T'Challa vs Lady Shiva

[Pendaran]

Like you can say Batman did better in the rematch a few issues later? But.... honestly didn't really do all that better in the rematch a few issues later, as she was fighting him and Cassandra at the same time (and several other members of the Bat family, though Azrael and Batwing and Batwoman were at least wounded and explicitly suffering from blood loss before the fight started, and only helped initially), and at one point Cassandra straight up blocked a sword strike from Shiva that would have otherwise shanked/killed him, and she pretty clearly did the heavy lifting in that fight of the two of them. He at least managed to block a couple shots this time and also hit her when her back was turned and her daughter had her attention in a conversation.

But hey, he managed to block her twice! Annd was still going to die at one point. And other people were fighting her. So.. yeah. It didn't really salvage much.

So it really comes down to what all else Shiva has managed to do since that whole mini arc. Which is to say, does anyone know of any showings from her since that whole mini arc? Yes yes, she theoretically died at the end. I doubt it stuck.

Though if she actually has stayed dead since then, ugh. (And I mean there's that she died to Ra's Al Ghul shooting her from behind? Buuut that only happened after Cassandra kicked the crap out of her).

[Pendaran]

I suppose on pondering the whole, if Shiva has stayed dead and done nothing since then problem, another way to look at it would be, what has Cassandra Cain done since that arc? I mean the whole basic notion of that plot arc was "Shiva and Cassandra am bestest fighters, the others are not even close." Has she lived up to that? Has she instead super decayed from that?

[Beadle]

Well again, what did she do after that?

Sorry, you posted your previous request while I was (slow-ass-ly) posting my own comment.

I agree - what has she done since? If there’s a brave new world of Shiva badassery, fine. The baseline moves. If not...?

I can’t actually answer the question myself, due to not reading Rebirth DC.

[Beadle]

I suppose on pondering the whole, if Shiva has stayed dead and done nothing since then problem, another way to look at it would be, what has Cassandra Cain done since that arc? I mean the whole basic notion of that plot arc was "Shiva and Cassandra am bestest fighters, the others are not even close." Has she lived up to that? Has she instead super decayed from that?

Good point. Though that does kinda feel a bit like ‘feats by proxy and tenuous extrapolation’. But if that’s the best we’ve got...

[Sharpandpointies]

Though if she actually has stayed dead since then, ugh. (And I mean there's that she died to Ra's Al Ghul shooting her from behind? Buuut that only happened after Cassandra kicked the crap out of her).

Apparently Ra's ran off with the body. So, Lazarus Pit ahoy? But nothing has happened on that front to the best of my knowledge (granted, I'm not actually reading the Nu DC stuff).

I suppose on pondering the whole, if Shiva has stayed dead and done nothing since then problem, another way to look at it would be, what has Cassandra Cain done since that arc? I mean the whole basic notion of that plot arc was "Shiva and Cassandra am bestest fighters, the others are not even close." Has she lived up to that? Has she instead super decayed from that?

Not a clue. Really, that was the arc where she actually got props, rather than being touted as 'world's best fighter!' with little to actually show for it.

[Froggy]

I mean.. if all her previous showings are supposed to now be retconned away..

Let's look at it like this. Anyone know what she's done since then?

she tossed Cassandra Cain in the sewers after beating on her, then basically made Bruce whiff on all his punches and dip out to take care of a bomb/leave shiva to cass

[Froggy]

I suppose on pondering the whole, if Shiva has stayed dead and done nothing since then problem, another way to look at it would be, what has Cassandra Cain done since that arc? I mean the whole basic notion of that plot arc was "Shiva and Cassandra am bestest fighters, the others are not even close." Has she lived up to that? Has she instead super decayed from that?

Cassandra hasn’t really decayed barring a weird wtf scene in RHATO

[Sharpandpointies]

Cassandra hasn’t really decayed barring a weird wtf scene in RHATO

This requires explanation, Froggy. ^_^

[Froggy]

Artemis managed to knock her back due to knowing Amazonian martial arts and gained enough of an advantage to keep cass off of her. Other than that, Cass had the finishing blow and most of the action against Azrael when he was in like super mode in detective comics, and pieces up some rebirth style OMAS

This requires explanation, Froggy. ^_^

[FistofIron]

Artemis managed to knock her back due to knowing Amazonian martial arts and gained enough of an advantage to keep cass off of her. Other than that, Cass had the finishing blow and most of the action against Azrael when he was in like super mode in detective comics, and pieces up some rebirth style OMAS

What are her stats like these days?

[Froggy]

Artemis or cass?

Artemis strong but not Wonder Woman ballpark, stills tring enough to deck Grundy but her axe is hella powerful. Cassie still by far the best fighter in the bat family and close to her old self minus the developments she had in her own series

What are her stats like these days?

[Sharpandpointies]

Artemis managed to knock her back due to knowing Amazonian martial arts and gained enough of an advantage to keep cass off of her. Other than that, Cass had the finishing blow and most of the action against Azrael when he was in like super mode in detective comics, and pieces up some rebirth style OMAS

"My martial arts are different, so despite efficient body movement being efficient body movement, I will surprise you!"

*sighs* Because that's how fighting works.

[Guy1]

"My martial arts are different, so despite efficient body movement being efficient body movement, I will surprise you!"

*sighs* Because that's how fighting works.

Did the comics even have her doing any special like wuxia or something or just the same punching and kicking you always see in comics? Maybe some drunken boxing?

[Sharpandpointies]

Did the comics even have her doing any special like wuxia or something or just the same punching and kicking you always see in comics? Maybe some drunken boxing?

No idea - I don't have the comics, myself.

Not that drunken boxing or whatever would be something that should throw off the body-reading (then again, it's not on par with how it used to be), but still, at least that would be...*squints*...something they could use as a point, I guess. ^_^

[Guy1]

No idea - I don't have the comics, myself.

Not that drunken boxing or whatever would be something that should throw off the body-reading (then again, it's not on par with how it used to be), but still, at least that would be...*squints*...something they could use as a point, I guess. ^_^