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  1. #556
    Queen of Disaster Magik's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andru View Post
    Did DP actually die though? Guess I need to re-read...
    Same

  2. #557
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    Also that guy in Dead Souls

    And Sabertooth

  3. #558
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andru View Post
    A little bit of both. I was not a fan of how Sapna ended up "inside" Illyana's soul sword. A thread that has not been touched upon since.
    I wasn't really thrilled with that conclusion either, but everything leading up to that I rather liked.

    I'm not surprised she's not really been mentioned since, though. That's like.. the start of another arc, not the end of one, but yeah. Marvel/etc.

  4. #559
    spit and hades! Andru's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Woozie View Post
    Given they were cut in half... yes. Yes they were.
    Do Reavers count? I think they can be put back together?

    Quote Originally Posted by Woozie View Post
    Also that guy in Dead Souls

    And Sabertooth
    Ha, Sabretooth just happened and already it cleared my mind...guess he falls into the same category as Dark Beast as Rosenberg made some sketchy decisions for Illyana that he knew would not stick.

  5. #560
    Fantastic Member pandafarmer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anchorsify View Post
    Because it was part of EXM, or because you actually didn't like Sapna? Because I kind of liked Illyana taking up a parental/mentor role for a younger mutant, and how it tied into limbo.
    I wasn't a huge fan of that storyline either. We go from top tier revolutionary warrior in Bendis's run who has some snark and sass to the way they treated her in EXM where she's basically a momma duck who also just happens to be an all powerful mystical being on the side. I know she's got a soft spot for orphans, but I feel like they have a real problem finding writers who can make this middle ground between Snowflake and Darkchilde really work well.

    She absolutely can mentor others, but I felt like this was just a little too soft for her.

  6. #561
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    I dunno why you guys trying to make excuses. Since Bendis, Magik's sword cuts everything. That's not a Rosenberg thing that's just a general "Why even have this if all it's gonna work on is ghosts n shit"


    Sapna isn't actually magic, and that Sword murdered her real good
    Last edited by Woozie; 07-23-2019 at 09:29 AM.

  7. #562
    Ultimate Member Havok83's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Woozie View Post
    Also that guy in Dead Souls

    And Sabertooth
    that was os recent and I totally forgot about her decapitating him. That seems to be her go to move these days

  8. #563
    spit and hades! Andru's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Woozie View Post
    I dunno why you guys trying to make excuses. Since Bendis, Magik's sword cuts everything. That's not a Rosenberg thing that's just a general "Why even have this if all it's gonna work on is ghosts n shit"


    Sapna isn't actually magic, and that Sword murdered her real good
    Maybe I missed something, but who claimed it was a Rosenberg thing?

    Also, an image was just shared on the previous page from BOTA, written by Bendis, where Magik stabbed a future Molly Hayes...the same way she stabbed Natasha in AVX, which only rendered them unconscious.

    I guess it could be boiled down to Illyana's intent...If she wants to soul sword to kill, it will.

  9. #564
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andru View Post
    Maybe I missed something, but who claimed it was a Rosenberg thing?

    Also, an image was just shared on the previous page from BOTA, written by Bendis, where Magik stabbed a future Molly Hayes...the same way she stabbed Natasha in AVX, which only rendered them unconscious.

    I guess it could be boiled down to Illyana's intent...If she wants to soul sword to kill, it will.
    Boom. This is how I've always understood it.

  10. #565
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    Quote Originally Posted by pandafarmer View Post
    I feel like they have a real problem finding writers who can make this middle ground between Snowflake and Darkchilde really work well.
    I mean, that's been a huge problem for her, for sure. She's got kind of a crazy past and powers (teleportation, ruling limbo, sword that's a part of her soul, alternate demonic form, magical abilities with general unknown limitations), but she's never really given enough spotlight to show it all well.

    Quote Originally Posted by Woozie View Post
    I dunno why you guys trying to make excuses. Since Bendis, Magik's sword cuts everything. That's not a Rosenberg thing that's just a general "Why even have this if all it's gonna work on is ghosts n shit"


    Sapna isn't actually magic, and that Sword murdered her real good
    I don't think anyone was commenting on a writer in particular, but frankly, it's kind of silly how Illyana's sword has gone from small one-hander to Cloud/SOLDIER-style sword, able to cut anything and everything, when it was mostly a spiritual/magical/non-physical weapon before. It'd be nice to see more consistency, but, y'know. Marvel.

  11. #566
    Mighty Member mugiwara's Avatar
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    I wish they gave her clear limitations, especially considering Limbo.
    Otherwise every fight will have a "why doesn't she just teleport them into Limbo? moment"

    Maybe use the fact that she kinda absorbed Limbo at some point. Something like "whenever sombeody kills a demon or destroys a hill in Limbo, it hurts her, so she has to be careful about who she invites".
    Bringing back the old, killing the young: that's the Marvel way

  12. #567
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    Not every superhero has to like Batman with his no-killing rule. Especially in a time of war, which is what the X-Men have been in since the decimation pretty much.

    Magik straddles the line between hero and anti-hero. Sabertooth was an enemy in a literal war for the fate of the world. Decapitating him was no worse than all those aliens the Justice League - including Batman - killed in the pilot of the JL cartoon in 2001. 'Heat of battle' deaths are also not unheroic depending on your point of view, especially when the X-Men are treated like an actual army. And it's not like heroes killing is so uncommon in Marvel. Wolverine is the poster child, Cyclops killed Donald Pierce and others. And there are literal pages of people killed by Marvel heroes like Captain America, Cyclops, and others. https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Categ...aptain_America

    It just seems like the no-killing thing has become a DC thing rather than a Marvel thing, and not a good measure considering that the whole MCU would be anti-heroes if that were the standard. I do think that Magik was fully an anti-hero under Wells and especially Gillen, but I don't think writers have depicted her that way since Bendis.

  13. #568
    Fantastic Member pandafarmer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mugiwara View Post
    I wish they gave her clear limitations, especially considering Limbo.
    Otherwise every fight will have a "why doesn't she just teleport them into Limbo? moment"
    That's just it, during the early years, Limbo WAS the limitation. Anytime she used her powers she'd grow more and more "dark." It always had this sense of danger whenever she needed to do something powerful for the sake of the team. Post reserection there was even the whole "is she really her or not" for a while. Now it's like "Sure I'll teleport the whole mansion here and there, LOL... anyone want pancakes?"

  14. #569
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    Yeah, Magik has the Dr. Strange on a team issue.

    In that logically speaking, this shouldn't be an issue cause, "well hell do you see what they do?"

  15. #570
    spit and hades! Andru's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sunofdarkchild View Post
    Not every superhero has to like Batman with his no-killing rule. Especially in a time of war, which is what the X-Men have been in since the decimation pretty much.

    Magik straddles the line between hero and anti-hero. Sabertooth was an enemy in a literal war for the fate of the world. Decapitating him was no worse than all those aliens the Justice League - including Batman - killed in the pilot of the JL cartoon in 2001. 'Heat of battle' deaths are also not unheroic depending on your point of view, especially when the X-Men are treated like an actual army. And it's not like heroes killing is so uncommon in Marvel. Wolverine is the poster child, Cyclops killed Donald Pierce and others. And there are literal pages of people killed by Marvel heroes like Captain America, Cyclops, and others. https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Categ...aptain_America

    It just seems like the no-killing thing has become a DC thing rather than a Marvel thing, and not a good measure considering that the whole MCU would be anti-heroes if that were the standard. I do think that Magik was fully an anti-hero under Wells and especially Gillen, but I don't think writers have depicted her that way since Bendis.
    I have no issue with Illyana killing as long as it makes some sense. With Sabretooth, I agree with most of your assessment...however, Creed was already defeated. She could have easily just sent him to Limbo and been done with it. Instead she decapitated him first. I could probably be convinced that she did it because Creed has a healing factor and would have likely attacked once his throat was healed back up in a matter of seconds. But she most likely killed him because Rosenberg thought it would look cooler.

    And while I initially thought it made sense for her to kill Dark Beast when it happened, I think I changed my mind. She killed him because she was upset with him for tricking them into killing mutant children. We know Illyana has a soft spot for children, due to her own traumatic childhood, so her being upset makes sense. However, just killing him so nonchalantly....I don't know if that fits her "morals"?

    But again, it looks cooler.

    Agree 100% on the bolded!

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