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  1. #1291
    Mighty Member dkrook's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BroHomo View Post
    Dang I had no idea the writer was black lolAnd after reading the story I'm glad he didn't...real tay
    lol I wouldn't call having the same skin color a 'resemblance' but if that was the case most of thecomic characters would look pasty and kinda doughy

    of course writers should write the stories they want But if not you then who?
    a black writer writing an XBook with an all black cast would be seen some type of way while books cast like X-Force, or 90sExcalibur are norm. It's like that South Park episode where Token (lil blk kid) and the new lil blk girl are actively dismissing each other because they're black!

    Thats why you'd hire writers that aren't stuck in their own spatial community. I mean damn I see this argument a lot...'writer resorting to caricaturical antics due to cultural differences' Buuut I'm like you're a writer you're supposed to be able to create a story...im positive if tasked to write a story centered around an East Asian kid with resorting to chopsticks and a Judo competition
    Your last passage killed it! You hire the type of writers and editors that are talented and of a mind for creating amazing art and stories. With that being said using Bishop, or Cyclops shouldn't even matter. No reason under the sun a great X-men story can't be centered around a Synch, Bishop, and even a Jesse Bedlam and be great.

  2. #1292
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paleo_Rage View Post
    No Hill can tell what story he wants and use what story he wants. I get that but also I would liked his ass to be a little more mindful though and even if he dont use a Black male character as a major part of his cast to at least use them in the background. Now thats just me. I feel like on one hand yes its super unfair for Black or Brown or Asian writers to have to write characters from their background but by this time in his life he already know that life is not fair for Black or other people of color. There are ways I think he could have did a better job but hell its over now and it is what it is.
    Hill has written black male characters like Michael Cray for The Wild Storm, Miles Morales in Spider-Man Annual Volume 2 and Black Lightning and Duke Thomas in Outsiders. That he had one book that didn't include a black male character does not erase all the work he's done to promote black characters.

    Black writers should have the freedom to write who they want. That is just as important as having more black heroes in fiction. Actually, it's far more important.

    And frankly, I'd rather Hill not feature black characters in his work that he doesn't want to write about and risk screwing them up which will only piss off their fans.
    Last edited by Agent Z; 08-03-2020 at 12:55 AM.

  3. #1293
    Astonishing Member Killerbee911's Avatar
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    Hill was writing Batman and the Outsiders, I have no issues with him wanting to do something different than what he was already doing at time.(Batman and the Outsider has Black Lighting and the Signal in it). No black writer or any writer shouldn't be forced to use character they aren't really interested in writing and as example Hill was really passionate about writing Magneto and Kwannon and it showed in his writing of the characters.

    My point about more black writers or even LGBTQ writers the more you have around the more different perspectives you get and you get someone who maybe doesn't see themselves Cyclops,Jean Grey, Wolverine and Kitty maybe they other characters get pushed to front a little more. Maybe you get someone who will see themselves in Storm or Bishop and advocate for the proper treatment of that character. Cyclops has had uneven treatment over the recent but there is always a writer who picks up their cape and go to war to repair Cyclops back to what he needs to be for the franchise. A lot of that happens because from Hickman to Bendis to Whedon to Morrison all of them have seen a little bit of Cyclops in themselves. Storm was integral part of the X-men in past she rose to point where Cyclops and her was 1A and 1B in the franchise in terms of leadership and since the Black Panther marriage nobody has fought to do a story to put Storm back in her place correctly. Bishop was character assassinated in Messiah Complex and there was zero effort to redeem him properly. What X-writer other than Hickman with Sunspot can you think of really going to bat for minority character in the franchise.

    I like I said it is fine if Black writer doesn't want to write about certain black characters but widening the pool pf writers away from straight white male lets people like Vita Ayala get to write stuff and Vita grew up liking Bishop, And when Vita got a chance to write Bishop it was done very well. Vita is writing COTA and shocker they are two new black characters and what looks like a non binary person oh yeah and Storm looks to be playing a part. Everything Vita, Leah, Tini have gotten their hands on has been diverse see Age of X-man or stuff that is happening now. I don't think they are being mandate to write something diverse they are just picking characters they like or relate from the pool of characters. Different perspectives are a good thing.
    Last edited by Killerbee911; 08-03-2020 at 12:55 AM.

  4. #1294
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    i use the Frog princess as a good example. No one thought, not a single person in marketing, pre-planning stage, or anything else, promotions, etc etc. Thought "um guys, maybe it's a bad look if the very first Disney princess we EVER has, has to kiss a Frog." That to me says everything about the state of a lot of these companies and why we do have to stay on them. I personally will never watch that movie just because of that.
    Don't let anyone else hold the candle that lights the way to your future because only you can sustain the flame.

  5. #1295
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    Quote Originally Posted by jwatson View Post
    i use the Frog princess as a good example. No one thought, not a single person in marketing, pre-planning stage, or anything else, promotions, etc etc. Thought "um guys, maybe it's a bad look if the very first Disney princess we EVER has, has to kiss a Frog." That to me says everything about the state of a lot of these companies and why we do have to stay on them. I personally will never watch that movie just because of that.
    I totally respect that. Still the movie is a lot better than you might think.

  6. #1296

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    Quote Originally Posted by Killerbee911 View Post
    What X-writer other than Hickman with Sunspot can you think of really going to bat for minority character in the franchise.
    I also like where Hickman seems to be taking Storm with her Giant-Size coming up (putting her own team together) and the stuff we've seen from the X of Swords promos. I wouldn't be surprised if things are shuffled a bit after Swords and she moves out of Marauders into something new. And I hope his Monet spins out of the Empyre mini into a regular book.



    And I'm really pulling for Prodigy in X-Factor. That whole book really.
    Boop! Krakoa forever!

  7. #1297
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    I totally respect that. Still the movie is a lot better than you might think.
    Sometimes it just honestly feels like a set up to me. "people have been pushing characters of color so lets give them one. They are so desperate they will take anything." and then they proceed to put them in something doomed to fail either for the reason i refuse to see it or others ala the Frog princess. Then they will use those numbers for a decade to justify diversity doesn't sell. It's either utter arrogance or an intentional catch 22 because if it does to well then they pigeon hole it into "this is exactly what the people want" and forget the some people are desperate for any content portion.
    Don't let anyone else hold the candle that lights the way to your future because only you can sustain the flame.

  8. #1298
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    Hill has written black male characters like Michael Cray for The Wild Storm, Miles Morales in Spider-Man Annual Volume 2 and Black Lightning and Duke Thomas in Outsiders. That he had one book that didn't include a black male character does not erase all the work he's done to promote black characters.

    Black writers should have the freedom to write who they want. That is just as important as having more black heroes in fiction. Actually, it's far more important.

    And frankly, I'd rather Hill not feature black characters in his work that he doesn't want to write about and risk screwing them up which will only piss off their fans.
    First off that’s all great that he wrote dc wild storm stuff and miles but it doesn’t change the x men stuff. Me wishing he had wrote a story with shola doesn’t discredit him it’s merely my opinion which I can definitely haves about my community.

    We all know when it comes to black men and x men they have one of the worst track records in comic book history. Nuff said.

  9. #1299
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    Quote Originally Posted by jwatson View Post
    i use the Frog princess as a good example. No one thought, not a single person in marketing, pre-planning stage, or anything else, promotions, etc etc. Thought "um guys, maybe it's a bad look if the very first Disney princess we EVER has, has to kiss a Frog." That to me says everything about the state of a lot of these companies and why we do have to stay on them. I personally will never watch that movie just because of that.
    You know it’s possible to like things but still critique it. A lot of Black people like it. Also another burden is that Black media has to be perfect and do everything . That’s virtually impossible.

  10. #1300
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paleo_Rage View Post
    You know itís possible to like things but still critique it. A lot of Black people like it. Also another burden is that Black media has to be perfect and do everything . Thatís virtually impossible.
    Very true but given Disney"s history with racial insensitivity in the past it felt like a shots fired moment to me. Why couldn't the chick in frozen be black? Nope let's how our first black princess kiss an animal and a big lipped frog at that. But I can admit sometimes in a little too woke but in this case I'm pretty sure the insult was intended. Then to top it off they went and tried to whitewash ol girl when they did that sleep over thing like "if we lighten her up she will be more acceptable." Rather than thinking " weeeellll maybe the premise played a part."
    Don't let anyone else hold the candle that lights the way to your future because only you can sustain the flame.

  11. #1301
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    And what message does it also send to young girls of color. Admittedly I have not seen it because I refuse to watch but it feels like the message is every white girl has a handsome prince out there just waiting for them (Belle excluded) but hey black girls maybe there's some little creature out there waiting for you to turn him into a prince. Like really.
    Don't let anyone else hold the candle that lights the way to your future because only you can sustain the flame.

  12. #1302
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    I think perhaps it was the setting that lended itself to a Black lead more than anything. Making the Princess in Frozen Black would’ve made little sense honestly, since it seemed to be set in Norway where the population is 94% Norwegian or Other White European. But the New Orleans setting for Princess and the Frog made perfect sense. Just in terms of racial demographics, as 60% of the population of NOLA is Black.

  13. #1303
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    Quote Originally Posted by jwatson View Post
    And what message does it also send to young girls of color. Admittedly I have not seen it because I refuse to watch but it feels like the message is every white girl has a handsome prince out there just waiting for them (Belle excluded) but hey black girls maybe there's some little creature out there waiting for you to turn him into a prince. Like really.
    The frog isn't actually a frog, he's a human prince who was turned into a frog. The movie was based on the Frog Prince fair tale. Also, Belle did have a handsome prince waiting for her, he was just under a temporary spell that made him not so handsome.

  14. #1304
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    The frog isn't actually a frog, he's a human prince who was turned into a frog. The movie was based on the Frog Prince fair tale. Also, Belle did have a handsome prince waiting for her, he was just under a temporary spell that made him not so handsome.
    But she didn't see him before is why i included her. She started to fall for the beast first but even with that there has been movie after movie of the white girl getting the handsome prince that's willing to risk it all to save her or be with her. We get a frog. Like really?
    Don't let anyone else hold the candle that lights the way to your future because only you can sustain the flame.

  15. #1305
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jackraow21 View Post
    I think perhaps it was the setting that lended itself to a Black lead more than anything. Making the Princess in Frozen Black would’ve made little sense honestly, since it seemed to be set in Norway where the population is 94% Norwegian or Other White European. But the New Orleans setting for Princess and the Frog made perfect sense. Just in terms of racial demographics, as 60% of the population of NOLA is Black.
    That's part of the problem. It's fiction they literally could have set it anywhere. I'm sure they chose the race first and then the location. The original takes place in germany. There was no reason in the movie frozen HAD to be set in Norway just like there was no reason the Princess and the Frog had to be set in new orleans. The location just makes it easier for these type of rationales later>
    Don't let anyone else hold the candle that lights the way to your future because only you can sustain the flame.

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