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  1. #1
    Spectacular Member
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    Default Now, should the DCEU operate a partial/semi reboot of its continuity now?

    I'm curious to know your opinion.

    Batman is gonna be rebooted for sure. Reeves' "The Batman" is the new chapter.
    Joker has already been rebooted. Fact.
    Wonder Woman 1984 will apparently introduce some "retcons" to the backstory provided in BVS.

    So? I say:

    Do a semi-reboot.

    Discard from the continuity:

    1- Batman v Superman (even if I love it)
    2- Justice League (horrid and terrible)
    3- Suicide Squad (fun overall)

    ...and work on this new continuity:

    1- Man of Steel (2013)
    2- Wonder Woman (2017)
    3- Aquaman (2018)
    4- The Batman (2020?)
    5- Joker (2019)
    6- Shazam! (2019)
    7- Wonder Woman 1984 (2020)
    7- Birds of Prey (2020)

    They can do a brand-new, rebooted Justice League movie in the aftermath.

    What's your say?

  2. #2
    Fantastic Member MarkRodriguez09's Avatar
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    I kinda feel WB will do a pick and choose unless they get to a point where they'll have Batfleck face the new Joker and make like SSJoker never happened.
    Check out my blog for Comic Reviews and other things. Currently reviewing the Amazing Spider-Man 2018 series.
    https://markepicblogofrandomness.blo...i-finals.html/ Who will be in the Finals of the Mae Young Classic at Evolution??

  3. #3
    Fantastic Member OpaqueGiraffe17's Avatar
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    I think Aquaman contradicting Justice League when it come to Atlanna is an early sign that continuity won’t be a big priority. I now think Steve Trevor has a pretty good chance making it through WW84 alive. I don’t think they will toss shared canon out the window entirely. But I expect some retcons and contradictions. We know nothing about The Batman movie or Gunn’s SS, but even though they will likely be officially canon, I doubt maintaining consistency with panned movies like BvS and the first SS movie will be much of a priority.

  4. #4
    Astonishing Member Lightning Rider's Avatar
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    I just think it will be too messy to do.

  5. #5
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    I do agree with the thought that all the big solo movies moving forward will be fairly standalone and with only soft or tangential continuity connecting them.

  6. #6
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    I really think the DCEU would benefit from a Flashpoint movie. It'll be a great way to retcon the stuff they want to get rid of/change, it will be the Flash movie they've been wanting to do for a while, its a great story in and of itself AND it prominently features Aquaman and Wonder Woman, the two current 'stars' of the DCEU!

    As far as continuity goes, they can still keep the previous movies as a kind of 'vague backstory' for the new versions of the characters. They don't really need to reference them or follow on old plot threads, beyond the odd mention when relevant. That way they can still claim they haven't really done a hard reboot and continue to market those films as part of the universe without letting them have an impact. Kinda like what the MCU has done with The Incredible Hulk. They've recast Bruce Banner and tend not to explicitly reference that movies events or follow any of its plot-lines beyond vague stuff like 'the Hulk once went on a rampage in New York' and of course General Ross showing up later.

    So for instance, they can go with the idea that at one point, some heroes got together to fight Steppenwolf but it wasn't the official 'origin' of the Justice League or anything like that. Likewise, Superman and Batman know each other and have become trusted allies, and Superman died and came back to life. Also, Kryptonians once invaded the earth. There's no need to get more explicit than that in future movies. And any contradictions that come about could be explained by Flashpoint. Or by this rumored Supergirl movie which might involve time-travel if Kara is indeed going to be showing up in the 70's.

  7. #7
    Astonishing Member Lightning Rider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bat39 View Post
    I really think the DCEU would benefit from a Flashpoint movie. It'll be a great way to retcon the stuff they want to get rid of/change, it will be the Flash movie they've been wanting to do for a while, its a great story in and of itself AND it prominently features Aquaman and Wonder Woman, the two current 'stars' of the DCEU!

    As far as continuity goes, they can still keep the previous movies as a kind of 'vague backstory' for the new versions of the characters. They don't really need to reference them or follow on old plot threads, beyond the odd mention when relevant. That way they can still claim they haven't really done a hard reboot and continue to market those films as part of the universe without letting them have an impact. Kinda like what the MCU has done with The Incredible Hulk. They've recast Bruce Banner and tend not to explicitly reference that movies events or follow any of its plot-lines beyond vague stuff like 'the Hulk once went on a rampage in New York' and of course General Ross showing up later.

    So for instance, they can go with the idea that at one point, some heroes got together to fight Steppenwolf but it wasn't the official 'origin' of the Justice League or anything like that. Likewise, Superman and Batman know each other and have become trusted allies, and Superman died and came back to life. Also, Kryptonians once invaded the earth. There's no need to get more explicit than that in future movies. And any contradictions that come about could be explained by Flashpoint. Or by this rumored Supergirl movie which might involve time-travel if Kara is indeed going to be showing up in the 70's.
    Flashpoint wouldn't feel earned though. And casual moviegoers would be confused. Too much retconning gets in the way of actually telling an entertaining, meaningful story.

  8. #8
    Fantastic Member astro@work's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lightning Rider View Post
    Flashpoint wouldn't feel earned though. And casual moviegoers would be confused. Too much retconning gets in the way of actually telling an entertaining, meaningful story.
    Agree. The DCEU hasn't had enough of a run to already reboot.

    That said, unless they tell ANOTHER Superman death story, is there anything in the last decade of films requiring a reboot to go forward with a different actor?
    TPTB at DC Entertainment may be overthinking the need to rectify previous movies to a new one. If we get a new Bat film with a younger actor, how do we know it's not just an earlier version of Affleck's Batman? Similarly, a new Superman movie doesn't demand he say "You know, I used to be dead, but then I got better"...nor does it require him to say "Nope, I've never been dead before, nope not me". As long as the (very basic) tenets of the earlier films are upheld, no need to over-explain things. Just give us a good film.

  9. #9
    Astonishing Member kjn's Avatar
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    At a guess, the simplest solution is to simply ignore the old films, unless they want to bring things up or refer back to them. New Superman actor means MoS and BvS is out of continuity, new Batman actor means BvS is out of continuity. Wonder Woman 84 will likely refer back to the first Wonder Woman, so will be in continuity with that one. And so on.

    I.e. WB and DC will build up the new continuity through a web of references backwards, rather than by laying a wall with bricks from the down up.

  10. #10
    Extraordinary Member Zero Hunter's Avatar
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    They have said many times the Joker movie is not going to be its own thing totally seperate from all the other movies. They should keep it that way.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lightning Rider View Post
    Flashpoint wouldn't feel earned though. And casual moviegoers would be confused. Too much retconning gets in the way of actually telling an entertaining, meaningful story.
    I don't think it should be too much of a problem. 'The Flashpoint Paradox' worked well as a standalone, so I see no reason why a Flashpoint movie can't. There's some degree of familiarity with the characters and the universe already among wider audiences, and movies like Star Trek and X-men DOFP have done a good job acquainting people with the concept of time-travel and parallel universes. Hell after 'Avengers Endgame' people will probably be a LOT more acquainted with those concepts!

    The first half-hour or so could set-up the story by reintroducing Barry Allen, giving a quick recap of the pertinent parts of his origin (the accident which gave him his powers, his mother's murder and dad's wrongful imprisonment). Maybe throw in a mention of his having become famous helping a bunch of heroes stop an alien invasion. This part can introduce Iris West and Barry's budding romance with her. Maybe the Flash takes down the Central City Rogues in an opening action sequence. And Cyborg can show up early on in a cameo, along with Silas Stone at STAR Labs, who's helping Barry measure the true extent of his speed and theorizing that he might be capable of time travel. Barry visits his mom's grave on her anniversary, is haunted by memories of the night of her murder and vague visions of a man in yellow, and then starts running very fast.

    Cut to the Flashpoint timeline. Barry has no powers but his parents are alive and well. Aquaman and Wonder Woman are at war. Cyborg is the leading superhero. And we have Flashpoint Batman of course, whom Barry teams up with. Once Barry recreates the accident that gave him his powers, he encounters the mysterious man in yellow at various points in the movie who taunts him, and he knows that that man was responsible for his mother's death in the original timeline. So the movie has two major plots - one is the wider plot about Flashpoint and the efforts to stop the war between Amazons and Atlanteans from destroying the world, and the other is Barry learning about Eobard Thawne and remembering gradually that his own attempts to save his mother's life when he time-traveled is what shattered time.

    The movie ends with Barry fixing things of course. And we can have him visiting the Batcave to give Thomas' letter to Bruce, with Bruce this time being played by the new actor from the Matt Reeves' film.

    If the animated movie managed all this in less than 90 minutes, then I'm sure a 120-150 minute live-action film, if well-scripted can manage all that.

  12. #12

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    Nahhh just keep moving forward.

    I don't think the audience cares enough continuity minutae to warrant a reboot. Just put out good movies and people will move on.

  13. #13
    Savior of the Universe Flash Gordon's Avatar
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    Just make good flicks and move forward. That's really all it takes.

    Aquaman was absolutely wonderful. Wonder Woman was solid. Just keep going.
    Follow your inner moonlight, do not hide the madness. -Ginsberg

  14. #14
    Astonishing Member Lightning Rider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bat39 View Post
    I don't think it should be too much of a problem. 'The Flashpoint Paradox' worked well as a standalone, so I see no reason why a Flashpoint movie can't. There's some degree of familiarity with the characters and the universe already among wider audiences, and movies like Star Trek and X-men DOFP have done a good job acquainting people with the concept of time-travel and parallel universes. Hell after 'Avengers Endgame' people will probably be a LOT more acquainted with those concepts!

    The first half-hour or so could set-up the story by reintroducing Barry Allen, giving a quick recap of the pertinent parts of his origin (the accident which gave him his powers, his mother's murder and dad's wrongful imprisonment). Maybe throw in a mention of his having become famous helping a bunch of heroes stop an alien invasion. This part can introduce Iris West and Barry's budding romance with her. Maybe the Flash takes down the Central City Rogues in an opening action sequence. And Cyborg can show up early on in a cameo, along with Silas Stone at STAR Labs, who's helping Barry measure the true extent of his speed and theorizing that he might be capable of time travel. Barry visits his mom's grave on her anniversary, is haunted by memories of the night of her murder and vague visions of a man in yellow, and then starts running very fast.

    Cut to the Flashpoint timeline. Barry has no powers but his parents are alive and well. Aquaman and Wonder Woman are at war. Cyborg is the leading superhero. And we have Flashpoint Batman of course, whom Barry teams up with. Once Barry recreates the accident that gave him his powers, he encounters the mysterious man in yellow at various points in the movie who taunts him, and he knows that that man was responsible for his mother's death in the original timeline. So the movie has two major plots - one is the wider plot about Flashpoint and the efforts to stop the war between Amazons and Atlanteans from destroying the world, and the other is Barry learning about Eobard Thawne and remembering gradually that his own attempts to save his mother's life when he time-traveled is what shattered time.

    The movie ends with Barry fixing things of course. And we can have him visiting the Batcave to give Thomas' letter to Bruce, with Bruce this time being played by the new actor from the Matt Reeves' film.

    If the animated movie managed all this in less than 90 minutes, then I'm sure a 120-150 minute live-action film, if well-scripted can manage all that.
    The problem is that all these elseworld versions of the characters only have impact because we know the normal ones so well. It would be a mistake IMO to have a film revolving on versions of these characters that don't count in the actual universe.

    And lastly, why would a retcon explain a different actor's face? Diana and Aquaman aren't going to have different faces, so why would Batman? Is Barry going to point it out? And if he's not, why do we have to use a retcon-heavy story anyway? Is MOS and BVS going to be explained away? How did WW meet everyone then? Does WW not count? It just happened differently? So unnecessarily confusing.

  15. #15
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    My suggestion is to do what I think DC is already doing via the "Worlds of DC" branding.

    Keep separate continuities and then do cross over movies where the popular characters would used.

    This would allow them to have their cake and eat it too.

    And it would distinguish themselves from Marvel while embracing one of the tropes that DC already started.

    The next JLA movie could have the DCEU Aquaman and Wonder Woman team up with Matt Reeve's Batman, whoever the new Superman will be, and they could even throw in Phoenix's Joker for good measure.

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