Young Justice Appreciation 2019 (TV show and comic)

[Bruce Wayne]

I'm still waiting for someone to take Queen Bee out. All the Light are kind of insufferable villains but Queen Bee's been asking for a comeuppance since season 1.

At least they're finally knocking Lex down a peg.

I don't know. I think she, Lex and Vandal Savage meant to be the dark trinity of the light. All the other positions either have turnover or are expendable in the sense like Brain/Ultra-Humanite and Klarion they are there to fulfill a specific function such as the science/tech person or the magic person.

Though I do find it fascinating how the show has elevated her as a supervillain (compared to the big names like Vandal/Lex/Ra's) when she was pretty much nonexistent in the comics and really shows imo how a lot of Weisman's sensibilities of DC came from his time working there during the 80s when the character was more prominent then. It really demonstrates I think that the production side weren't tuned into the current DC comics that were being published during YJ's development (or else they'd use someone like Black Adam) as opposed to the elevation of Manta for example that was partially due to Geoff Johns.

[Agent Z]

I don't know. I think she, Lex and Vandal Savage meant to be the dark trinity of the light. All the other positions either have turnover or are expendable in the sense like Brain/Ultra-Humanite and Klarion they are there to fulfill a specific function such as the science/tech person or the magic person.

Though I do find it fascinating how the show has elevated her as a supervillain (compared to the big names like Vandal/Lex/Ra's) when she was pretty much nonexistent in the comics and really shows imo how a lot of Weisman's sensibilities of DC came from his time working there during the 80s when the character was more prominent then. It really demonstrates I think that the production side weren't tuned into the current DC comics that were being published during YJ's development (or else they'd use someone like Black Adam) as opposed to the elevation of Manta for example that was partially due to Geoff Johns.

Adaptations like these have that one character that gets more play over others. Weisman probably felt the Light was lacking in a female villain and decided to use her.

[Frontier]

I don't know. I think she, Lex and Vandal Savage meant to be the dark trinity of the light. All the other positions either have turnover or are expendable in the sense like Brain/Ultra-Humanite and Klarion they are there to fulfill a specific function such as the science/tech person or the magic person.

Though I do find it fascinating how the show has elevated her as a supervillain (compared to the big names like Vandal/Lex/Ra's) when she was pretty much nonexistent in the comics and really shows imo how a lot of Weisman's sensibilities of DC came from his time working there during the 80s when the character was more prominent then. It really demonstrates I think that the production side weren't tuned into the current DC comics that were being published during YJ's development (or else they'd use someone like Black Adam) as opposed to the elevation of Manta for example that was partially due to Geoff Johns.

Although we have stuff like Harper Row, her family, Spoiler's modern costume, and Cassandra Cain going by Oprhan so they're not completely tuned out to the current stuff. Even if I wish they hadn't used the Orphan thing.

Seriously hope we see Cass as Batgirl next time-skip...

Adaptations like these have that one character that gets more play over others. Weisman probably felt the Light was lacking in a female villain and decided to use her.

I wonder what Circe might've been like on The Light, but she might be too unpredictable and too much like Klarion.

[Jackalope89]

Although we have stuff like Harper Row, her family, Spoiler's modern costume, and Cassandra Cain going by Oprhan so they're not completely tuned out to the current stuff. Even if I wish they hadn't used the Orphan thing.

Seriously hope we see Cass as Batgirl next time-skip...

I wonder what Circe might've been like on The Light, but she might be too unpredictable and too much like Klarion.

Circe, I imagine, may have a vendetta against Diana and the other Amazons, but she really is more of a loner than the others. Preferring to use thralls and what not.

[Lukmendes]

Actually how the end credits for that episode end, it does imply that he escapes. It just took awhile. But even if he didn't escape, I imagine he would have been replaced easily by Wizard/Wotan/Blackbriar Thorn/Felix Faust like how Ocean Master was replaced by Black Manta who was then replaced by Gretchen, Ra's by Deathstroke or Brain by Ultra-Humanite. I think season 2 and 3 (and some of the non-canonical background stuff) really demonstrated that the Light ultimately can absorb these losses and probably have new members waiting to replace their lost members.

Hm, just checked the post credits scene here, and yeah, it does seem that he managed to escape somehow, I just assumed the whole credits were just a one note joke and didn't see the rest lol.

This complaint is and always has been a huge exaggeration. At the very least, it hasn't been true since season 1 where the heroes were largely ignorant of who their enemies truly were. They've had members either get kicked out, killed or sent to prison, lost Halo in this season, their plans to use the Reach had to be cut short;. The Light aren't invincible, they're just tenacious like the heroes.

Thing is that for seasons 1 and 2 it takes until near the end of the season for them to get any real loss, and even so it barely affects them, their plans with the Reach barely affected the Light since their real alien ally was Darkseid all along and the Light was going to backstab them anyways, losing Black Manta is probably their only real loss from season 2, and in season 3, yeah, losing Halo is a loss to Darkseid, but for Light it's beneficial, and the alliance staying despite Vandal's betrayal doesn't affect them, even though a proper Darkseid would be pissed, and Lex losing his secretary general position looks like a huge loss for them, but Vandal isn't sounding worried about it so I fear that it won't make much of a difference too...

And I don't mind the Light being tenacious, if fact, I actualy liked them at first for being so pragmatic, but since their whole gimmick is basicaly "Haha, our plans worked anyways" or "Haha, it's not a real loss", it gets boring when all they do is have their vague plans keep working over and over without much problems.

Seriously hope we see Cass as Batgirl next time-skip...

I'm still surprised either Cass or Stephanie didn't become a Batgirl in this season, I just assumed they didn't because Barbara was still gonna be Batgirl, but then she got crippled off-screen lol

I wonder what Circe might've been like on The Light, but she might be too unpredictable and too much like Klarion.

I doubt unpredictableness is an issue, as the Light only makes one of their members become a leader if they look trust-worthy, and Klarion himself is just that despite his quirks, so I don't see Circe being an issue, though yeah, like you said, the whole magic thing would make her too much like Klarion, unless they gave her different kinds of magic, or bring around more greek mythos related ****.

Circe, I imagine, may have a vendetta against Diana and the other Amazons, but she really is more of a loner than the others. Preferring to use thralls and what not.

To be fair, being a loner doesn't matter much for YJ, as this is a setting with more pragmatic villains (Darkseid being the easiest example), or who are pretty different characters from the comics (Vandal ultimately believing that he should be the one to lead the world as he believes he's the only one who can do so, or Black Manta who's way, way nicer than his comics version) so Circe could be part of the Light too.

[Frontier]

Thing is that for seasons 1 and 2 it takes until near the end of the season for them to get any real loss, and even so it barely affects them, their plans with the Reach barely affected the Light since their real alien ally was Darkseid all along and the Light was going to backstab them anyways, losing Black Manta is probably their only real loss from season 2, and in season 3, yeah, losing Halo is a loss to Darkseid, but for Light it's beneficial, and the alliance staying despite Vandal's betrayal doesn't affect them, even though a proper Darkseid would be pissed, and Lex losing his secretary general position looks like a huge loss for them, but Vandal isn't sounding worried about it so I fear that it won't make much of a difference too...

They also lost Brain and Mallah but I'm not sure if that was such a big deal considering how little Brain was shown doing.

I'm still surprised either Cass or Stephanie didn't become a Batgirl in this season, I just assumed they didn't because Barbara was still gonna be Batgirl, but then she got crippled off-screen lol.

They said some weird thing about wanting them to be identified as heroes in their own right instead of just making them Batgirl even though Cass was introduced to basically become Batgirl and there are tons of other legacy heroes on the show.

A part of me thinks it was an edit from on high that they couldn't make either Batgirl but Cass is getting a young adult graphic novel with her as Batgirl so...

[Lukmendes]

They also lost Brain and Mallah but I'm not sure if that was such a big deal considering how little Brain was shown doing.

Man I should re-watch the first two seasons, could swear that Brain wasn't in season 2... Was he reduced to being just an extra in season 2 or is my brain just not working properly?

They said some weird thing about wanting them to be identified as heroes in their own right instead of just making them Batgirl even though Cass was introduced to basically become Batgirl and there are tons of other legacy heroes on the show.

A part of me thinks it was an edit from on high that they couldn't make either Batgirl but Cass is getting a young adult graphic novel with her as Batgirl so...

I was thinking that maybe it's because Barbara is currently Batgirl in the comics so they don't want the cartoon to be different from that, kinda like how Wally was the Flash in the cartoons until Barry returned.

That being said I wasn't aware of that graphic novel, maybe it's some random what if that DC doesn't really care about?

[Frontier]

Man I should re-watch the first two seasons, could swear that Brain wasn't in season 2... Was he reduced to being just an extra in season 2 or is my brain just not working properly?

I only remember The Team capturing him along with Manta.

I was thinking that maybe it's because Barbara is currently Batgirl in the comics so they don't want the cartoon to be different from that, kinda like how Wally was the Flash in the cartoons until Barry returned.

At the same time we've still got Tim Drake as Robin and Kaldur as Aquaman, so I don't think they're all that restricted to what's in the current comics.

That being said I wasn't aware of that graphic novel, maybe it's some random what if that DC doesn't really care about?

It's part of their fairly well-publicized young adult graphic novel line. It's not some random bit of DC media.

[byrd156]

I really hope when YJ comes to a close, DC does a full on history/timeline book about this universe.

[Lukmendes]

At the same time we've still got Tim Drake as Robin and Kaldur as Aquaman, so I don't think they're all that restricted to what's in the current comics.

Tim, it makes sense, I'm pretty sure he only became Red Robin because of Damian, and Damian is still a baby, it's kinda like how Dick started as Robin in the cartoon, but eventualy became Nightwing, despite still being Nightwing in the comics at the time he was Robin in YJ, so I doubt Tim will stay as Robin, we'd need a big ass time skip to have a Damian who's old enough for that though, surprised they showed him as a baby and not as a small kid...

Although yeah, Kaldur'ahm shows that they're not exactly restricted, so maybe they just chose to.

It's part of their fairly well-publicized young adult graphic novel line. It's not some random bit of DC media.

Then either the writters chose to, or DC specificaly didn't want YJ cartoon to have her as Batgirl.

Honestly though? It might be for the best, I'm imagining that season 4 could actualy choose to focus on her and have her take the mantle as Batgirl, since it could be weird to have her suddenly being Batgirl after a time skip, honestly found it weird that Tim was suddenly Robin, even weirder that Jason died in between seasons... And even if they don't do that, still might be for the best, Cass being Batgirl and then being as irrelevant as the rest of Batman Inc would be more annoying since it'd look like an ever bigger waste lol.

[Bruce Wayne]

I really hope when YJ comes to a close, DC does a full on history/timeline book about this universe.

Weisman probably already has written a timeline for his show. The question is if he'll share it with the fans.

[Lee]

The Batgirl thing was answered in a Reddit AMA a few months ago:

https://www.reddit.com/r/DCcomics/co...man_producers/

When Bart became Kid Flash, he was doing it in Wally's memory. But Barbara's not dead. And we like the idea of both Stephanie and Cassandra having their own identities as opposed to stepping into someone else's shoes.

As for who might or might not be what down the road - NO SPOILERS!

[Frontier]

The Batgirl thing was answered in a Reddit AMA a few months ago:

https://www.reddit.com/r/DCcomics/co...man_producers/

Yeah, this is basically what I was trying to say. Which is kind of silly when heroes taking over other heroes' identities even when they are still alive is a thing on this show (and Babs isn't going to be Batgirl again) and a major point of both of their character arcs is stepping into Barbara's shoes and making it their own.

I don't think it was the case but I can't deny it sounds like an editorial mandate. Or they just weren't interested given how little they did with both of them this season, but I blame that more on lack of ability to fit stuff in.

[Arsenal]

Given the age gap between Tim & Damian on the show, I wouldn’t be surprised if there is nobody active as Robin by the time Damian’s old enough to take the mantle.

[Frontier]

Given the age gap between Tim & Damian on the show, I wouldn’t be surprised if there is nobody active as Robin by the time Damian’s old enough to take the mantle.

Oh yeah, this time around Tim might be in his late 20's by the time Damian is old enough to be Robin.