Stephanie Brown: Spoiler, Robin, Batgirl Appreciation 2019

[millernumber1]

The way that DC Comics currently is, only a small hand of people are getting what they want. It's leaving everyone feeling angry and upset at the bullshit. Didio hates legacy characters and that is that. It's depressing to read.

I'm at that point too, I mean I love Batman, but I love Robin and Batgirl even more. This never ending shitting on legacy characters is only making my heart desire for them to outshine their mentors even more.

I'm very curious about who, exactly, is getting what they want. I think this week, Steph fans got what they wanted - but it's just one issue after a full year of waiting. There's also a sense that you can't really tell what you're getting until something is complete - there's a re-evaluation that happens after an arc or run is complete.

That being said, I do feel like there's a real disconnect between what DC is putting out and what fans are hoping for, and I don't see that getting changed soon enough, sadly.

I don't want Robin, Batgirl, or Spoiler to outshine Batman - but I would like it if there was a recognition from Batman that they're pretty cool.

[adrikito]

Despite I am not agree with Damian opinion here.. However, Bruce is between the worst members too, they are clearly father-son).. Opinions like this make us happy:

https://www.cbr.com/bat-family-best-worst-members/


BEST: SPOILER

Stephanie-Brown-Spoiler.jpg

Spoiler is one of the best members of the group because she was strong enough to leave it. That reasoning may seem unconventional but other members sometimes show blind obedience to Batman’s mission. Stephanie Brown has served as Batgirl and Robin, so she’s quite familiar with the faults of Batman’s war on crime; like a few other characters, Stephanie has paid the ultimate price for fighting alongside Batman.

When Tim Drake sacrificed himself to stop the Colony’s drones, Stephanie began questioning her role on the team. Eventually, she blatantly disagreed with Batman and threatened to expose his secret identity. These actions may seem contradictory to the success of the team but Stephanie’s ability to challenge Bruce makes her a valuable member of the group.


And we still have stupid people that continue hating her for this.. For not see Batman as someone Perfect who should obey without never doubt of him.

[Dataweaver]

I would love a Birds of Prey series with both Stephanie and Cass on it, along with Babs, Helena, Dinah, and Misfit: a sort of Senior and Junior dual team, with Babs, Helena, and Dinah as the mentors and Steph, Cass, and Charlie as the “mentees”.

[millernumber1]

Despite I am not agree with Damian opinion here.. However, Bruce is between the worst members too, they are clearly father-son).. Opinions like this make us happy:

https://www.cbr.com/bat-family-best-worst-members/


BEST: SPOILER

Stephanie-Brown-Spoiler.jpg

Spoiler is one of the best members of the group because she was strong enough to leave it. That reasoning may seem unconventional but other members sometimes show blind obedience to Batman’s mission. Stephanie Brown has served as Batgirl and Robin, so she’s quite familiar with the faults of Batman’s war on crime; like a few other characters, Stephanie has paid the ultimate price for fighting alongside Batman.

When Tim Drake sacrificed himself to stop the Colony’s drones, Stephanie began questioning her role on the team. Eventually, she blatantly disagreed with Batman and threatened to expose his secret identity. These actions may seem contradictory to the success of the team but Stephanie’s ability to challenge Bruce makes her a valuable member of the group.


And we still have stupid people that continue hating her for this.. For not see Batman as someone Perfect who should obey without never doubt of him.

Great article! Thanks for sharing!

I would love a Birds of Prey series with both Stephanie and Cass on it, along with Babs, Helena, Dinah, and Misfit: a sort of Senior and Junior dual team, with Babs, Helena, and Dinah as the mentors and Steph, Cass, and Charlie as the “mentees”.

That would be great! And as I said, a lot of us thought it might happen after the Burnside run and Rebirth was announced, but no

[adrikito]

I would love a Birds of Prey series with both Stephanie and Cass on it, along with Babs, Helena, Dinah, and Misfit: a sort of Senior and Junior dual team, with Babs, Helena, and Dinah as the mentors and Steph, Cass, and Charlie as the “mentees”.

I woud love that too.. Despite Cass appeared in YJ nothing more happened with Steph and Cass here..

[uchihafanboy]

I'm very curious about who, exactly, is getting what they want. I think this week, Steph fans got what they wanted - but it's just one issue after a full year of waiting. There's also a sense that you can't really tell what you're getting until something is complete - there's a re-evaluation that happens after an arc or run is complete.

That being said, I do feel like there's a real disconnect between what DC is putting out and what fans are hoping for, and I don't see that getting changed soon enough, sadly.

I don't want Robin, Batgirl, or Spoiler to outshine Batman - but I would like it if there was a recognition from Batman that they're pretty cool.

There are a small portion of people who believe Didio is doing the right thing, and that legacy characters can't be juggled and should be killed off. Those people are very strange and I think they should throw themselves off a bridge for being so close-minded.

And yeah, for us, this week was amazing but yes, you don't fully understand what you're getting until the arc or run is complete. It seems one way one issue, and then another way the next issue. Sometimes to fully understand and digest what you've gotten, you need to read the full thing and reflect on it. But that's hindsight, it's 20/20.

The disconnect is huge, but DC's sales keep falling, how low do they have to go before Didio is gone? Nobody knows.

Recognition from Batman is good, but I like seeing my boys and girls shine in the light.

Despite I am not agree with Damian opinion here.. However, Bruce is between the worst members too, they are clearly father-son).. Opinions like this make us happy:

No, what they say about Damian is true, any Damian hate is welcomed to me. He's the worst Robin and tarnishes the very meaning of Robin every single day

[Dataweaver]

Damian is easily my least favorite Robin; but I'm not going to advocate for his removal. I've seen too many characters removed just because someone doesn't think they have any redeeming qualities — Stephanie and Cass both come to mind — to be willing to do that to anyone. Damian has his fans, which is why he's still alive after Morrison had him killed; like it or not, he's earned the right to be Robin. And I say this as a fan of Tim Drake, the (kinda sorta former) Robin who would benefit the most from Damian's removal.

[millernumber1]

There are a small portion of people who believe Didio is doing the right thing, and that legacy characters can't be juggled and should be killed off. Those people are very strange and I think they should throw themselves off a bridge for being so close-minded.

And yeah, for us, this week was amazing but yes, you don't fully understand what you're getting until the arc or run is complete. It seems one way one issue, and then another way the next issue. Sometimes to fully understand and digest what you've gotten, you need to read the full thing and reflect on it. But that's hindsight, it's 20/20.

The disconnect is huge, but DC's sales keep falling, how low do they have to go before Didio is gone? Nobody knows.

Recognition from Batman is good, but I like seeing my boys and girls shine in the light.

No, what they say about Damian is true, any Damian hate is welcomed to me. He's the worst Robin and tarnishes the very meaning of Robin every single day

Umm. I generally try to avoid fighting with other fans in the appreciation threads.

I do hope that DC or Didio have an epiphany soon, but it seems like they're struggling for the past year or so, after two (I think) very good years).

[millernumber1]

Damian is easily my least favorite Robin; but I'm not going to advocate for his removal. I've seen too many characters removed just because someone doesn't think they have any redeeming qualities — Stephanie and Cass both come to mind — to be willing to do that to anyone. Damian has his fans, which is why he's still alive after Morrison had him killed; like it or not, he's earned the right to be Robin. And I say this as a fan of Tim Drake, the (kinda sorta former) Robin who would benefit the most from Damian's removal.

Every character is someone's favorite. As someone who's favorite has been brutally killed and then erased from existence, I do not wish that on anyone else.

[uchihafanboy]

Damian is easily my least favorite Robin; but I'm not going to advocate for his removal. I've seen too many characters removed just because someone doesn't think they have any redeeming qualities — Stephanie and Cass both come to mind — to be willing to do that to anyone. Damian has his fans, which is why he's still alive after Morrison had him killed; like it or not, he's earned the right to be Robin. And I say this as a fan of Tim Drake, the (kinda sorta former) Robin who would benefit the most from Damian's removal.

I never said he should be removed, but that I welcome any Damian hate. I've realized that now that Damian is here, there is nothing I can do to get rid of him. He's just here, and that's how it is going to be. I don't think he has earned the mantle of Robin and quite frankly he doesn't deserve it. He's just not Robin - The Boy Wonder. So to me, there is always time to hate Damian, he's just horrible.

Umm. I generally try to avoid fighting with other fans in the appreciation threads.

I do hope that DC or Didio have an epiphany soon, but it seems like they're struggling for the past year or so, after two (I think) very good years).

I honestly don't think Didio is ever going to change, he hates legacy characters and that is that. We need a massive shift in order to change DC. The real question is, how low do DC's sales have to go?

[adrikito]

No, what they say about Damian is true, any Damian hate is welcomed to me. He's the worst Robin and tarnishes the very meaning of Robin every single day

Take it easy.. I am his fan. Don´t quote my comment if you have to insult him..

Tim is my least favorite Robin(I don´t consider Duke a Robin) and I don´t insult him despite I think that Tynion admiration for him ruined Steph(the people still remembers this) in Tynion detective comics run..

I can´t understand the hate between some damian and steph fans.. I saw them as perfect older sister-young annoying brother..

[millernumber1]

Take it easy.. I am his fan. Don´t quote my comment if you have to insult him..

Tim is my least favorite Robin(I don´t consider Duke a Robin) and I don´t insult him despite I think that Tynion admiration for him ruined Steph(the people still remembers this) in Tynion detective comics run..

I can´t understand the hate between some damian and steph fans.. I saw them as perfect older sister-young annoying brother..

Damian and Steph in Batgirl is a really special relationship. I will always love them both for that.

[Dataweaver]

Take it easy.. I am his fan. Don´t quote my comment if you have to insult him..

Tim is my least favorite Robin(I don´t consider Duke a Robin) and I don´t insult him despite I think that Tynion admiration for him ruined Steph(the people still remembers this) in Tynion detective comics run..

I can´t understand the hate between some damian and steph fans.. I saw them as perfect older sister-young annoying brother..

As I said before, I'm in the opposite boat: Tim is my most favorite Robin and Damian is my least favorite. That said, I enjoy Super Sons because of the Damian/Jon dynamic, and I don't look forward to it ending (because, well, what has been done to Jon).

As for what Tynion did to Steph, I don't blame that on Tynion's admiration of Tim — mostly. The one thing where I was less than happy was that Stephanie has been reduced to just being Tim's girlfriend. That said, that's only a reduction in comparison to the heights Stephanie had reached just before Flashpoint. I'm fine with Stephanie and Tim being an item; but there's more to Tim than just being Stephanie's boyfriend, and there should be more to Stephanie than just being Tim's girlfriend. I'm hoping nothing bad happens to her with this “return of the Cluemaster” thing Bendis has cooked up; ideally, this will be a chance for her to shine on her own.

Conversely, while she's not a founding member of YJ, I'd love to see her eventually get added to the roster once they get back from Gemworld.

[millernumber1]

As I said before, I'm in the opposite boat: Tim is my most favorite Robin and Damian is my least favorite. That said, I enjoy Super Sons because of the Damian/Jon dynamic, and I don't look forward to it ending (because, well, what has been done to Jon).

As for what Tynion did to Steph, I don't blame that on Tynion's admiration of Tim — mostly. The one thing where I was less than happy was that Stephanie has been reduced to just being Tim's girlfriend. That said, that's only a reduction in comparison to the heights Stephanie had reached just before Flashpoint. I'm fine with Stephanie and Tim being an item; but there's more to Tim than just being Stephanie's boyfriend, and there should be more to Stephanie than just being Tim's girlfriend. I'm hoping nothing bad happens to her with this “return of the Cluemaster” thing Bendis has cooked up; ideally, this will be a chance for her to shine on her own.

Conversely, while she's not a founding member of YJ, I'd love to see her eventually get added to the roster once they get back from Gemworld.

The order of my favorite Robins (as Robins) is: Steph, Tim, Damian, Jason, Dick (I'm still torn on where to put Duke, and if I need to put Riko, Dre, Dax, etc in if I count him). But I do like them all as characters. As I said, though, I hope we don't spend time trashing characters in appreciation threads for other characters.

Re: Tynion's writing for Steph in Tec - I would agree that she was clearly his lowest priority during that run (except maybe poor Luke), but I don't think he intended to do badly with her. He had to delegate her solo issues to another writer, and her plotline was very inconsistent in the last 15 issues. The Tim and Steph relationship didn't get any development in Batman and Robin Eternal, or much in terms of how they got together in the (admittedly very sweet) flashbacks. Whatever the case, though, I still think 957 and 979-981 are really strong Steph issues, and I think if he had been able to do his run to 1000 as he wanted, it likely would have been much better for her particularly.

I do think that there's more to Steph in Tynion's run than just Tim's girlfriend, but I would agree that is probably her largest motivation. I also think that giving her back her archnemesis is a very strong move by Bendis, and hope he returns to that plotline.

[uchihafanboy]

Take it easy.. I am his fan. Don´t quote my comment if you have to insult him..

Tim is my least favorite Robin(I don´t consider Duke a Robin) and I don´t insult him despite I think that Tynion admiration for him ruined Steph(the people still remembers this) in Tynion detective comics run..

I can´t understand the hate between some damian and steph fans.. I saw them as perfect older sister-young annoying brother..

You said what they wrote about Damian is not true, I disagree. What they wrote about Damian is true. Whenever Damian is spoken about, I must hate him.

I don't understand why your bringing up Tim. He's not even my favourite Robin. But that's the one I seem to notice about Damian fans, they always bring up Tim and say "Tim is my least favourite Robin and xyz" it seems to me that Damian fans are Tim haters if anything else and nothing more.

I dislike Damian because he's just plain horrible. I can see the relationship they have, like the relationship and still hate Damian. You gravely misunderstand, i just do not like him. He's annoying, and always will be unworthy of the the title of Robin.