Why haven't any of the Black Male X-men caught on other than Bishop?

[PrezValentine]

To each their own I guess. I personally see nothing wrong with the "angry black man" label folks try put on some... like it's a bad thing, y'know? I say embrace it.

You'll find different answers depending on who you ask about this stereotype, because in some places that's all you get.

Here in Brazil, the "angry black man" is the most common stereotype, tied very closely with the "rascal" black man, for the lack of a better word. It's very often one of these two extremes, the black man is either an angry man, to whom life has been unfair and who's always showing rage and some cruelty, even if he "succeeds". Or he's the smart guy who gets stuff by lying to others and is mostly a comic relief.

It's one of the reasons T'Challa was such a welcome change for people here and why some really disliked how people thought Killmonger was "right" or was a better character than him. I don't know how it is in the US (except for what I see in movies) or wherever you live from, but it's understandable how people from here or countries who live with similar portrayal feel about the "angry black man" in fiction.

[From The Shadows]

To each their own I guess. I personally see nothing wrong with the "angry black man" label folks try put on some... like it's a bad thing, y'know? I say embrace it.

Uh, if that's all creators portrayed then it would be stereotyping. It may be seen as entertainment to you but not all POC can relate to the angry minority character. I would prefer a spectrum of personalities.

[JudicatorPrime]

DC is just sitting around on Nommo/Dr. Mist, who could be very much an 'African Sorcerer Supreme,' if they wanted to go that route, but no...

And yeah, Brother Voodoo was a mess. A voodoo houngan who was apparently designed by people who didn't seem to know a darn thing about voodoo. Control animals? Hypnotize people? Slight super-strength? Comes and goes in a puff of smoke/mist? That's not 'voodoo super-powers,' that's a damn vampire! What next, oh House of Ideas, a Catholic priest whose 'religious themed super-powers' are that he turns into a wolf? Tying Voodoo's powers into channeling the loa, and themes tied to Legba, Damballah, the Ghede/Samedi, Aiyida-Wedo, Erzulie, etc. would make sense, but require the writer to actually crack a book/web-page.

It doesn't help that editorial has messed with his powers. He's been shown teleporting into a plummeting fighter-jet to rescue the unconscious pilot, zapping him clear before it crashed, and in the same year, IIRC, the Marvel Handbook claimed that he couldn't really teleport, that he just summoned smoke to distract people and then snuck into and out of places with thief-y skills. (Yeah. Good luck 'sneaking' onto and off of a plummeting jet fighter...)

I give DC a pass, because at least they made the Spectre a brother at one point. I have a feeling I'll be dead and worm food by the time Marvel ever shows a black man as one of the top 3-4 most powerful beings in all of reality.

But you're right, Voodoo needs to be reworked and they need to be consistent with his core belief system. Magic is such an open-ended proposition, you wouldn't think that they could screw it up. But they did.

[dkrook]

I give DC a pass, because at least they made the Spectre a brother at one point. I have a feeling I'll be dead and worm food by the time Marvel ever shows a black man as one of the top 3-4 most powerful beings in all of reality.

But you're right, Voodoo needs to be reworked and they need to be consistent with his core belief system. Magic is such an open-ended proposition, you wouldn't think that they could screw it up. But they did.

Your post along with the fact that right now the X-men are putting out a story where they have these all powerful mutants that are warping reality yet again and there is easily a place to include a character like Synch into that mix with his power level potential.

[JudicatorPrime]

Your post along with the fact that right now the X-men are putting out a story where they have these all powerful mutants that are warping reality yet again and there is easily a place to include a character like Synch into that mix with his power level potential.

Marvel has a black reality warper -- Willie Evans, Jr. There's some debate as to whether or not he's truly dead. Like I said, Marvel's record when it comes to the killing of black male characters before they achieve their potential is beyond ridiculous. They could bring back Willie, but they won't. Shooter didn't even want him in the X-Men at all. Meanwhile Franklin Richards gets to be the all powerful one.

[Sutekh]

I give DC a pass, because at least they made the Spectre a brother at one point. I have a feeling I'll be dead and worm food by the time Marvel ever shows a black man as one of the top 3-4 most powerful beings in all of reality.

Yeah, Marvel 'cosmic' is a big ol' sausagefest of (alien) white dudes. Galactus, the Stranger, the Living Tribunal, the Shaper of Worlds, the Elders of the Universe, the In-Betweener, etc. Not a terribly diverse working environment, at that tier, unless 'blue' counts for diversity. Even the 'cosmic' heroes are pretty limited, on the diversity front, although Blue Marvel and Monica Rambeau (and Moondragon and Phlya) are finally busting down the door and walking into that segregated gentleman's club.

Which reminds me, I miss the Sphinx (the original dude *and* the lady from the New Warriors run). I've always been a nut for stuff about Egypt, and having one of the crazy powerful villains come from Africa (whether or not he's classified as 'black') was a neat touch.

But you're right, Voodoo needs to be reworked and they need to be consistent with his core belief system. Magic is such an open-ended proposition, you wouldn't think that they could screw it up. But they did.

Yeah, he's like a double fail, because he isn't consistent with anything to do with real life voodoo, *and* he isn't consistent with 616 magical practices, with the three sources of power (trained, personal and invoked). He's more like a randomly powered super-person with a magical origin story, like somebody rolled him up from a chart of random super-powers for an RPG (Animal Control! Immunity to fire! Super-strength! And I can teleport, only there's all this smoke, and drumming, and by the time it's over, I probably could have walked there...) and then the 'magical' background trait.

I *want* to like Brother Voodoo/Doctor Voodoo, but he's just a mess.

[JudicatorPrime]

Yeah, Marvel 'cosmic' is a big ol' sausagefest of (alien) white dudes. Galactus, the Stranger, the Living Tribunal, the Shaper of Worlds, the Elders of the Universe, the In-Betweener, etc. Not a terribly diverse working environment, at that tier, unless 'blue' counts for diversity. Even the 'cosmic' heroes are pretty limited, on the diversity front, although Blue Marvel and Monica Rambeau (and Moondragon and Phlya) are finally busting down the door and walking into that segregated gentleman's club.

Which reminds me, I miss the Sphinx (the original dude *and* the lady from the New Warriors run). I've always been a nut for stuff about Egypt, and having one of the crazy powerful villains come from Africa (whether or not he's classified as 'black') was a neat touch.

Never is the latent, unconscious racism more apparent than in the cosmic tapestry. As much as I love cosmic characters and stories, the problem of representation is magnified a billion fold in that arena. I still think it's funny that they've depicted worlds where the beings are mostly white, or mostly blue, or green, or orange or whatever color, but I don't ever recall them ever showing a planet where the population had black or brown features similar to Earth's afrocentric population. The closest that you get is the Horusians, but they have just as many yellow as brown Horusians. Considering that most use technology to disguise themselves, I can't even be sure that's what their native features look like.

I realize the one Elder of the Universe, the Astronomer, has afrocentric features, but since he's the last of his kind and not really a major player, I consider him tokenized. lol

Anyway, I think we've derailed this thread enough. We'll just have to wait and see what Marvel comes up with and just hope for the best.

[angrt1]

Uh, if that's all creators portrayed then it would be stereotyping. It may be seen as entertainment to you but not all POC can relate to the angry minority character. I would prefer a spectrum of personalities.

THAT PART Black people aren’t monolithic like we all don’t know how to do the Cat Daddy

[CRaymond]

*Derailment*

My favorite Elder of the Marvel Universe is Guinan, I mean Sister Mary Clarence, I mean Oda Mae Brown, I mean Celie.

[Beetle]

*Derailment*

My favorite Elder of the Marvel Universe is Guinan, I mean Sister Mary Clarence, I mean Oda Mae Brown, I mean Celie.

I really liked the redesign Numinus got a few years back. It's less Whoopi

[JudicatorPrime]

"The Color Purple" for Numinus. Close, but it wouldn't be the first time that they took a character who probably should have been black and made them blue or lilac or grey. Anyone ever see the first appearance of Champion (Tryco Slatterus)? He was originally drawn with high cheek bones, thick lips and a wide nose. The mane wasn't necessarily afrocentric, but some of the other features were. But alas, they made him blue-skinned. They just couldn't help themselves.

[Drey]

*Derailment*

My favorite Elder of the Marvel Universe is Guinan, I mean Sister Mary Clarence, I mean Oda Mae Brown, I mean Celie.

"Molly...you in danger, girl".

But yeah now I'm getting sad about the discussion.

But there's hope! Prisoner X will have Black and Native American characters in Bishop, Dani, and Forge.

[dkrook]

See, whenever I see "angry black man" and then "stereotype" next to it, I get the feel folks see it as a negative. What about the "angry white man" stereotype? You never see folks bring that up. All these white cops point their guns at you for the littlest thing, shoutin and screaming and they don't even care if you with your youngins. Done encountered and seen way more angry white folks in my time than black folks. Why don't they get that stereotype label for being angry? Nah they get the more innocent ones for not having no rhythm or hot dog water aroma. I understand it's it's a double standard in this country, like whenever we a black football player doing anything remotely animated, they be like "Oh what this guy pissed about now?" But when Tom Brady be over acting a fool, "Oh that Thomas, look at that passion he has for the game."

I know I got off topic a bit, sorry bout that... my head went somewhere lol.

You are not far off. I would rate mic droppable!

[dkrook]

Never is the latent, unconscious racism more apparent than in the cosmic tapestry. As much as I love cosmic characters and stories, the problem of representation is magnified a billion fold in that arena. I still think it's funny that they've depicted worlds where the beings are mostly white, or mostly blue, or green, or orange or whatever color, but I don't ever recall them ever showing a planet where the population had black or brown features similar to Earth's afrocentric population. The closest that you get is the Horusians, but they have just as many yellow as brown Horusians. Considering that most use technology to disguise themselves, I can't even be sure that's what their native features look like.

I realize the one Elder of the Universe, the Astronomer, has afrocentric features, but since he's the last of his kind and not really a major player, I consider him tokenized. lol

Anyway, I think we've derailed this thread enough. We'll just have to wait and see what Marvel comes up with and just hope for the best.

Even crazier when you consider the biological consequences, and relationship between sun/solar energy and a melanin and the imaginative things to writer with these considerations.

[Snoop Dogg]

Angry black men are underrepresented in media, unless they're angry about a limited number of specifically race-related issues. Gimme an angry brother who gets tight about broader ethical and philosophical concepts in their society. Or the way their neighbor parks. POC are more limited in the archetypes they can be. Generally they can get a few slices of the pie and then some more territory on certain ones which play into race stereotypes. Like sassy for black women. Calm and reserved for Asians. Angry for black men (but god forbid it be about anything other than crackers and THE MAN). And lots of POC characters are exemplary examples of those archetypes, but new characters should be allowed to be more, and old characters should be allowed to evolve.

but ha ha ha these are the x-books so we're gonna need to do some more work until we reach even the bare minimum ha ha ha hee hee ho amirite fellas