The Master of Kung Fu - Shang Chi Appreciation 2019

[Bolo]

Pretty fascinating article about Simu Liu featured over at SCMP.com:
https://www.scmp.com/magazines/post-...ls-first-asian

Covers the basics of what we've known about Simu for a while now. His background from China, his desire to have better Asian representation in Western media, and his charisma. A little concerned that before the movie he had zero martial arts experience, but he's working with Brad Allan, who was part of Jackie Chan's stunt team (had some of the best fights in "Gorgeous." Seriously, check it out).

Simu describes how he feels about the movie:



Simu is gutsy, which, well, for Asians is necessary. Keeping your head down and not questioning the system, that's worked to a degree. But now it's time to move forward. I get that. But will Shang-Chi change the world? Woah, Simu, let's not jinx the movie just yet. The potential is there, but baby steps bro, one step at a time.

I will be very honest, the fact he have zero martial arts ability, except some gymnastic and stunt stuff, have killed the movie for me, that funny because Mike Leeder, a guy who worked in some HK movies have called him a great fighter in his facebook, well that clearly not true.

Why, with all the money Disney have, they have chosen him ? He is not a famous actor, according asian peoples he is not good looking, and he don't have any kungfu background, I mean lot of martial artists would have killed to have this role...I honestly think with all their ressources they could have found the new Donnie Yen, not just a funny guy who have a disdain for the comics or kungfu stars in general.

In comparaison see Mortal Kombat, near every actors are martial artists, they should have chosen Lewis Tan...Simu seem to care more about representation than the movie itself

[Ascended]

Who cares if Simu has a martial arts background? That's what pre-production training is for, not to mention stunt teams.

If he's got a background in gymnastics that's a solid enough foundation for fight choreography to work with. He doesn't have to be a fighter, he just has to learn how to execute the specifics moves the movie requires. And the really tricky stuff would be done by stunt crews anyway, for fear of the lead actor getting hurt.

Give me a quality actor who can sell the role over a martial artist with no acting experience. People can learn to punch far faster and easier than they can learn to act. I mean, they hired a martial artist for the Star Wars prequels, and look how well that turned out.

[Tien Long]

Who cares if Simu has a martial arts background? That's what pre-production training is for, not to mention stunt teams.

If he's got a background in gymnastics that's a solid enough foundation for fight choreography to work with. He doesn't have to be a fighter, he just has to learn how to execute the specifics moves the movie requires. And the really tricky stuff would be done by stunt crews anyway, for fear of the lead actor getting hurt.

Give me a quality actor who can sell the role over a martial artist with no acting experience. People can learn to punch far faster and easier than they can learn to act. I mean, they hired a martial artist for the Star Wars prequels, and look how well that turned out.

I lean towards this. I'd hope that there would be an actor who brings that martial arts ability to the Shang-Chi role. However, as has been said, a few months of training and a good stunt team can make up for it (I still hope there is authenticity in the tecniques. I'd love to point out to some scenes and see the Chang Quan or Wing Chun). I was totally for Ludi Lin playing the role (though I look forward to his rendition of Liu Kang).

Furthermore, the acting ability and presence will attract more of an audience to this. From the vibe I'm getting from leaked things here and there, I think Simu's personal experiences, especially with familial expectations, will help bring the authenticity to the father/son dynamic found with Shang-Chi.

[Hypestyle]

... I suppose hardcore 'realistic fight scenes only' folks (who swear by every current Asian action cinema release that most Americans don't get to see) may be up in arms, including in "some" of the international territories. Unless the choreography is just "awful" I don't think it will be a big deal in the aggregate.

[Bolo]

I think there are a big difference between this movie and the others, Shang Chi is a pure kungfu comics directly inspired by Bruce Lee, to be close to him, you need know very well how to fight because that what the public wait and not just a guy with some training for the movie, you cant make the illusion work like that, today most asians movie suck because they have tried to do that without martial artists.

I mean do you think you can do a good musical movies without good singers and dancers ?

Now I hope that just a mistake from the articles, other peoples who know him have said he have background in martial arts, he have himself tagged "wushu" in one of his training video, maybe he is just not a pure martial artist or a fighter, the article dont have a direct quote from him, but if that not the case, he will lack punch or energy if they do a long fight, in the same month there will be Mortal Kombat, with real martial artists, that will be a bloodbath for Marvel.

Sorry if I sound like an hater, the MCU have done very good fight sequences, imo the best for modern movies, but Shang Chi should be way more for actions, and for me that sound too chaotic, that remind Marvel tv with Iron Fist.

[Michael Watkins]

you'd better hope that the choreography is on point. it's called Master of Kung Fu. this will make or break the movie.

[chamber-music]

Who cares if Simu has a martial arts background? That's what pre-production training is for, not to mention stunt teams.

If he's got a background in gymnastics that's a solid enough foundation for fight choreography to work with. He doesn't have to be a fighter, he just has to learn how to execute the specifics moves the movie requires. And the really tricky stuff would be done by stunt crews anyway, for fear of the lead actor getting hurt.

Give me a quality actor who can sell the role over a martial artist with no acting experience. People can learn to punch far faster and easier than they can learn to act. I mean, they hired a martial artist for the Star Wars prequels, and look how well that turned out.

Agreed.

Brad Allan has made a career in Hollywood choreographing action/stunt scenes with actors.

Hellboy Kick Ass, Scott Pilgrim Vs The World, The World's End and the Kingsman movies.

If you can make me believe guys like Colin Firth and Nick Frost can kick ass then I'm sure they can make it look like Simu can.

We won't have another Iron Fist situation in which the production is rushed and they teach the actors the fight choreography an hour before they film it.

I do think being able to portray a skilled martial artist is very important though as it is the characters primary ability.

[616MarvelYear is LeapYear]

Deadly Hands of Kung Fu #7 Dec 1974
"The Past-Assassins!"
Shang-Chi is stalked through the streets by hired gunmen


while a menace from his past becomes deadlier...in the present!

Story by Doug Moench. Art by Mike Vosburg and Al Milgrom.

[616MarvelYear is LeapYear]

Master of Kung Fu #23 Dec 1974
"River of Death!"
The former British Foreign Service agent Black Jack Tarr is back and he wants Shang Chi's help.

The two uneasy partners must travel to South America to stop Chi's sinister father, Fu Manchu,


from forming an alliance with a Nazi war criminal.

Script by Gerry Conway, pencils by Al Milgrom, inks by Klaus Janson.

[Tien Long]

Hey all. Just some random Shang-Chi thoughts and news for the day:

- I've been on a huge martial arts movie kick over the past week or so. Been watching a lot of the Indonesian films starring Iko Uwais and Joe Taslim. One, that's some pretty gory and violent $%^&! Two, I think Shang would be fine in a world like that. What I mean is that people think that Shang is this calm and collected person. He probably is, but this is the master of Kung Fu. And Kung Fu can be nasty, violent stuff. Shang would have no problem ripping out eyes, snapping necks, and disembowling people with his bare hands. He doesn't choose to, but I guarantee you he's used to it. That's why I'd like to see a comic with featuring some of the most f'd up, psychopathic assassins, fighters, and tough guys in the Marvel Universe like Bullseye, Crossbones, or Mr. X. Because he'd wade through their violence and beat them all. 'Nuff said.

- Shang has had some impressive showings as of late in the Agents of Atlas comics. He's been at odds with Jimmy, who's both a good friend and deceptive strategist. I like that, especially since it plays with Shang's abhorrence to games of death and deceit. Really hoping that we see more of this in the upcoming Atlantis Attacks series.

- So I read this leaked rumor from reddit:

An alien spaceship landed in China hundreds of years ago. The ship was powered by the Ten Rings, magical relics that all serve a different purpose. The rings were looted by a secret society known as the Avatars, which is led by a wise martial artist simply called the Ancestor. The Ancestor wore the rings and used them to become an expert fighter.

The Mandarin grew up hearing about the ancestor’s story and was fascinated by it, despite everyone else believing it was just a myth. He began to idolize the Ancestor, and devoted his life to finding the rings. This inspired him to form his own mafia, which is the Ten Rings gang. Basically, the point of the gang is look for the rings all around the world. He adopted his niece, Fah Lo Suee (Awkwafina) and taught her martial arts.

After years of investigation, he discovers that the legend of the ten rings are real, and that the Ancestor is dying. There was a leak a little while back that Shang-Chi is a tournament film, and that’s actually true. When the Ancestor dies, the Avatars will run a secret tournament/kung-fu trial in which the winner will be granted the rings. The Mandarin is too old to compete, and he doesn’t want to risk Fah Lo Suee’s life. That’s where Shang-Chi is going to come in.

Shang is a street urchin who meets the Mandarin after he starts dating Fah. The Mandarin takes a liking in Shang and starts training him as his apprentice. His first task, as an act of gang initiation, is to kill Trevor for impersonating the Mandarin. People speculated that they would be related, but it will be more of a Walter White/Jesse Pinkman dynamic.

When the tournament begins, the Mandarin will send Shang to win and get the rings for him. That’ll be the basic gist of the film pretty much. I know that defeating Fin Fang Foom will be an obstacle. Leiko Wu and Clive Reston will be in the movie as SHIELD agents who are investigating the Ten Rings gang. Shang-Chi will obviously betray the Mandarin and become a hero over the course of the film. He will get the ability to create multiple duplicates of himself. It will be an ‘Orphan Black’ situation, where each clone of himself has their own personality. So the fights will obviously be insane to witness.

Marvel is casting Shang’s enemies in the tournament, and one of them will be a character named Chao.

Ugh, I really hope that this leak is nothing but just rumor and innuendo. I dig a tournament arc and the rings part. But duplication powers? And Shang NOT being the biological son of the Mandarin? Please let this false!

[MacrossPlus]

we can only hope

[MichaelC]

Hey all. Just some random Shang-Chi thoughts and news for the day:

- I've been on a huge martial arts movie kick over the past week or so. Been watching a lot of the Indonesian films starring Iko Uwais and Joe Taslim. One, that's some pretty gory and violent $%^&! Two, I think Shang would be fine in a world like that. What I mean is that people think that Shang is this calm and collected person. He probably is, but this is the master of Kung Fu. And Kung Fu can be nasty, violent stuff. Shang would have no problem ripping out eyes, snapping necks, and disembowling people with his bare hands. He doesn't choose to, but I guarantee you he's used to it. That's why I'd like to see a comic with featuring some of the most f'd up, psychopathic assassins, fighters, and tough guys in the Marvel Universe like Bullseye, Crossbones, or Mr. X. Because he'd wade through their violence and beat them all. 'Nuff said.

- Shang has had some impressive showings as of late in the Agents of Atlas comics. He's been at odds with Jimmy, who's both a good friend and deceptive strategist. I like that, especially since it plays with Shang's abhorrence to games of death and deceit. Really hoping that we see more of this in the upcoming Atlantis Attacks series.

- So I read this leaked rumor from reddit:



Ugh, I really hope that this leak is nothing but just rumor and innuendo. I dig a tournament arc and the rings part. But duplication powers? And Shang NOT being the biological son of the Mandarin? Please let this false!

I hope it's wrong for different reasons. One is that it makes Mandarin far, far more of a Fu Manchu type than the comics. One of the major differences between Mandarin and Fu Manchu is that Fu Manchu is an effete, emasculated figure. Whereas the Mandarin is a powerful athlete and martial artist. The Mandarin and Fu Manchu are polar opposites in terms of masculinity.

If this rumor is true, then Mandarin has been emasculated into exactly the kind of emasculated figure as Fu Manchu. Someone too old and shriveled to fight, and who needs to manipulate someone else into doing it for him. That would nauseate me.

[Bolo]

I really like this leak, that sound like a very good mix between martial arts movies and the comics, for the duplicate powers, I don't like that in the comics but in movie that could work, I guess that could be from one of the ring power and not directly from him; now for the relation father/son, well the change seem more because the negative impact for China, apparently it was one of the big problem the "biological treason".

@Michael, I think the Mandarin "brute" have been already well done in Iron Man 3, they probably want to make him différent, more close to Tony Leung, someone charming, the leak is not complete, but I think they will show his fighting abilities, there are also lot of changes during the shooting for the script.

[Tien Long]

I hope it's wrong for different reasons. One is that it makes Mandarin far, far more of a Fu Manchu type than the comics. One of the major differences between Mandarin and Fu Manchu is that Fu Manchu is an effete, emasculated figure. Whereas the Mandarin is a powerful athlete and martial artist. The Mandarin and Fu Manchu are polar opposites in terms of masculinity.

If this rumor is true, then Mandarin has been emasculated into exactly the kind of emasculated figure as Fu Manchu. Someone too old and shriveled to fight, and who needs to manipulate someone else into doing it for him. That would nauseate me.

As always, you bring interesting insight into the character of the Mandarin. Indeed, I wasn't too aware of his martial prowess until this and other posts. If the Mandarin is depicted as a straight up, hand to hand warrior, I'm fine with that. If the movie (or any new comic for that matter) features the Mandarin as being Shang's father who's effete and scheming, I'd accept that. If Shang's father becomes a combination of schemer plus warrior, I'm cool with that as well.

[Tien Long]

I really like this leak, that sound like a very good mix between martial arts movies and the comics, for the duplicate powers, I don't like that in the comics but in movie that could work, I guess that could be from one of the ring power and not directly from him; now for the relation father/son, well the change seem more because the negative impact for China, apparently it was one of the big problem the "biological treason".

And that's the issue I hoped (and still hope) would have Marvel's support. The father/son dynamic based off of real relations and blood, that to me has been the intriguing characteristic of Shang-Chi. It's what makes him unique amongst other comic heroes and puts him above being just another "Asian martial arts guy." Yeah, I know about the qualms Chinese audiences have with a father going against a son, but it's my sincere hope that Chinese audiences would see the story potential in that.

In any case, whatever happens with Shang, I'm sure to accept it. If they go or not go with the father/son dynamic, I'll watch and support the movie regardless.