Loki Appreciation 2019

[Rosebunse]

he is mayor of New York right now so is trying to project an aura of having gone straight. (even though it is all an act) also, if it is Kingpin, that could bring him into Daredevil's sphere. He may be figuring he's paying back a favor for the sword.

Could be. I can still see Fisk wanting to run a few secret casinos. I'm trying to figure out who else it could be.

Also, I think I know why Loki said he's "fuzzy" when it comes to time: we know that Loki was sort of doing some "time-traveling" when he "died." So what if to survive, he made a deal with this woman he mentioned? Which essentially allowed him to go back in time again which is why his body isn't totally wrecked.

[Raye]

yeah there really aren't many characters i can think of who could both be in the 'underground casino' business, AND have a 'squeaky clean' reputation. (even if it's only pretend clean) Kingpin is really the only one that immediately comes to mind. Tony i mean technically he could, he's certainly got the money for something like that, but he's a tech guy, i just haven't really heard of him getting into the entertainment/casino type business, (unless it's tech based, like VR) especially of the underground variety. Kingpin could also offer some parallels to Loki as king, both in positions of power, one an actual ex-villain, the other just pretending to be.

When he came out of Laufey, he had chunks of flesh missing, you could see right to the bone on his thigh, and green magic all around the wounds, so he was still wrecked, just holding himself together with magic. I don't think he cut any deals in there, he just used magic to pull himself together. He saw the past and future but in a vision sense, not in an actually visited there sense, I think. Pretty sure we will find out who this 'she' is in issue 3 when he visits the House of Ideas and he gets the new power/curse.

[Rosebunse]

Yeah, I can sort of see Tony getting into owning a casino, just not a seedy underground one. I think Kingpin would be interesting because he could give us a good view into how Loki is viewed now. Do normal people know that he killed Laufey? What is Loki's current standing in the hero community?

I did look it up. The coloring for that scene was sort of weird, so I think I saw the bone more as a sheen from the blood. I am still he didn't pull some deal here, because Loki was in a pool of stomach acid for several weeks. Maybe he was using magic to hold himself together, but that is still a feat.

[Raye]

Well this casino didn't look seedy, but it was stated to be underground, so it is not licensed etc. I am guessing, and I don't think Tony would do that.

Balder knew what Loki did since he was the one who told Freyja about it so I am guessing others know as well, especially the ones who were directly fighting Laufey when it happened (so looking at the issue, Daredevil, especially since he threw Loki the sword, Iron Man, Black Panther, Spider-Man, Captain America, Sif, Thing. A lot of the big guns there.) but given Loki's past I am sure this one incident won't wipe the slate clean and they will still be suspicious of him, even if they know he saved the world from freezing over. They may just think it was just a side effect of him bringing himself back to life that the world was saved. But we saw in the issue of Thor that he wasn't exactly keen to come back, but I suspect (and I just with we had seen this) he knew what Laufey was doing, and knew he had to be stopped, and he was the only one who could do that.

And yeah, it would be a feat, that is kind of the point. This was his (literal) belly of the whale moment, the 'death and rebirth' part of the hero's journey. Again, very literal in his case, usually it's more symbolic. But I guess they really didn't want people to miss it. He even returned to the regular world with an elixir, the Casket of Ancient Winters. It's so on the nose, even if it was a very speedy run through the journey, (he answered the call when he saved Freyja) and parts happened off panel, that I can't see that this was accidental. But for it to really fit, he has to have overcome the ordeal that preceded the rebirth (mostly) by himself, or it loses it's impact. He had to dig deep and overcome great odds, and that ordeal forced him to find strength he didn't know he had until things looked their bleakest.

In its basic form it is exactly what I wanted, I just wish we had seen more of it, is all.

[Rosebunse]

You got me on that one, Raye. It just seemed way too perfect, though, but I guess I'm just so used to Loki having something up his sleeve that I just assume he's up to something.

Also, I was wrong about Knull being involved.

Really, I liked the ending of WotR, but we can all agree that it was rather rushed.

[Raye]

Though, if some mysterious someone helped him out there, then that wouldn't be something he had up his sleeve, it would just be a random circumstance that got him out of a bind. Also, in that case, it wouldn't be this mysterious 'she' that owed him a favour, it would be Loki that owed HER. I mean, what did he have to offer her while he was in there being digested, to the point that after she saved his life, she still owes him?

And it's not 'too perfect' it's just the way these stories go. (ok, a couple things are a bit convenient, like Laufey swallowing the sword for some odd reason, but not anything having some secret trick up his sleeve would change at all) If he is reborn as a hero, he needs a hero origin.

The main difference between Loki and Dr Strange and his accident and then finding the Ancient one, or Iron Man in the cave, or something like that, is that we hadn't spent years following Stephen or Tony being a total self serving douchebag only concerned with selfish pursuits, (more so than he is now ) but imagine if we had. Would we have doubts that the turn was genuine, maybe think that ordeal he went through and him coming out the other side a hero as him acting against character? Think he must have some plan to use this turn to his advantage for profit or whatever? Probably. But because that was the first thing we saw of him, as the introduction of a new hero, we accepted it at face value that he had learned a lesson and came out the other side of his ordeal a better person. But Loki, we have spent decades following his antics as a villain, and one known for deception in particular, and he's even pulled a similar stunt with a death and rebirth before, for self serving purposes. So yeah, there will be some lingering doubt there, and the suspicion he may reveal some selfish devious plot later. Especially with the fact that they hid part of what happened in there from us, there may be something more to it, and part of the reason they hid it may have been to sow some doubt in the minds of readers. But I'm choosing to take this at more or less face value here, given everything he had been through up until then.

[Prof. Aegis]

Oh they'll always be suspicious of Loki. They'll wait to see how he rules Jotunheim and what decisions he makes and his actions. But it would take ages for them to fully trust him. However, depending upon his actions in the coming series, the Asgardians may begin to see hope. Lol...Buuuut we'll have to wait and see.

I did like how Loki was pleasantly surprised by Drrf and by his desire to not want to fight but protect. So it'll be interesting to see what comes of their relationship. And how Loki states that the rule is by a shield and not a sword. Something different and an interesting mindset for him.

[Rosebunse]

It seems like his adoptive family is going to trust him.

The big thing I'm wondering about is if this changes if Nightmare kidnaps Thor and people think Loki was responsible.

[Prof. Aegis]

It seems like his adoptive family is going to trust him.

The big thing I'm wondering about is if this changes if Nightmare kidnaps Thor and people think Loki was responsible.

Good point on Nightmare. I guess it'll depend on who else Nightmare is affecting and the overall environment of the action.

Something I was wondering about, in the Omega issue, Loki talks about the Bifrost "only being broken at the moment" and that he left early, also that "Time is about to get a bit fuzzy" for him. What is this supposed to mean regarding time, time travel and what Loki will be up to? And that the Bifrost (?) owed him a favor? Was that whom he was referring to? Or someone else?

[Rosebunse]

Good point on Nightmare. I guess it'll depend on who else Nightmare is affecting and the overall environment of the action.

Something I was wondering about, in the Omega issue, Loki talks about the Bifrost "only being broken at the moment" and that he left early, also that "Time is about to get a bit fuzzy" for him. What is this supposed to mean regarding time, time travel and what Loki will be up to? And that the Bifrost (?) owed him a favor? Was that whom he was referring to? Or someone else?

I think it's probably got to do with him being out of time or something. And could the woman he was referring to be the Bifrost of some sort?

[Raye]

Well, we know Thor trusts him, or wants to, and presumably Freyja since she wants to see him so bad, and he's always got on allright with Angela. Not so sure on Odin and Balder, though. Balder acknowledged that Loki did kill Laufey and saved the planet in doing so, but like i said above, he may just attribute that to being a side effect of Loki resurrecting himself, rather than anything Loki tried to do. And Odin, we've got nothing to go on there for now, totally up in the air.

But yeah, people may think he's in league with Nightmare if he kidnaps Thor, even though from the interviews it sounds like Nightmare is targeting Loki specifically as delayed revenge for the Fear Crown being destroyed.

As for fuzzy time and the mystery 'she', I think that will be answered in issue 3, I am getting the feeling it has to do with this new power/curse he gets in the House of Ideas.

[Rosebunse]

Well, we know Thor trusts him, or wants to, and presumably Freyja since she wants to see him so bad, and he's always got on allright with Angela. Not so sure on Odin and Balder, though. Balder acknowledged that Loki did kill Laufey and saved the planet in doing so, but like i said above, he may just attribute that to being a side effect of Loki resurrecting himself, rather than anything Loki tried to do. And Odin, we've got nothing to go on there for now, totally up in the air.

But yeah, people may think he's in league with Nightmare if he kidnaps Thor, even though from the interviews it sounds like Nightmare is targeting Loki specifically as delayed revenge for the Fear Crown being destroyed.

As for fuzzy time and the mystery 'she', I think that will be answered in issue 3, I am getting the feeling it has to do with this new power/curse he gets in the House of Ideas.

Wednesday is gonna be fun! So much to look forward to!

Nightmare might not just be going after Loki for revenge. Loki changing alignments puts his cosmic position in contest and Nightmare may be thinking that he can take over if he plays his cards right.

[Raye]

Kibblesmith said in one of the interviews that though Nightmare chose now to attack because he figured Loki would be weakened due to the aftermath of WotR, it was because of getting revenge for JiM that he is attacking at all. He is apparently still bitter about having ultimate power snatched away, it seems.

I know we were talking roles earlier, but I don't think Loki's role is actually something anyone would choose to consciously take over, like Thor's. Loki's is more one you'd just accidentally fall into, since it kinda has 'get your ass repeatedly handed to you by Thor' baked into it, it's not like it comes with power or anything, it is just kind of the main baddie of the current Thor. I also just don't think those particular roles in the Asgardian pantheon are something anyone aside from a few is actually really aware of in-universe, aside from the fates themselves, and Loki and Thor.

[Karabaja]

On a semi-unrelated note, what's the deal with Asgardians (Loki included) and Idunn's apples now? Do they no longer need them to stay immortal or was that whole thing simply forgotten by the writers?

[Raye]

I don't know, last we saw of Idunn was when they broke up the triumvirate of her, Freyja and Gaea, and she went looking for a new place for Asgardia to hang out and then that was dropped, since obviously the real reason was that Aaron wanted Freyja as the sole mother-figure left at Asgardia. But even before that, the apples weren't really mentioned much for several years prior that i can recall.