Jean Grey/Marvel Girl/The Phoenix Appreciation

[ariwl1]

My memory is foggy, but how long i remember the ones that learned that were magik, teen iceman and teen beast.

We still dont know what jeen saw inside xorn's head, maybe she saw why she started to call herself xorn and started to wear that outfit.

Magik and the boys saw the future JGS (or was it called Xavier's again?), but the future X-Men didn't tell them a thing. The said it was too dangerous for them to know about the future. So what Jean saw in her future self's mind is pretty much all they have to go on.

[cwatz]

Some debate the merits of Morrison's additions to the Phoenix mythos, but I thought this was an interesting facet of the Phoenix. It hasn't been touched much on it since then. One thing it did do though was plant the idea that Quentin Quire could be a future Phoenix host and we're starting to see that play out in WatX now, for better or for worse...

Teasing QQ phoenix is one of the most repulsive things going on in comics at the moment.

I did like Jean going godmode at the end (though its not even close to making up for the planet x hackjob). Thats how I nurse the wound of her absence. Pretend shes sitting around saving the universe all day.

[Hariel0079]

Magik and the boys saw the future JGS (or was it called Xavier's again?), but the future X-Men didn't tell them a thing. The said it was too dangerous for them to know about the future. So what Jean saw in her future self's mind is pretty much all they have to go on.

It was still the JGS, apparently the NXS were the brotherhood since jubilee/nuwolverine stated that they didn't associated themselves with "those" x-men which suggested the schism continuous.

[Daymare]

Possibly a dumb question but is Jeen a play on the name to point out the NuJean? I see it down like this all over the place.

[dragonmp93]

Magik and the boys saw the future JGS (or was it called Xavier's again?), but the future X-Men didn't tell them a thing. The said it was too dangerous for them to know about the future. So what Jean saw in her future self's mind is pretty much all they have to go on.

Well after re-reading all new x-men 17, i noticed a couple of things; that the school is still called JGS, that you are right, the only in-universe information that anyone have about the future is what jeen saw inside xorn's head, also that the future x-men seem to be scared of time travel, and also aware of what the brotherhood was doing, well, either that, or (more likely) they just wanted that magik went back to her time.

[Daymare]

Teasing QQ phoenix is one of the most repulsive things going on in comics at the moment.

I do agree here. The idea of Phoenix was a whole event and they "no mored" it. To already have it a focus again is too soon. ..that and why would it not seek out young Mother Askani? Rachel was the best host, she did wield it from teens to her ancientness. The Phoenix replaced Jean, it bonded with Rachel.

[dragonmp93]

Possibly a dumb question but is Jeen a play on the name to point out the NuJean? I see it down like this all over the place.

Yeah, is just to specify to which jean are you referring to; teen jean = jeen

[Ulnek]

I do agree here. The idea of Phoenix was a whole event and they "no mored" it. To already have it a focus again is too soon. ..that and why would it not seek out young Mother Askani? Rachel was the best host, she did wield it from teens to her ancientness. The Phoenix replaced Jean, it bonded with Rachel.

that's cause jean was dead in that timeline. rachel was the next best thing. jean's revival can be a few years to decades to centuries. it's never a set time. maybe the force sought out hope instead of rachel because hope had more of jean in her (if not entirely jean) than rachel. who knows. did ever answer that?

[Celestialbodies]

I do agree here. The idea of Phoenix was a whole event and they "no mored" it. To already have it a focus again is too soon. ..that and why would it not seek out young Mother Askani? Rachel was the best host, she did wield it from teens to her ancientness. The Phoenix replaced Jean, it bonded with Rachel.

According to current canon it merged with Jean. Besides as another poster stated while Rachel has an affinity for wielding the PF, it has only ever sought her out because Jean rejected it or wasn't available, it's also why the PF didn't come to find Rachel during Endsong choosing instead to resurrect Jean.

[cwatz]

that's cause jean was dead in that timeline. rachel was the next best thing. jean's revival can be a few years to decades to centuries. it's never a set time. maybe the force sought out hope instead of rachel because hope had more of jean in her (if not entirely jean) than rachel. who knows. did ever answer that?

Not even marvel had an answer for why they used Hope instead of Rachel. That was an error on there part if you ask me, but they probably just wanted to tie the Hope stuff off.

Beyond all that, trying to get into the fine details of Phoenix stuff can be a nightmare due to all the contradicting stuff out there. All there really is to go on is that Jean is the top of list.

[nx01a]

Marvel Universe series 3. Marc Silvestri art.
jean4bc449191835f.jpg

[nightw1ng]

Not even marvel had an answer for why they used Hope instead of Rachel. That was an error on there part if you ask me, but they probably just wanted to tie the Hope stuff off.

Didn't editorial initially plan for Hope to be Jean reincarnated but changed their minds later on? If they really wanted to tie things up, they should have just had Hope turn into adult Jean after becoming the White Phoenix and restoring mutantkind in AvX. Instead, Hope has no purpose now and is just a background character in X-Force, currently comatose.

[Ztopia]

Teasing QQ phoenix is one of the most repulsive things going on in comics at the moment.

I did like Jean going godmode at the end (though its not even close to making up for the planet x hackjob). Thats how I nurse the wound of her absence. Pretend shes sitting around saving the universe all day.

I'm not too familiar with QQ but why is he vehemently rejected as a Phoenix host amongst X-fans? Is it because the Phoenix should only have ties to Jean Grey?

[cwatz]

I'm not too familiar with QQ but why is he vehemently rejected as a Phoenix host amongst X-fans? Is it because the Phoenix should only have ties to Jean Grey?

The issues could vary person to person, but there are a few. To set the stage, factor Jean being gone for 10 years, after one of the biggest hackjobs in comics. So there is a lot of anger and frustration in the first place. That makes anything around Jean/Phoenix an overly touchy subject to fans as a result.

Secondly you have the general butchering of the Phoenix canon. Initially it was supposed to be Jean with the "unique gift" that could also be wielded by her children (her conversation with death post DPS is what I wish/pretend the canon is). It has been changed over the years which is frustrating on its own. More importantly the phoenix is one of the only things Jean has at the moment, considering shes not in the comics. Being one of the only things people can cling to, watching it be misused is offensive in a way. As I said before, overly touchy subject.

Third you have QQ who isn't exactly a universally liked character. That plus the previous mentioned points make it even more frustrating. A lot of fans don't want to see other people with the Phoenix, let alone someone they dislike. Then watching Jeen gawk at it in BotA was downright painful. Its supposed to be "her thing". Yet this young version of hers first experience with it, is watching some douche fly around with it. If there wasn't the potential for a greater story arc to remedy the situation, I would have stopped buying ANXM.

So its not directly that the Phoenix should only have ties to Jean Grey (though her + children is much more preferable, and it is one of the issues). Its all of these things piled together. Fans want to read stories about their favorite characters, see them be the most awesomest thing ever. Not to watch them get thrown away for no reason, ignored for a decade, and have any trace of them be whored out and dragged through the mud.

Didn't editorial initially plan for Hope to be Jean reincarnated but changed their minds later on? If they really wanted to tie things up, they should have just had Hope turn into adult Jean after becoming the White Phoenix and restoring mutantkind in AvX. Instead, Hope has no purpose now and is just a background character in X-Force, currently comatose.

I asked that question on these boards once and was told its assumed that was the grand plan, but people caught on to quickly so they changed it. I can't confirm anything but it certainly makes sense.

One would think its foolish for Marvel to leave one of their more popular characters on the sidelines for such a long period of time. However if you follow the trajectory, it makes sense. If Hope was meant to be Jean, then she technically wouldn't have been gone that long. Instead they decide to change course and bring in ANXM, directly when all the Hope stuff wraps up. So from a business/theoretical perspective it lines up.

[Darthfury78]