ... they are hot (even the one who used to be a men).

    Not just I appreciate the odd "friendship" between Namor and Doom and I wish after Secret Wars they would interact again, since they didn't left in the best terms before it. But also I found fun how deep inside Von Doom wants to see Emma and Loki in skimpy suits.

  5. #290
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coatl View Post
    I loved that fantasy part because he was like. Yes! let's merciless kill those who dare to try to control Doom, but kept your Buddy (Namor) safe because he is competent and useful and well let's also kept the chicks because ... they are hot (even the one who used to be a men).

    Not just I appreciate the odd "friendship" between Namor and Doom and I wish after Secret Wars they would interact again, since they didn't left in the best terms before it. But also I found fun how deep inside Von Doom wants to see Emma and Loki in skimpy suits.
    I have had that panel saved in my photobucket account but every so often, it would get removed by photobucket because of some kind of decency standard! Yes, I think Doom was a bit conflicted about FemLoki and may have experienced a somewhat uncomfortable attraction there!



    I agree that the "reunion" between Namor and Doom has been long delayed in the aftermath of Secret Wars. One reason was that the Squadron Supreme had the bad taste to behead Namor! I have yet to catch up on how he was brought back to life. Hickman had Doom get rid of Namor twice, once in his daydreaming sequence in the Dark Reign story above and then in Secret Wars. Secret Wars, I wasn't sure if it was a killing blow that he gave Namor or not. I would think had BattleWorld continued to exist, he would have found a kingdom for Namor to rule. The problem is if Namor would agree to it or not.
    Last edited by Iron Maiden; 03-16-2019 at 12:21 PM.

  6. #291
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    Namor and Doom have this twisted bond. Doom has d--ked him over countless times and Namor still keeps coming back and being roped along for the next bout. Like in Emperor Doom which was especially humiliating to Namor, and really hilarious to watch. Dr. Doom invites him to dinner, ropes him in on this crazy scheme for world domination, and Namor becomes a chump and does Doom's bidding, and then Doom inevitably betrays him and uses him.

  7. #292
    Fantastic Member Coatl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iron Maiden View Post
    I have had that panel saved in my photobucket account but every so often, it would get removed by photobucket because of some kind of decency standard! Yes, I think Doom was a bit conflicted about FemLoki and may have experienced a somewhat uncomfortable attraction there!
    Yup I love that.

    Are you ignoring me, Doctor?
    No, I was just temporary questioning my own sexuality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Iron Maiden View Post
    I agree that the "reunion" between Namor and Doom has been long delayed in the aftermath of Secret Wars. One reason was that the Squadron Supreme had the bad taste to behead Namor! I have yet to catch up on how he was brought back to life. Although Hickman had Doom get rid of Namor twice, once in his daydreaming sequence in the Dark Reign story above and then in Secret Wars. Although in Secret Wars, I wasn't sure if it was a killing blow that he gave Namor or not. I would think had BattleWorld continued to exist, he would have found a kingdom for Namor to rule. The problem is if Namor would agree to it or not.
    Yes, well what's an attempt of murder or two between friends? Namor also has tried to kill Doom but with a bit less success.

    And to be fair Doom also has helped Namor. When a terrorist attack made by Namor son Kamar puts E U in war against Atlantis all Namor allies chew him and left him (X-men, FF, Avengers) Doom was the only one who supported him. Even took the population of Atlantis in Latveria while they found a new home, after the destruction of Atlantis at Namor hands (long history).

    Also when Namor went to get help after secret wars seemed that dining in Latveria wasn't a strange occurrence, since at least Kristoff seemed really comfortable (if a bit mischievous) and Namor was in "first name basis" with him. Doom other hand seemed more indigned that Namor hasn't went to him FIRST. Something that I interpreted as a kind of jealousy.

    As a note, Namor was Killed by Hyperion and the Squadron supreme but also revived by them in some kind of time loop, at the end is Hyperion himself who helps to rebuild Atlantis.

  8. #293
    Citizen of Atlantis ImperiusWrecked's Avatar
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    Namor and Doom are my favorite frenemies!!! I love Super Villain Team Up and really wished that the mini series Sub-Mariner Revolution, which ended with Namor taking his army and going to live with Doom, had spun into another team up comic. Them being the first super villain team up in Marvel and having a long history of coming to each other's aid only to betray (usually doom betrays namor) each other when it's convenient for their own agendas makes their dynamic so interesting since they clearly respect each other in their own ways. I think it's the closest Doom ever had to admitting someone was his equal on a social status if not an intellectual one. I really wish we could have more of them in the comics, the Hickman Doom and Namor dinner was a great moment. Also Doom did come to Namor's aid when Namor was stuck in Hell, and he did it so that Namor was in his debt, if someone could just remember that then it would be a good way to have a story about Namor trying to settle that debt.

    "No one should ever question where my allegiance lies." - Namor of Atlantis

  9. #294
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coatl View Post
    Yup I love that.

    Are you ignoring me, Doctor?
    No, I was just temporary questioning my own sexuality.


    Yes, well what's an attempt of murder or two between friends? Namor also has tried to kill Doom but with a bit less success.
    This was in the MC2 universe but way back in A-Next, Doom and Namor got into a battle around the time that Kristoff and Cassie had both grown to adulthood. The outcome was never known because I think the series was cancelled not long after that. Although Namor was still around, Doom had not been seen for a while. Latveria is a shambles and is a point of contention among various world powers.



    In A-Next #5, UN forces are investigating the disappearance of a little girl in Doomstadt and encounter some mysteriously re-activated Doombots. They call in some superheroes to investigate and Stinger (Cassie) is among them. While searching the ruins of Castle Doom, she goes ahead of the rest of the team since she can fly through some of the passages blocked by debris and stones from collapsed walls.





    Later, in a more recent appearance of the MC2 universe in a Fantastic Five mini, Doom's fate is revealed. It seems that after the battle shown in A-Next, Namor kept Doom in an undersea prison cell. He later escapes to menace the Fantastic Five.


    Quote Originally Posted by Coatl View Post
    And to be fair Doom also has helped Namor. When a terrorist attack made by Namor son Kamar puts E U in war against Atlantis all Namor allies chew him and left him (X-men, FF, Avengers) Doom was the only one who supported him. Even took the population of Atlantis in Latveria while they found a new home, after the destruction of Atlantis at Namor hands (long history).
    That was a very busy time for Doom. At the same time he had this arrangement, in JMS's Thor he also was courting Balder with Fem-Loki to persuade him to move the Asgardians from Braxton to Latveria. IIRC the bargain was that Loki was going to allow Doom to study the Asgardians and learn the secret of immortality. Or at least that is where I thought JMS was going with that but then he got into another disagreement with Marvel/Joe Quesada and left the series. Kieron Gillien took over after that and it was more about learning how to power Doom's version of Destroyer armor.
    Quote Originally Posted by Coatl View Post
    Also when Namor went to get help after secret wars seemed that dining in Latveria wasn't a strange occurrence, since at least Kristoff seemed really comfortable (if a bit mischievous) and Namor was in "first name basis" with him. Doom other hand seemed more indigned that Namor hasn't went to him FIRST. Something that I interpreted as a kind of jealousy.

    As a note, Namor was Killed by Hyperion and the Squadron supreme but also revived by them in some kind of time loop, at the end is Hyperion himself who helps to rebuild Atlantis.
    Thanks I'll have to check those issues and out Namor's appearances in The Invaders too. Maybe a Doom appearance will develop in that but I concede the odds are probably not good. But at some point someone has to put these two together in a story. There's been talk about Hickman returning to Marvel. My dream project is for him to do a mini series/revival of Super-Villain Team_Up

  10. #295
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    Quote Originally Posted by Revolutionary_Jack View Post
    In Unthinkable, Doom is shown torturing Ben Grimm and picking up chips of his rock skin, and he talks about wanting to skin Reed Richards and so on. And of course in that story, he has a armour made out of Valeria, the girl he loved and sacrificed because he wanted ultimate power or something.

    I've been on a Dr. Doom kick and reading a bunch of his great stories...and it's awesome how much there is.

    Doom is basically a sub-franchise unto himself. You could do a movie trilogy on him, you could make an open world narrative game about him.

    So I hear that Jonathan Hickman wrote Doom well but I've been told it's very arc based on him. Obviously Secret Wars is essential...but what about the stories leading to that. Anything standalone or individual that I can pick up and follow leading to that. Single issue, mini-arcs and so on?
    Besides that one shot that Snoop Dogg mentions (which is Hickman's first Doom story), I'd check out Hickman's spin off FF that came about after the Torch was presumed dead. We start to see the relationship between "Uncle Doom" and Valeria as she and Reed come up with a plan to repair the brain damage done in the Fall of the Hulks arc. After Johnny's death, Nathaniel and Val have persuaded Reed to invite Doom to join them. A Future version of Franklin and Valeria have come to them with dire warnings of he future and the cryptic message that All Hope Lies in Doom. If you haven't already, I'd just read Hickman's run in its entirety.

  11. #296
    Citizen of Atlantis ImperiusWrecked's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iron Maiden View Post
    Thanks I'll have to check those issues and out Namor's appearances in The Invaders too. Maybe a Doom appearance will develop in that but I concede the odds are probably not good. But at some point someone has to put these two together in a story. There's been talk about Hickman returning to Marvel. My dream project is for him to do a mini series/revival of Super-Villain Team_Up
    I would be very excited if that happens! A question I wanted to ask is there was this canceled Young Doom series and I wanted to know if there was a reason why it was canceled? I mean Young Victor in college/exploring more about him in that age would have been very cool to see how it shapes him into Doom and Becky Cloonan did three covers for it already which looked beautiful and I just don't understand why it was never finished?



    "No one should ever question where my allegiance lies." - Namor of Atlantis

  12. #297
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    Unfortunately, no one is talking much about that series that was cancelled without explanation. I can't think of a case where a series has been that far along in the process and then gets cancelled. I remember it had even made the catalog listing of upcoming title for November of 2011.

    I'm just going by memory now but I think Bleeding Cool had published something about the art being very far behind schedule but then it was pulled from the site. I think they didn't want to put the blame on one person. There was a follow up on the cancellation on the Bleeding Cool site in 2013 and they quoted Tom Brevoort's explanation on his old Formspring account:

    “There were problems with getting the work completed on time, and given that it was a pedigree project that likely wasn’t going to do huge numbers, I didn’t want to have to sausage it up among multiple creators in order to make the ship dates. Better, in my judgment, not to do it in the first place.”

    IMO, that still doesn't make sense. I'd seen comics go through delays before but they simply push back the schedule until it's ready. We've had some minor delays with the current Fantastic Four run. And the issues were in Marvel's solicitations all the way to issue #3. I had read some reports that the art was holding things up but that was never verified.

    The first issue was promoted on CBR for November of 2011 for Marvel's upcoming releases

    Written by NICK SPENCER

    Art & Cover by BECKY CLOONAN

    The teenaged Victor Von Doom defends his life...in Hell. The undergrad who'll grow to become Dr. Doom is an abrasive young genius surrounded by collegiate buffoons, wastrels, and dilettantes - like that insufferable Richards. But Doom knows he's destined for greater things, and from his dorm he journeys fearlessly to Hell to save the spirit of his mom...and his struggle to get there, the trials he faces, and his subsequent failure will make him the man he's to become. Nick Spencer and Becky Cloonan pull back the cloak to reveal the youthful, angsty, exuberant side of Victor Von Doom!


    I remember at the time the debut issue even appear on the Diamond Comics site catalog with a shipping date but they no longer store those upcoming issue shipping catalogs that far back.

    But you can see the listings in their archive of cancelled comics. It had gotten to the point where Diamond had even assigned them a catalog number all the way to the 3rd issue.

    SEP110586 VICTOR VON DOOM #1 4
    OCT110657 VICTOR VON DOOM #2 4
    NOV110553 VICTOR VON DOOM #3 4
    Last edited by Iron Maiden; 03-17-2019 at 02:27 AM.

  13. #298
    Kinky Lil' Canine Snoop Dogg's Avatar
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    The cancellation was actually a scheme by the Supremor Brevoort to slow the rate of Spencer's power growth. Ironically, by later offering him Cap, it was Brevoort himself who gave Spencer the opportunity to ascend at a rate no one could control. Now he rules every universe and dimension, even heaven and hell. Those who die and go to the Good Place will find Morning Glories season 3. Those who go to the Bad Place will find the completed Doom origin mini as their only consolation.
    I don't blind date I make the direct market vibrate

  14. #299
    Citizen of Atlantis ImperiusWrecked's Avatar
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    Thanks for the replies!
    "No one should ever question where my allegiance lies." - Namor of Atlantis

  15. #300
    Marvel's 1st Superhero Reviresco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iron Maiden View Post
    Unfortunately, no one is talking much about that series that was cancelled without explanation. I can't think of a case where a series has been that far along in the process and then gets cancelled. I remember it had even made the catalog listing of upcoming title for November of 2011.

    I'm just going by memory now but I think Bleeding Cool had published something about the art being very far behind schedule but then it was pulled from the site. I think they didn't want to put the blame on one person. There was a follow up on the cancellation on the Bleeding Cool site in 2013 and they quoted Tom Brevoort's explanation on his old Formspring account:

    “There were problems with getting the work completed on time, and given that it was a pedigree project that likely wasn’t going to do huge numbers, I didn’t want to have to sausage it up among multiple creators in order to make the ship dates. Better, in my judgment, not to do it in the first place.”

    IMO, that still doesn't make sense. I'd seen comics go through delays before but they simply push back the schedule until it's ready. We've had some minor delays with the current Fantastic Four run. And the issues were in Marvel's solicitations all the way to issue #3. I had read some reports that the art was holding things up but that was never verified.

    The first issue was promoted on CBR for November of 2011 for Marvel's upcoming releases

    Written by NICK SPENCER

    Art & Cover by BECKY CLOONAN

    The teenaged Victor Von Doom defends his life...in Hell. The undergrad who'll grow to become Dr. Doom is an abrasive young genius surrounded by collegiate buffoons, wastrels, and dilettantes - like that insufferable Richards. But Doom knows he's destined for greater things, and from his dorm he journeys fearlessly to Hell to save the spirit of his mom...and his struggle to get there, the trials he faces, and his subsequent failure will make him the man he's to become. Nick Spencer and Becky Cloonan pull back the cloak to reveal the youthful, angsty, exuberant side of Victor Von Doom!


    I remember at the time the debut issue even appear on the Diamond Comics site catalog with a shipping date but they no longer store those upcoming issue shipping catalogs that far back.

    But you can see the listings in their archive of cancelled comics. It had gotten to the point where Diamond had even assigned them a catalog number all the way to the 3rd issue.

    SEP110586 VICTOR VON DOOM #1 4
    OCT110657 VICTOR VON DOOM #2 4
    NOV110553 VICTOR VON DOOM #3 4
    The very much missed mini-series.

    Something I didn't connect before this ... around this time, Marvel also cancelled ALL WINNERS SQUAD, a mini-series, in the middle of it's run, 3 issues before it finished, despite it allegedly having the art done. They were also cancelling other books, edited by Alejandro Arbona, who was amongst a slate of editors that Marvel let go. Perhaps that was why it the book was cancelled.

    Marvel also recently cancelled both the new Vision series and the Chuck Wendig Star Wars series after issues had been solicited, so it's not entirely unheard of.
    Namor the Sub-Mariner, Marvel's oldest character, will have been published for 85 years in 2024. So where's my GOOD Namor anniversary ongoing, Marvel?

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