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  1. #196
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    Quote Originally Posted by DragonsChi View Post
    Nah, you simply don't really know what your talking about and using broad strokes to cover. Anyone can be Hotheaded. That's not specific to any race. If you are going to talk in the context of media you or anyone else can not claim "Hotheadedness" to a specific race.



    Nah, your just having trouble following along, at the current juncture.

    1. Black Panther has years of publication where he hasn't killed and out right stated of trying to avoided it. Blade does not. This line of reasoning has been present in pretty much all of my post.

    2. Again following along. Once instance doesn't make the whole of a characters narrative and how they can be projected to wider audiences. If Blade garners enough stories where someone can definitively say "This character does not operate like this normally" they have better chances of being able to present to broader audiences.

    3. Again a sign that you are unsure of what you are talking about. Ever hear of something called "Tone"? A tone of a book is present and gives the readers a projection of how the story will go and the notes they may hit. For the most part Avengers Tone does not present itself as a story wear Blade would kill anything but monsters without repercussion. Could it happen? Sure. But the likelihood of it is slim. Just by the assembled characters it be foolish not to assume that no one will die in Savage Avengers, let alone a lot of people.
    And anyone can be angry, that isn't specific to race. But assigning particular attributes to certain types of characters consistently is what creates a trope. You're literally googling tropes on the tv tropes website and then referencing broad literature. It's disingenuous, especially when you're using different tropes to suit your argument, as you just did but substituting the "hot blooded" trope when you couldn't find the definition of hot head. It's because there's no distinction worthy of discussion (like you tried to argue there was).

    1. As it pertain to Black Panther, what writer are you referring to? He's killed humans from the 90s up until the Coates run in the late 10s. That's 20 years of his most popular runs where he's had no problem killing humans, and this period of time also coincided with his rise in popularity. Obviously him killing humans has had no impact on his popularity.

    2. It's not one instance, you've been given multiple instances of Blade having no problem killing humans. Blade has been around since the 70s. While he could use more appearances, there's been over hundreds of comics to demonstrate his core attributes even if they aren't expanded upon. The idea that he doesn't kill humans has never been referenced.

    3. You know what's more reflective of a books content than "tone"? The literal premise provided by the author. Moreover if your argument is about "tone" then the Savage Avengers still would be better than the main Avengers as only one of those books is explicitly about dealing with magical threats. The Avengers hasn't been a "non-lethal" team in years. We're a few years removed from an Avengers book in which they prevented incursions by killing global populations of people.

  2. #197
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Watkins View Post
    if i were to describe Dracula, "white guy" would be pretty low on the list. he's sort of transcended humanity. can you think of any other instance where Dracula used racial slurs (comics, movies, novels, etc)? because it seems like something that was introduced solely because he was interacting with Blade. that makes it forced, imo. reminds me of Freddy Krueger's "dark meat" comment in Freddy vs Jason. i could totally see Dracula dismissing Blade as a half-breed, though.
    In MI:13 he does, yea. Cornel paints Dracula as a bigot. Despite him despising all of humanity, his prejudice stems from writers picking up on his role as a monarch/tepes and the attitudes that would be held of other ethnic groups by someone who existed in the 1400s.

  3. #198

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    well anyways, the way to play it up would be to have Blade face a newly vampirized Baron Strucker (maybe a side effect of the his deathspore is that he's immune to sunlight) and the axis mundi-aligned vampire sect/necromanced footsoldiers. iirc, they were recruited primarily from neo nazi groups and were shown to target minority groups for feeding (gays, in this particular instance). what i liked about Baroness Blood's group was that they used a wide range of vampire powers; like volt-casting and turning into mist to avoid attacks.
    "I just don't get why you wouldn't want to break the law anymore" --Scorpia

  4. #199
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Watkins View Post
    well anyways, the way to play it up would be to have Blade face a newly vampirized Baron Strucker (maybe a side effect of the his deathspore is that he's immune to sunlight) and the axis mundi-aligned vampire sect/necromanced footsoldiers. iirc, they were recruited primarily from neo nazi groups and were shown to target minority groups for feeding (gays, in this particular instance). what i liked about Baroness Blood's group was that they used a wide range of vampire powers; like volt-casting and turning into mist to avoid attacks.
    That's a pretty interesting idea.

    Either way the story doesn't advance much in the most recent Avengers issue. We do get to see Dracula flex some of his abilities and a little more backstory on the Shadow Colonel and his team.

  5. #200
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    I'm starting to like the Shadow Colonel and hope that he sticks around after this arc to be a recurring thorn in Blade's side.

  6. #201
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tracks View Post
    And anyone can be angry, that isn't specific to race. But assigning particular attributes to certain types of characters consistently is what creates a trope. You're literally googling tropes on the tv tropes website and then referencing broad literature. It's disingenuous, especially when you're using different tropes to suit your argument, as you just did but substituting the "hot blooded" trope when you couldn't find the definition of hot head. It's because there's no distinction worthy of discussion (like you tried to argue there was).

    1. As it pertain to Black Panther, what writer are you referring to? He's killed humans from the 90s up until the Coates run in the late 10s. That's 20 years of his most popular runs where he's had no problem killing humans, and this period of time also coincided with his rise in popularity. Obviously him killing humans has had no impact on his popularity.

    2. It's not one instance, you've been given multiple instances of Blade having no problem killing humans. Blade has been around since the 70s. While he could use more appearances, there's been over hundreds of comics to demonstrate his core attributes even if they aren't expanded upon. The idea that he doesn't kill humans has never been referenced.

    3. You know what's more reflective of a books content than "tone"? The literal premise provided by the author. Moreover if your argument is about "tone" then the Savage Avengers still would be better than the main Avengers as only one of those books is explicitly about dealing with magical threats. The Avengers hasn't been a "non-lethal" team in years. We're a few years removed from an Avengers book in which they prevented incursions by killing global populations of people.
    Do you even understand what a stereotype is....? Real question.

    To make this post short " The Angry Black Man" is a specific reference to how BLACK MEN are viewed. You can have and "Angry Black Man" without them falling into a "Hot Head" Trope. There separate things. Not to say that a character can't be a "The Angry Black Man" and a "Hot Head" but one can live without the other which makes them separate. Blade for instance, has shown to be a "Hot Head" at times but he has never really fallen into "The Angry Black Man" due to him not being bias to whites or being against the "Man".

    I gave you the basic to bring it to terms everyone could understand. I'm not going to take the time to dig out references for someone who isn't going to take the time to do the research themselves. Especially, if they are arguing from a point they really don't know or understand the in-and-outs of. To add it's not my job to educate anyone on them either.

    1. Sporadic instances compounded with the stuff that came before doesn't add on to what the character is known for. Black Panther isn't known as a killer. That's not what he is seen as due to the combination of his work.

    2. I pretty much gone through all of Blades appearances just recently with the exception of one. The majority of his appearances consist of him killing monsters. His killing of humans is few and far in between. Enough so that I can take such a bold stance on this forum without faltering that he could have Mass Appeal.

    3. And now you are reaching....


    Ok, we aren't going to see eye to eye on this and your argument is degrading as we go on. I'm going shelve this and move on talking about the character. Post whatever else you feel like in response but I'm moving forward. Peace and love to ya .
    Last edited by DragonsChi; 02-20-2019 at 10:16 AM.

  7. #202
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    Quote Originally Posted by DragonsChi View Post
    Do you even understand what a stereotype is....? Real question.

    To make this post short " The Angry Black Man" is a specific reference to how BLACK MEN are viewed. You can have and "Angry Black Man" without them falling into a "Hot Head" Trope. There separate things. Not to say that a character can't be a "The Angry Black Man" and a "Hot Head" but one can live without the other which makes them separate. Blade for instance, has shown to be a "Hot Head" at times but he has never really fallen into "The Angry Black Man" due to him not being bias to whites or being against the "Man".

    I gave you the basic to bring it to terms everyone could understand. I'm not going to take the time to dig out references for someone who isn't going to take the time to do the research themselves. Especially, if they are arguing from a point they really don't know or understand the in-and-outs of. To add it's not my job to educate anyone on them either.

    1. Sporadic instances compounded with the stuff that came before doesn't add on to what the character is known for. Black Panther isn't known as a killer. That's not what he is seen as due to the combination of his work.

    2. I pretty much gone through all of Blades appearances just recently with the exception of one. The majority of his appearances consist of him killing monsters. His killing of humans is few and far in between. Enough so that I can take such a bold stance on this forum without faltering that he could have Mass Appeal.

    3. And now you are reaching....


    Ok, we aren't going to see eye to eye on this and your argument is degrading as we go on. I'm going shelve this and move on talking about the character. Post whatever else you feel like in response but I'm moving forward. Peace and love to ya .
    I've already identified the mistake you're making. You said there was a difference in the literature between the angry black man trope and the "hot head" trope. Then you failed to identify any evidence of a specific "hot head" trope. There is no specific "hot head" trope.

    Hot headedness is an idiom that reflects someone who is easily angered. The dictionary definition is literally "easily angered".

    https://www.dictionary.com/browse/hotheaded

    You attempted to distinguish without there being a real difference.

    Now.

    The point you keep maintaining is that Blade has no bias against White people. That isn't reflected by the literature. In his early Tomb of Dracula comics, while away from Quincy Harker's vampire slayers he identified a frustration with constantly working with white people, in the 90s midnight sons, he goes through a period where he is embodies an old white vampire hunter, and he is immediately angered that he's become white. There's an extant theory that Blade and Taj were created to reflect England's colonialism (in India and in Africa respectively), so Blade in his conception fit pretty squarely into the angry black man trope, and there are theories that it was intentional.

    Moreover, you keep alluding to references and refusing to provide them. So far all you've done is a basic google search for the *wrong* term and claim that as a reference. It's, again, disingenuous.

    1. We're not talking about sporadic instances. He regularly kills in his book. Because he isn't marketed as an assassin, doesn't mean the fact that he has no qualms with killing for the right reason is lost on writers or larger audiences. And, again, the idea that being a killer or "seen as a killer" would make a character less marketable isn't born out at all in the heroes that are successful. Prior to Black Panther, one of the most successful Black-centered action films was Django.

    2. If you're counting the various sorcerers and possessed people as humans, then it's not at all sporadic. When confronted with needing to kill humans, Blade has rarely, if ever, had pause. The absolute most was in his 2006 series where he had to kill a possessed human in order to kill a demon. Even then, later in that series, he has no issue slaughtering his fathers human body guards as he fights his way out of his facility.

    3. It's not reaching...it's accurate. Your logic just hasn't been all there.

  8. #203
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steroid View Post
    I'm starting to like the Shadow Colonel and hope that he sticks around after this arc to be a recurring thorn in Blade's side.
    Yea he's been pretty interesting so far. The use of "boy thing" to generate wooden spikes to slaughter vampires was definitely innovative.

  9. #204
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    AVENGERS #19
    JASON AARON (W) • ED MCGUINNESS (A/C)
    VARIANT COVER BY NICK BRADSHAW
    MARVEL BATTLE LINES VARIANT COVER BY MAXX LIM
    WAR OF THE REALMS TIE-IN!
    Avengers Mountain is under siege as the last stronghold of Earth’s heroes is the subject of an all-out assault by the forces of Malekith!
    40 PGS./Rated T+ …$7.99

  10. #205

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tracks View Post
    That's a pretty interesting idea.

    Either way the story doesn't advance much in the most recent Avengers issue. We do get to see Dracula flex some of his abilities and a little more backstory on the Shadow Colonel and his team.
    I was presently surprised to see that Baroness Blood was involved. I was worried that the Colonel's squad would be all generic vamps. kind of weird that he/she started talking about Crichton's motives with her present. he said it in a way that suggests that he's playing her.
    "I just don't get why you wouldn't want to break the law anymore" --Scorpia

  11. #206
    Invincible Member XPac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steroid View Post
    I'm starting to like the Shadow Colonel and hope that he sticks around after this arc to be a recurring thorn in Blade's side.
    He's proving himself to be a credible threat, which is cool. I was frankly worried that a vampire would be an Avenger level problem, but he's got a lot of tricks up his sleeve.

    It definately would be a huge waste if this guy isn't used elsewhere. I'm still wondering if he isn't someone we already know.

  12. #207

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    Quote Originally Posted by XPac View Post
    He's proving himself to be a credible threat, which is cool. I was frankly worried that a vampire would be an Avenger level problem, but he's got a lot of tricks up his sleeve.

    It definately would be a huge waste if this guy isn't used elsewhere. I'm still wondering if he isn't someone we already know.
    he is. but no one cared until he put on the mask. something something unintelligible...

    a little Bane humor
    "I just don't get why you wouldn't want to break the law anymore" --Scorpia

  13. #208
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    Quote Originally Posted by XPac View Post
    He's proving himself to be a credible threat, which is cool. I was frankly worried that a vampire would be an Avenger level problem, but he's got a lot of tricks up his sleeve.

    It definately would be a huge waste if this guy isn't used elsewhere. I'm still wondering if he isn't someone we already know.
    We'll probably see more of that next issue. Ghost Rider will probably take on Thor, but one of the vampires is going to have to handle Captain Marvel, which should be interesting

  14. #209
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    Preview is out, looks like Ghost Rider is handling everyone by himself so far. Also looks like this issue might pick up that plot line from Damnation.

  15. #210
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    I happened to be thinking about that security function Blade has in his sword in the film, and remembered thst in Damnation one of his weapons had an explosive charge inside it as well. I like the idea that Blade booby traps his weapons so that they can't be used against him. Makes sense for someone as pragmatic as he is.

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