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  1. #301
    Ultimate Member Tycon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snoop Dogg View Post
    Bishop only has the sticking power that he has because he was introduced in a main book at the perfect time to introduce a new character and secured a place on the most widely and fondly remembered media adaptation in the franchise. That's not a knock on him, it's just true.

    Storm is not a token, which is why it's bad that they keep using her as one when the rest of Marvel is doing better despite other franchises not explicitly having diversity as a bedrock theme.

    Good younger characters who aren't MUH ICONIC would have a broader appeal if the X-Office bothered to give them actual appealing superhero costumes, like the unique looks everyone had years when ago they made the franchise start poppin'.
    Reminds me of Max’s (waitingforthet) comic:



    They’ve “tried” to individualize each uniform but it still comes off as same-y.

  2. #302
    Kinky Lil' Canine Snoop Dogg's Avatar
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    I actually like the suits and ties because it was in a book with some actual interest in doing school stuff. But that's over and we're still using the black and yellow as an excuse for characters to yell "YOU'RE CHILDREN WRRRYYYYYYYYY" at characters who've been around for over a decade.
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  3. #303
    Astonishing Member dkrook's Avatar
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    Naw, I think design has a part to play. I still lean heavily on who writers want to push. Example i give is drop! I though to myself it's a friggin floating blob...???? Yet he was crossed over into like three different books that I'm aware of. Why a writer or two was insistent on using him. Surely Tag, Synch, or even Bedlam can be written to be badass characters, hell isn't that why writers are paid. Wolverine started off as a half pint, crazed midget with claws that talked stuff but caught hands on many occasions. Yet here we are with him believed to be the lifeblood of the X-Men.

  4. #304
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    Quote Originally Posted by dkrook View Post
    Naw, I think design has a part to play. I still lean heavily on who writers want to push. Example i give is drop! I though to myself it's a friggin floating blob...???? Yet he was crossed over into like three different books that I'm aware of. Why a writer or two was insistent on using him. Surely Tag, Synch, or even Bedlam can be written to be badass characters, hell isn't that why writers are paid. Wolverine started off as a half pint, crazed midget with claws that talked stuff but caught hands on many occasions. Yet here we are with him believed to be the lifeblood of the X-Men.
    never understood why they give him this specific speech, but don't provide a translation,..or alphabet at the back of the issue. Might as well have nothing written there.

  5. #305
    Astonishing Member dkrook's Avatar
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    End of the day there's no excuse for this question to have to be ask in 2019.

  6. #306
    The King Fears NO ONE! Triniking1234's Avatar
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    This problem can be easily solved by having more cartoons.

  7. #307
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    Quote Originally Posted by dkrook View Post
    End of the day there's no excuse for this question to have to be ask in 2019.
    Nothing's changed. The decades go on and as much as people like to think there's been progress there really hasn't been progress.

  8. #308
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    Quote Originally Posted by WhiteQueenEmmaFrost View Post
    Nothing's changed. The decades go on and as much as people like to think there's been progress there really hasn't been progress.
    I mean, I'm sure there's been progress since 1963...

  9. #309
    Fantastic Member Sundown's Avatar
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    I just don't think the people who actually spend money on comic books has changed enough. The counter argument being "well, if they don't see something that interests them, why would they start buying?" The counter to that is -- why would Marvel continue to risk guaranteed sales for maybe sales?

    I say "continue to" because they have thrown out some new things, and they haven't done particularly well in many cases. Wolverine and Cyclops have been dead a while now, and the X-Men have been focused almost exclusively on stories about Kitty and Jeen/Jean. I can't recall that sales have been this low since the 1960's, though correct me if I'm wrong. Iceman solos sales aren't much to write home about, either. Black Panther and Crew was cancelled due to lack of interest, from what I've read. In short, these attempts at diversity (actually, I wouldn't necessarily call it diversity, rather a change from the status quo) have flopped, it would appear.

    The films are a far better platform to take those risks, imo, as far as being likely to reap rewards.

    Another option, if they want people to even give a book a chance, is to lower the bloody prices. Keep 3.99 for the top sellers, and drop satellites and satellite character solos to 2.99.
    Last edited by Sundown; 01-18-2019 at 07:18 PM.

  10. #310
    Extraordinary Member Silver Fang's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Star_Jammer View Post
    I mean, I'm sure there's been progress since 1963...
    We got a bit better 60's - 90's lol

    But things almost seemed to have reversed since we entered the 2000's.

  11. #311
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sundown View Post
    I just don't think the people who actually spend money on comic books has changed enough. The counter argument being "well, if they don't see something that interests them, why would they start buying?" The counter to that is -- why would Marvel continue to risk guaranteed sales for maybe sales?

    I say "continue to" because they have thrown out some new things, and they haven't done particularly well in many cases. Wolverine and Cyclops have been dead a while now, and the X-Men have been focused almost exclusively on stories about Kitty and Jeen/Jean. I can't recall that sales have been this low since the 1960's, though correct me if I'm wrong. Iceman solos sales aren't much to write home about, either. Black Panther and Crew was cancelled due to lack of interest, from what I've read. In short, these attempts at diversity (actually, I wouldn't necessarily call it diversity, rather a change from the status quo) have flopped, it would appear.

    The films are a far better platform to take those risks, imo, as far as being likely to reap rewards.

    Another option, if they want people to even give a book a chance, is to lower the bloody prices. Keep 3.99 for the top sellers, and drop satellites and satellite character solos to 2.99.
    attempts on diversity haven't flopped.

    nobody says attempts at whiteness fail when punisher and moon knight solos get canceled

    Also Kitty and Jean came out while Marvel was sabotaging X-men to benefit the Inhumans. But let's blam ethe women

  12. #312
    Fantastic Member Sundown's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by spirit2011 View Post
    attempts on diversity haven't flopped.

    nobody says attempts at whiteness fail when punisher and moon knight solos get canceled

    Also Kitty and Jean came out while Marvel was sabotaging X-men to benefit the Inhumans. But let's blam ethe women
    I think you may have misconstrued some of what I was trying to say.-.-

    Comics are overpriced. If you expect someone to spend 3.99 a month (sometimes bi-monthly) there better be a market for it. Clearly, there was no market for BP&Crew, though the BP series sells a respectable 30k.

    Pushing Cyclops and Wolverine out (and I was tired of reading about them, too) then making the teams all female led, combined with poor writing that turned team books into solos about Kitty and Jean and utilizing almost none of the team... flopped. Red was the best of them, but even that book, that started out well, dipped into the same thing.

    I have no clue why they keep publishing Iceman, tbh. I've read someone saying that it does well digitally -- I expect that can also be said for other series that have been cancelled, though, so I don't know why that book would be the exception.
    Last edited by Sundown; 01-18-2019 at 07:38 PM.

  13. #313
    Cosmic Curmudgeon JudicatorPrime's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sundown View Post
    I just don't think the people who actually spend money on comic books has changed enough. The counter argument being "well, if they don't see something that interests them, why would they start buying?" The counter to that is -- why would Marvel continue to risk guaranteed sales for maybe sales?
    Good question. In what category do we put Rob Liefeld's forthecoming Major X title? Guaranteed sale or maybe sale?
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  14. #314
    The King Fears NO ONE! Triniking1234's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sundown View Post
    I just don't think the people who actually spend money on comic books has changed enough. The counter argument being "well, if they don't see something that interests them, why would they start buying?" The counter to that is -- why would Marvel continue to risk guaranteed sales for maybe sales?

    I say "continue to" because they have thrown out some new things, and they haven't done particularly well in many cases. Wolverine and Cyclops have been dead a while now, and the X-Men have been focused almost exclusively on stories about Kitty and Jeen/Jean. I can't recall that sales have been this low since the 1960's, though correct me if I'm wrong. Iceman solos sales aren't much to write home about, either. Black Panther and Crew was cancelled due to lack of interest, from what I've read. In short, these attempts at diversity (actually, I wouldn't necessarily call it diversity, rather a change from the status quo) have flopped, it would appear.

    The films are a far better platform to take those risks, imo, as far as being likely to reap rewards.

    Another option, if they want people to even give a book a chance, is to lower the bloody prices. Keep 3.99 for the top sellers, and drop satellites and satellite character solos to 2.99.
    They need to go back to some olden tactics and just have the minor characters be back stories in the main books. Also good luck trying to get the costs of books down to $3 or less especially with the sales books are making these days.

    TV shows and cartoons should be ads for the books but for some reason Marvel/Disney haven't figured this out yet even though Japan has ages ago. I don't know how they struggle to put 12 episodes of a Black Panther cartoon a year when Shonen Jump can put out 39 - 50 of their Avengers Academy/New X-Men anime easily.

  15. #315
    Kinky Lil' Canine Snoop Dogg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sundown View Post

    I have no clue why they keep publishing Iceman, tbh. I've read someone saying that it does well digitally -- I expect that can also be said for other series that have been cancelled, though, so I don't know why that book would be the exception.
    You ain't supposed to know because Marvel digital/trade financials ain't public. But if those numbers revived a cancelled title, then they have to be exceptional compared to other finished books.
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