Sam Wilson is a great big challenge to fit into Captain America. Sure, he’s African American, but I really liked that 2099 Captain Ametica, female, who was Latin American. Mendez, I think. It can be done without all the poison. But like you say, Sam did use his position to become a social worker and that rubbed people the wrong way. But how do you be Captain America? Just stand posing on a corner and do nothing? Of cause Cap is a social worker. That shouldn’t make Sam a focus of a “He’s not my Cap” campaign. Sams social work should have inspired people that something is being done to help people.
Last edited by jackolover; 02-13-2019 at 06:00 AM.
There's no way to verify that, obviously. We can't poll the fictional residents of the MU for their opinions. But while Sam's tenure as Cap was controversial within the MU, the last panel of SE shows a kid playing with a Sam Wilson Cap figure so we're meant to know that Sam's time as Cap left an impact. For all his struggles, his time in that role was notable.
I'm sure Sam would have liked that, too. But it's not realistic. Again, that's part of the point - that because of the color of his skin he was automatically a target for hate.
Easy to do that with a character living in the future where you can say that society has evolved and bigotry is in the past.
Many minorities devote their lives to helping others but are still vilified because of their race.
Look at the deep, unending vitriol some people feel towards President Obama, a leader who suffered no scandals and who was fair and compassionate throughout his Presidency.
An inspiring man by any measure. But because of the color of his skin, he was - and still is - demonized by many.
Steve disagrees...
coates1.jpg
Yeah, don't know what happened there. What I get for trying to do attachments from my phone, I guess. Now that I'm on a desktop what I posted was this...
coates2.jpg
You see how he's saying that what he represented was the important thing? That the dream, not the dreamer, was the important thing? The shield is the symbol of that dream, the man is not the symbol.
Think back to Sam's speech in Secret Empire. And real!Steve agreed with Sam when he got back from the Vanishing Point. Blindly following one individual was lazy and stupid: of America as a whole, of the superhero community, etc. This is why Steve said this...
coates3.JPG
No one individual should have that kind of power. Hydra!Steve shouldn't have had that kind of power. For Steve, our Steve, it has always been the ideals of Captain America being larger than himself, which is the exact opposite way of thinking from Stevil. Coates has even said, in almost every interview he's given on the topic, that the reason he's so drawn to writing Steve was that he wanted to deconstruct the dream. What it might have meant to Steve in the 40's and what it's going to evolve to mean to Steve now.
Last edited by capandkirby; 02-13-2019 at 07:23 AM.
'Blindly following one person' would have been a far better point to make in the mini, had people actually done that.
The second Cap revealed himself to be with Hydra, his fellow Avengers stopped listening. Deadpool was the only one who followed Cap willingly, after that.
I was referring to the American public, mostly. But the argument in regards to the superhero community stems from the fact that Stevil played them behind the scenes, before he was revealed as Hydra, and was largely responsible for Civil War 2 going as far as it did. Because people listened to Stevil instead of following their own gut.
But the main point of Steve's dismay stems from the fact that America was somewhat okay with Stevil taking over. Not only is America's complacence being addressed in Cap, but it was brought up in last month's Black Widow comic, too...
widow.JPG
Currently, in the MU, Kingpin was elected mayor and former Nazi's are running prisons. AND there's this panel, again from last month's Cap #7...
cap#7.jpg
So yeah. What's that T.S Eliot quote about "this is how the world ends, not with a bang but a whimper". That's pretty much Steve's thought process at the moment. His biggest conflict, other been being framed for a murder he didn't commit, is reconciling the ideals of Captain America with American complacency. The 'shield' is dying not just because his enemies want to hijack it, but also through general inactivity of the American public. Thus Sharon and her Daughters of Liberty. Who wont be lazy or complacent. And who can save the dream (and Steve, preferably both).
Which, actually, is an ingenious place for Coates to place Steve in, and not just because of current politics. But because Simon and Kirby created Steve before America joined the war and denounced Hitler. They actually received hate from Nazi sympathizers in New York for the first cover of Cap, which featured Steve punching Hitler. They actually came to Timely offices once to threaten Kirby and Simon. Kirby, small as he was, almost got into fisticuffs with them. So, in essence, Cap was created during another time when America was being complacent. He's come full circle.
Last edited by capandkirby; 02-13-2019 at 01:06 PM.
They actually cut half the team - Avengers Secret Wars had FOURTEEN Avengers. The team was Iron Man, Captain America, Hulk, Hawkeye, Black Widow, Thor, Falcon, Captain Marvel, Ms Marvel, Ant-Man, Wasp, Vision, Black Panther and Jane Foster (renamed Thunderstrike for the cartoon). BPQ reduced it to just Iron Man, Captain America, Thor, Black Panther, Captain Marvel, Ms Marvel, and Black Widow.
Appreciation Thread Indexes
Marvel | Spider-Man | X-Men | NEW!! DC Comics | Batman | Superman | Wonder Woman
Okay, thanks for reposting the image.
That second image, I can interpret that as the real Steve being despondent that the public accepted Hydra Steve. That’s all.
The narrators comments in the first image is just stating that Freedom has always existed and the drive to achieve it was always there long before Steve. That’s all. A shield isnt going to inspire people. Leadership and showing a good example will.
I’m currently toying with a concept of, what if Steve Rogers never became Captain America? Would America have won WWII in the Marvel Universe? My answer would be, no they would not. The uniform of the Stars and Stripes, as well as the shield that Steve Rogers wears, is a vehicle. It’s the emblems of the USA, so it’s designed to be patriotic, and help to cement a stern mindset about their country. But it’s what Steve Rogers does that gets the country moving. I don’t know why that’s so hard to understand.
And I will be interested in what Coates does when “Coates has even said, in almost every interview he's given on the topic, that the reason he's so drawn to writing Steve was that he wanted to deconstruct the dream. What it might have meant to Steve in the 40's and what it's going to evolve to mean to Steve now”. Steve’s relevance to the now is very important evolution to the character, so I wait to see what Coates does to Cap. Deconstructing the dream? That’s sounds disturbing, but I may be just looking at that negatively.
Last edited by jackolover; 02-14-2019 at 06:25 PM.
Leaving aside the whole Coates run take on cap, I just wanna say something on-topic
As much as I liked Secret Empire as a whole, Spencer really dropped the ball at 2 things
1- Him literally spoiling the ending 1 day before the final issue release
2- Killing Avrill right after the Planetary Shield went down. Yeah, it was a heroic death, that turned the tide on the heroes favor, but man.. I really liked her, and I believe she had tons of potential, and shouldnt have got ridden off like that
1. He didn't do that. Axel Alonso did that. And I will never fucking forget that. And I will also never forgive that. Ever.
https://twitter.com/axelalonsomarv/s...11403909656576
2. He left the door wide open for someone else to bring her back ("See you soon"). But since no one seems to care, I guess I'll have to wait until Nick goes to space, too... (Which I want him to do for that and his glorious, glorious Star-Lord)
I don't blind date I make the direct market vibrate