Page 2 of 5 FirstFirst 12345 LastLast
Results 16 to 30 of 68
  1. #16
    Ultimate Member Lee Stone's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Louisiana
    Posts
    12,302

    Default

    I don't think I liked them as much.
    I didn't care for the loooooong storylines.
    And I had just made it through a 15-part 'Death of the JLI' in Breakdowns.
    "There's magic in the sound of analog audio." - CNET.

  2. #17
    BANNED
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Location
    Sesame Street
    Posts
    2,663

    Default

    Death of Superman is not only legendary for its story but also for the art and panel layouts.

    Each issue reduces the number of panels by one until the final issue where there are just full on splash pages of Superman and Doomsday duking it out. It really adds to the "countdown" feeling, knowing that Superman's death is drawing closer, and the reducing of panels just proving how epic in scale this thing really is. Something to pay attention to if you make comics or are interested in making comics


    Knightfall introduced the character of Bane and also morphed the Bat books into a long saga that lasted pretty much throughout the 90s and into the 2000s. Without Knightfall we may have never seen stories like Legacy and No Man's Land, and without Legacy there would be no Tower of Babel, etc. Knightfall was the springboard necessary for major character development in the Batman books and it also was what eventually brought Dick Grayson back as a main character in the Bat family. I can understand if people don't like it, I didn't care much for Bruce's storyline in KnightsQuest or the conclusion of the trilogy in KnightsEnd, but to deny how important it is as a story is to deny decades of incredible Batman stories!

    You could also argue that this was one of the first storylines to truly show Bruce Wayne as vulnerable and able to be defeated. Yes he's Batman, but even in the beginning of the story he's incredibly sick and weak and Bane is manipulating him to worsen his stress and mental/physical state.

    DC was smart to defeat two of their top characters because it led to better stories and better development of the mythology
    Last edited by Elmo; 01-17-2019 at 02:45 PM.

  3. #18
    The Fastest Post Alive! Buried Alien's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    7,538

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Elmo View Post
    Death of Superman is not only legendary for its story but also for the art and panel layouts.

    Each issue reduces the number of panels by one until the final issue where there are just full on splash pages of Superman and Doomsday duking it out. It really adds to the "countdown" feeling, knowing that Superman's death is drawing closer, and the reducing of panels just proving how epic in scale this thing really is. Something to pay attention to if you make comics or are interested in making comics
    It's probably the best Superman action sequence in comic book history.

    Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)
    Buried Alien - THE FASTEST POST ALIVE!

    First CBR Appearance (Historical): November, 1996

    First CBR Appearance (Modern): April, 2014

  4. #19
    Astonishing Member failo.legendkiller's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Rome, Italy
    Posts
    2,351

    Default

    I began to read comics regularly at that time.
    Perhaps for this reason they are for me the ultimate stories and the period.
    Actually Death of Superman becomes magnificent only by adding Reign of Supermen and Return of Superman.

    Knightfall and all that came later (Prodigal, Troika, Contagion, Cataclysm, No Man's Land) are exactly what I would like the Batverse to be.
    Chuck Dixon is my favorite writer, at the time he wrote a huge amount of books and kept the quality at the highest levels. Each book of the batverse was part of a larger design, excellent characterization of the characters.
    The ultimate example of how to give a strong shake-up building instead of destroying as Byrd said earlier.
    Last edited by failo.legendkiller; 01-18-2019 at 02:15 AM.

  5. #20
    Invincible Member numberthirty's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    24,858

    Default

    "Knightfall" a serialized event was pretty compelling right up until Bane showed up in the Batcave. Solid after that, but the run up to that point was a winner.

  6. #21
    Swiss army nerd
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Location
    Glasgow
    Posts
    523

    Default

    Loved DoS all the way through to Reign. Its basically a big defining part of my cultural childhood, I think. I remember being told by my brothers, "Superman is dead" and it blowing my tiny mind. (I was 7 or 8 I think). I read all the comics I could, then the junior novelisation, then the grown up novelisation (I was a nerdy kid, OK?)

    The only disappointing thing about Death of Superman is that it could have been even bigger - Jurgens said he went about the writers of GL, Batman, Flash, WW etc and asked if they wanted in on it, that he was killing Superman and it should cross over everywhere. They thought it was a gimmick and didn't want any part of it. Then it becomes the biggest comic book story since the discovery of the Rosetta stone.

  7. #22
    All about DC. DCStu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2016
    Location
    UK, just outside London.
    Posts
    233

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by greatmetropolitan View Post
    Then it becomes the biggest comic book story since the discovery of the Rosetta stone.
    I was watching something about that once. The guys at DC were being interviewed and said that it was just supposed to be an epic, long running story no different to any others they published. Just a day at the office for them.

    But weirdly - on the day it dropped - NOTHING ELSE HAPPENED IN THE NEWS!!! THERE WAS NOTHING TO REPORT!!! And THAT'S what made the comic such a sensation! Cause news outlets literally had NOTHING else to write about so it was like "Oh, look at this! Superman's died in the comics"!
    Collects
    80's 90's Post Crisis Era
    Eaglemoss DC Graphic Novels Collection
    New 52 (discontinued)
    DC Rebirth
    DC Black Label

  8. #23
    Astonishing Member dancj's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    3,568

    Default

    Superman

    Death of Superman (aka Doomsday)

    Terrible terrible story. It starts off with way too many panels per page bogging it down with Cadmus crap. The dropping a panel per issue idea was great, and should have made the pace speed up. Unfortunately you had to read Lois Lane's drivel at the same time, which completely broke the pacing. They should have handled that final issue the way Walt Simonson did the Orion vs Darkseid fight in his classic Orion series.

    World Without a Superman (aka Funeral for a Friend)

    I hated this too. Just tedious.

    The Return of Superman (aka The Reign of the Supermen)

    Absolutely insane and fantastic story. One of my favourite Superman stories.


    Batman

    Knightfall

    Decent story. Maybe a bit too episodic, but that probably helps when you've got rotating creative teams. Sadly the once good Jim Aparo delivered the worst (and possibly last?) art of his career on this one. The story is still well worth reading. Especially the second TPB.

    Knightquest: The Crusade

    If I had thought for a moment it was going to last I might have been angry, but I knew it wasn't, so I sat back and enjoyed the ride. I liked this a lot at the time. I haven't read recently enough to know if it holds up.

    Knightquest: The Search

    Awful. From Bruce's corny disguise to the search for a deus ex machina plot device, nothing about this works.

    Knightsend

    For the most part, this was pretty weak, but the final issue was good. I liked how Bruce didn't win by beating JP in a fight. The way they resolved it was much more emotional and sympathetic to JP.

  9. #24
    Astonishing Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2017
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    2,924

    Default

    The The Death Of Supermanis, out of the two, the better structured story. The actual fight with Doomsday is just a slugfest notable only because of Superman's then perceived "Death." The real narrative weight comes with Funeral For A Friend when it examines just how much Superman means to the world via the supporting casts grief and mourning. By extension it makes a case for why he is needed.

    Reign then goes further as each replacement character is a reflection of different aspects of Superman's personality. It also makes a strong statement that Superman's shoes are far too big for any single character to ever fill. The whole event may have started life as a placeholder for the intended nuptials between Lois and Clark, but what seemed like an event to shock the audience ended up becoming a great character study into one of fiction's greatest icons. That even the big, blue boyscout had a place in the world.

    Knightfall isn't a bad storyline per se. I just feel it doesn't have the same calibre of storytelling that Death/Funeral/Reign had. The whole purpose of the story was to counter the perceived argument that the exploits of popular anti-heroes at the time (Punisher, Wolverine, all of Liefeld's creations) made them better heroes due to their zero tolerance policy. But I feel the event was more a dig at the current state of comics at the time than a grandiose character study (JPV Batman's entire visual is practically mocking Liefeld with unnecessary armor, blades/sharp edges and exaggerated musculature complete with tiny feet to boot!)

    Personally, I enjoy both. Especially when read with a mind on what each is trying to achieve. The Superman line hit its peak with its respective storyline (with the entire line steadily declining afterwards.) The Batman line, on the other hand, would continually go from strength to strength. Both were much better than the other redefining "epics" that followed in their wake such as Emerald Twilight, Fall Of A Amazon, "Where Angels Fear To Tread" and "Terminal Velocity."

  10. #25
    (Formerly ilash) Ilan Preskovsky's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    2,102

    Default

    On a story level, the Death of Superman is pretty underwhelming when read now but I loved it back when it first came out as I had just started reading comics religiously a short time before then. Some really nice art, regardless. Funeral for a Friend and Reign of the Supermen, on the other hand, are still plain awesome. Very much of their time but, aside for some less than stellar dialogue, everything from after Byrne's run through the end of Reign of the Supermen ranks as some of the best Superman comics ever.
    Check out my blog, Because Everyone Else Has One, for my regularly updated movie reviews.

  11. #26
    Astonishing Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2017
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    2,924

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Ilan Preskovsky View Post
    On a story level, the Death of Superman is pretty underwhelming when read now but I loved it back when it first came out as I had just started reading comics religiously a short time before then. Some really nice art, regardless. Funeral for a Friend and Reign of the Supermen, on the other hand, are still plain awesome. Very much of their time but, aside for some less than stellar dialogue, everything from after Byrne's run through the end of Reign of the Supermen ranks as some of the best Superman comics ever.
    Agreed. Actually I'd go a little bit further and include everything up to The Fall Of Metropolis. Purely because it acts as the perfect coda to that era by resolving several long running plot threads that had been running in the books at the time. Some of them had been gestating for years by that point.

    For me, the rot started creeping in a year or so prior to the Electric Superman saga. Although I do have a particular soft spot for Conduit Saga, Death Of Clark Kent and The Trial Of Superman.

  12. #27
    The Fastest Post Alive! Buried Alien's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    7,538

    Default

    DEATH OF SUPERMAN had far-reaching implications beyond the SUPERMAN franchise, as it also led into developments in the GREEN LANTERN franchise that resulted in EMERALD TWILIGHT, ZERO HOUR, the creation of Kyle Rayner, and Hal Jordan's decade-long lost weekend.

    Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)
    Buried Alien - THE FASTEST POST ALIVE!

    First CBR Appearance (Historical): November, 1996

    First CBR Appearance (Modern): April, 2014

  13. #28
    Mighty Member tib2d2's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    1,356

    Default

    Death of Superman is my preference. And I think its mainly because the characters involved are much more interesting. Bane and JPV, meh. But Cyborg Superman, Steel, Superboy, Eradicator, AWESOME.

  14. #29
    Incredible Member Adset's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    935

    Default

    Death/Funeral/Reign is better, IMO. It's been quite awhile since I've read either, but I'm not sure Knightfall could even happen now. I may be off base here working w/ a spotty memory, but I recall Nightwing's participation in the event was rather small -- w/ Bruce out of commission, the Bat-family was basically reduced to Tim Drake, who was still pretty new at the time. Nowadays, the Bat-family is so large they'd be able to shut JVP down rather quickly.

  15. #30
    Mighty Member SixSpeedSamurai's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2017
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    1,526

    Default

    Having read both as they came out, Knightfall was a bit more methodical and planned out. Death of Superman was a lot shorter, but still good. The actual fight though was not that great. Here you have the two guys capable of leveling planets throwing punches standing in the street. I though the recent Death of Superman animated movie set in the New 52 was actually a better presentation of the actual battle of Superman and Doomsday. Reign of the Superman was better than KnightQuest/End in my opinion though. I felt the ending of KnightsEnd was very anticlimatic. However, one part of the story that I feel is still one of the most epic Batman moments to this day is the end of Robin #8. Where all the looneys in Arkham start going nuts when Bruce buts the costume back on. Just a great moment.
    Pulls: Batman, Detective Comics, SiKtC, Catwoman, Nightwing, Titans, Godzilla, Wonder Woman, Batman & Robin, Brave and the Bold, No/One, Kill your Darlings, and Deviant.
    My runs: Batman #230-, and Detective #420-

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •