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  1. #496
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    Quote Originally Posted by Digifiend View Post
    In the comics, Rayshaun idolised Rage, and then became Sam Wilson's sidekick, receiving training from a Black Widow AI and tech from Ironheart's Tony Stark AI during Secret Empire. He later buddied up with Falcon, Sam's other sidekick, and both joined the Champions together. In the Marvel Rising cartoons, he was Steve Rogers's sidekick instead, and Steve secretly arranged for the Secret Warriors to be formed as a way to get him with heroes his own age. Neither version is similar to Eli's backstory, where he takes drugs to get powers and forms a team off panel prior to Young Avengers #1.
    Eli's creators, for all that I love their creations, were not-great at describing said MGH-fueled powers. *Supposedly,* his powers from MGH were not the same as those he got later from his grandfather's super-soldier-serum-enhanced blood, but since we literally know nothing other than he had enhanced hearing once, because he said so, and that he didn't have super-strength at another point, because he was criticizing Hulkling for not being able to bust down a door, it's a great mystery.

    Along with whether or not Hulkling has any powers from Mar-Vell's side of the family, or why Billy has changed from someone who can fly and shoot lightning to a spellcaster to a reality manipulator, or what the hell Jonas could do with a body made out of a future-tech suit of Iron Man armor... (In theory, it would start with flying and shooting repulsor rays, but the hot second the Iron Lad armor turned into a Vision-body, it stopped shooting repulsor rays and started phasing through walls, as if the writers didn't remember that Jonas wasn't actually in the Vision's body...).

    I love the characters, I really do, but, gosh, the writers didn't seem to have the first idea what they could do, in a story bible sort of sense, and it doesn't terribly surprise me that other writers aren't chomping at the bit to use them, given how fuzzily defined they are (except of course Kate, who has no powers, and, perhaps not coincidentally, gets more post-Young Avengers follow up appearances...).

    I often wish there was still some sort of 'Handbook to the Marvel Universe' going on, or that the writers of the comics played some sort of superhero RPGs like Mutants & Masterminds, or MMOs like City of Heroes, so that they would consider, at least briefly, the characters on a mechanical level. Figure out what can they do. Figure out what *can't* they do. You don't have to tell *me,* the reader, any of that, but it should be available for other writers, so that they can write these characters consistently.

  2. #497
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sutekh View Post
    Eli's creators, for all that I love their creations, were not-great at describing said MGH-fueled powers. *Supposedly,* his powers from MGH were not the same as those he got later from his grandfather's super-soldier-serum-enhanced blood, but since we literally know nothing other than he had enhanced hearing once, because he said so, and that he didn't have super-strength at another point, because he was criticizing Hulkling for not being able to bust down a door, it's a great mystery.

    Along with whether or not Hulkling has any powers from Mar-Vell's side of the family, or why Billy has changed from someone who can fly and shoot lightning to a spellcaster to a reality manipulator, or what the hell Jonas could do with a body made out of a future-tech suit of Iron Man armor... (In theory, it would start with flying and shooting repulsor rays, but the hot second the Iron Lad armor turned into a Vision-body, it stopped shooting repulsor rays and started phasing through walls, as if the writers didn't remember that Jonas wasn't actually in the Vision's body...).

    I love the characters, I really do, but, gosh, the writers didn't seem to have the first idea what they could do, in a story bible sort of sense, and it doesn't terribly surprise me that other writers aren't chomping at the bit to use them, given how fuzzily defined they are (except of course Kate, who has no powers, and, perhaps not coincidentally, gets more post-Young Avengers follow up appearances...).

    I often wish there was still some sort of 'Handbook to the Marvel Universe' going on, or that the writers of the comics played some sort of superhero RPGs like Mutants & Masterminds, or MMOs like City of Heroes, so that they would consider, at least briefly, the characters on a mechanical level. Figure out what can they do. Figure out what *can't* they do. You don't have to tell *me,* the reader, any of that, but it should be available for other writers, so that they can write these characters consistently.
    Ditto...

    I don't want the characters all over the place....Venom after Eddie got ahold of the symbiote...but also don't want to be bogged down in the minutia. Steve Rogers can lift 800 lbs....but if in a moment of supreme effort when all seems lost and he pushed somewhat beyond that...say holding a car that is going over the edge of a bridge for a few moments so the people can get out....and feeling it afterwards...I am fine with it.

  3. #498
    Astonishing Member Drops Of Venus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sutekh View Post
    Eli's creators, for all that I love their creations, were not-great at describing said MGH-fueled powers. *Supposedly,* his powers from MGH were not the same as those he got later from his grandfather's super-soldier-serum-enhanced blood, but since we literally know nothing other than he had enhanced hearing once, because he said so, and that he didn't have super-strength at another point, because he was criticizing Hulkling for not being able to bust down a door, it's a great mystery.

    Along with whether or not Hulkling has any powers from Mar-Vell's side of the family, or why Billy has changed from someone who can fly and shoot lightning to a spellcaster to a reality manipulator, or what the hell Jonas could do with a body made out of a future-tech suit of Iron Man armor... (In theory, it would start with flying and shooting repulsor rays, but the hot second the Iron Lad armor turned into a Vision-body, it stopped shooting repulsor rays and started phasing through walls, as if the writers didn't remember that Jonas wasn't actually in the Vision's body...).

    I love the characters, I really do, but, gosh, the writers didn't seem to have the first idea what they could do, in a story bible sort of sense, and it doesn't terribly surprise me that other writers aren't chomping at the bit to use them, given how fuzzily defined they are (except of course Kate, who has no powers, and, perhaps not coincidentally, gets more post-Young Avengers follow up appearances...).

    I often wish there was still some sort of 'Handbook to the Marvel Universe' going on, or that the writers of the comics played some sort of superhero RPGs like Mutants & Masterminds, or MMOs like City of Heroes, so that they would consider, at least briefly, the characters on a mechanical level. Figure out what can they do. Figure out what *can't* they do. You don't have to tell *me,* the reader, any of that, but it should be available for other writers, so that they can write these characters consistently.
    The way I always interpreted it is that MGH gave him similar powers to the SSS, which is why the drug was the perfect cover-up for his powers and the excuse he gave at first. Later on, that excuse became a reality when he actually needed the blood transfusion from his grandad. I don't think his powerset ever changed that much. He probably just got a little more powerful and healthier, since his powers came from a genuine Super Soldier and he wasn't drugging himself in order to get them.

    As for Teddy, yes, we don't know if he inherited anything from the Vell lineage, but that's not really an inconsistency, it's just writers not exploring a certain plot point. I mean, we didn't know Teddy was supposed to be a cosmic messiah who could be the only one to literally wield a magical, cosmic sword until Al Ewing decided to write that story, right? So nothing's stopping future writers from saying Teddy has a vaster powerset he just hasn't been able to tap into for whatever reason. And I don't think Billy's powers EVER changed, they just evolved. He was always a reality warper, he just didn't know the extent of his powers, so he thought it was just a simple spellcasting. The eletrokinesis was obviously to make him look more like Thor, but that's not how he chooses to present himself anymore, so it's not a power he particularly has to keep using, and I have no problem with that. Now, WHY he is such a powerful reality warper by nature when Wanda never got to that kind of power level unless she was being possessed by external forces, I don't know. That is up to the writers to figure out and explain in the future, and they actually have a perfect explanation for this if they consider Mephisto's connection to the Maximoff babies...

    As for Jonas, I don't know. Iron Lad wasn't around enough for us to know the full extent of what his armor could do. It was 31st century tech, after all. Maybe all those things Jonas did were things the armor could've always done in the first place, and Jonas chose to focus in the powerset that was most suited to him, since he did had Vision's OS installed in himself. Or maybe he got an upgrade when he was in custody of the New Avengers and Tony Stark conducted all kinds of experiments on him to make sure he wasn't a threat.
    Last edited by Drops Of Venus; 05-18-2019 at 11:12 PM.

  4. #499
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drops Of Venus View Post
    The way I always interpreted it is that MGH gave him similar powers to the SSS, which is why the drug was the perfect cover-up for his powers and the excuse he gave at first. Later on, that excuse became a reality when he actually needed the blood transfusion from his grandad. I don't think his powerset ever changed that much. He probably just got a little more powerful and healthier, since his powers came from a genuine Super Soldier and he wasn't drugging himself in order to get them.
    It would have made sense, but, like I said, the writing didn't give much away, other than that he *didn't* have super-strength when the Avengers locked them in their rooms, and, post-transfusion, he *did* have super-hearing (which wasn't a power that Captain America is particularly known for...).

    So it's kind of a crap shoot.

    As for Teddy, yes, we don't know if he inherited anything from the Vell lineage, but that's not really an inconsistency, it's just writers not exploring a certain plot point. I mean, we didn't know Teddy was supposed to be a cosmic messiah who could be the only one to literally wield a magical, cosmic sword until Al Ewing decided to write that story, right? So nothing's stopping future writers from saying Teddy has a vaster powerset he just hasn't been able to tap into for whatever reason.
    Mar-Vell's powers themselves were weird and inconsistent (and some came from his Nega-Bands, and others from Eon's gift, etc. and likely wouldn't pass on genetically). But super-human strength, fueled by sunlight, and perhaps flight, also fueled by sunlight, seem to make the most sense. Having a weaker subset of that power, and having to use Skrull shapeshifting to grow tiny wings and big muscles to enhance those more marginal powers would make sense. But, again, it's never been stated, other than in the negative (that he *didn't* have super-strength, although he's clearly seemed to have above-human strength in combat, just not 'rip steel bank vault door off it's hinges' levels of super-strength...).

    And I don't think Billy's powers EVER changed, they just evolved. He was always a reality warper, he just didn't know the extent of his powers, so he thought it was just a simple spellcasting. The eletrokinesis was obviously to make him look more like Thor, but that's not how he chooses to present himself anymore, so it's not a power he particularly has to keep using, and I have no problem with that. Now, WHY he is such a powerful reality warper by nature when Wanda never got to that kind of power level unless she was being possessed by external forces, I don't know. That is up to the writers to figure out and explain in the future, and they actually have a perfect explanation for this if they consider Mephisto's connection to the Maximoff babies...
    Yeah, that's a story waiting to be told. Given Billy's spiritual connection to Mephisto, it might even turn out that his 'reality manipulation' comes from 'step-dad,' and might go away (or have dire consequences if he keeps using it), forcing him to go back to basics and learn some *actual* magic to get by. It would be quite a demotion from 'snap your fingers and end cancer/war/poverty/pollution, except that the writers don't want you to,' to having to invoke the Shields of the Seraphim to defend himself, or the Vapors of Valtorr to conjure a concealing fog or the 'Thunder of Thor' (an invokation of his own invention, validating the notion that he's got the potential to go places as a magician!) to throw lightning (and tapping into Thor the same way that the Crimson Bands of Cytorrak tap into Cytorrak, which could lead to some future interaction between Thor and Billy, as Thor would be distantly aware of Billy using the spell, even if it wouldn't materially weaken him anymore than Cytorrak loses power whenever Dr. Strange casts the Crimson Bands).

    As for Jonas, I don't know. Iron Lad wasn't around enough for us to know the full extent of what his armor could do. It was 31st century tech, after all. Maybe all those things Jonas did were things the armor could've always done in the first place, and Jonas chose to focus in the powerset that was most suited to him, since he did had Vision's OS installed in himself. Or maybe he got an upgrade when he was in custody of the New Avengers and Tony Stark conducted all kinds of experiments on him to make sure he wasn't a threat.
    I tend to feel that the writers, particularly those who came later and didn't know the characters as well as their creator, just saw a 'Vision' and had him do 'Vision things,' unaware that the Iron Lad armor he was made out of could do all sorts of 'Iron Man things,' like shoot repulsor rays, or generate an electrical field, as well.

  5. #500
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drops Of Venus View Post
    The way I always interpreted it is that MGH gave him similar powers to the SSS, which is why the drug was the perfect cover-up for his powers and the excuse he gave at first. Later on, that excuse became a reality when he actually needed the blood transfusion from his grandad. I don't think his powerset ever changed that much. He probably just got a little more powerful and healthier, since his powers came from a genuine Super Soldier and he wasn't drugging himself in order to get them.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sutekh View Post
    It would have made sense, but, like I said, the writing didn't give much away, other than that he *didn't* have super-strength when the Avengers locked them in their rooms, and, post-transfusion, he *did* have super-hearing (which wasn't a power that Captain America is particularly known for...).
    I figured the MGH did strength, stamina, maybe a little added durability.....However the SSS was the whole package.

    As far a senses on SSS...they are not superhuman...but are very sharp.

  6. #501
    Astonishing Member Raye's Avatar
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    https://twitter.com/AgentM/status/1130218745136336897

    So looks like the story in War Scrolls is a prequel of some kind probably, and Kate's in it too! probably. aw, lookit the picture on the bedstand, too cute.

  7. #502
    Extraordinary Member Fokken's Avatar
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    Love the inclusion of the group shot from the Style>Substance period.

    What is the photo on Billy's side of the bed? Them at an event? At a wedding? AT THEIR WEDDING AND TEDDY IS FEEDING BILLY CAKE OR WUTTTTT????

  8. #503

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fokken View Post
    Love the inclusion of the group shot from the Style>Substance period.

    What is the photo on Billy's side of the bed? Them at an event? At a wedding? AT THEIR WEDDING AND TEDDY IS FEEDING BILLY CAKE OR WUTTTTT????
    My guess is prom.

  9. #504
    Astonishing Member Drops Of Venus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SonofScarlet View Post
    My guess is prom.
    It better be. I refuse to believe they got married off-page. We've barely seen them engaged on-page. I accept nothing less than actual on-page development, leading to an actual on-page wedding. DO YOU HEAR ME, MARVEL??? Anyway, I love this already. The entire issue could be just them being domestic like this and I would be fulfilled. I've missed these boys so much.

    So, Billy had brunch with Kate... but ends up on a brunch with Loki somehow. Anyone else thinking that Kate might just be Loki in disguise, actually? I'm trying to figure out how this ties into WOTR... Loki is obviously the link, it seems. Maybe he needed help from Billy and Teddy for something related to the event, and pretended to be Kate to get them to give him a chance or something? I could see the story going like this. And I wish this would turn out to be relevant to the actual main event, but I doubt Jason Aaron cares, honestly. Hopefully we might get a follow-up on Loki's upcoming book.

  10. #505
    Astonishing Member Raye's Avatar
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    That was kinda why I put the 'probably' part in there. I mean it WOULD explain the 'drag' part. And yeah, not sure why he'd do that. He may think they wouldn't want to talk to him otherwise because of what happened in YA, he walked away before he gave them a chance to forgive him, which they would have, because they're nice like that, (which he said himself) and then he pretty publicly 'turned heel' recently, I mean it was an act done for a greater good, but Billy and Teddy don't know that, so... But that only explains why he might feel he has to disguise himself as Kate, not why he'd need to met with them so urgently that he has to trick them to do it.

    Also, second the prom vote. Really don't think they'd marry them off panel.

  11. #506
    Extraordinary Member Fokken's Avatar
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    Babe > Buddy

    #JustMyPreference
    #SuperBabes
    #OtterBilly4Always
    #Demiotturge
    Last edited by Fokken; 05-21-2019 at 11:54 AM.

  12. #507
    Amazing Member Ibara's Avatar
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    Nick Robles and his take on goth Wiccan:

    http://twitter.com/ArtofNickRobles/s...21820155142144

    I'd love him on a regular book with the boys or even a mini!

  13. #508
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    Of course, it's brunch, to quote American Dad it's the most important gay meal of the day.

  14. #509
    Astonishing Member Drops Of Venus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fokken View Post


    Babe > Buddy

    #JustMyPreference
    #SuperBabes
    #OtterBilly4Always
    #Demiotturge
    I would've preferred if he called Billy babe or something more endearing like that as well. It's just weird for someone to refer to their fiance as ''buddy''.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ibara View Post
    Nick Robles and his take on goth Wiccan:

    http://twitter.com/ArtofNickRobles/s...21820155142144

    I'd love him on a regular book with the boys or even a mini!
    Ooh, me likey! Although this is not quite the look I'd want for Billy if he were to get a redesign right now. I'd like something more colorful, perhaps something highlighting blue as a part of the color scheme, since blue has always been his ''power color'', but he never wore it in the same way Wanda wears pink/red.

  15. #510
    Mighty Member Beetle's Avatar
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    Preview for WOTR: War Scrolls #2 is up and it is honestly pretty great





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