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  1. #46

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    I have been reworking my Krypton stuff for my DCU History project. I think this pretty much sums up the way DC is approaching continuity these days...and I couldn’t be happier about it

  2. #47
    Fantastic Member Jon-El's Avatar
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    I’m pretty clueless about modern comics having not read in a while but my favorite era for Superman is the Bronze Age. Writers would ignore ideas from the silver age that they thought wouldn’t work but it was all there if someone wanted to use them.

  3. #48
    Astonishing Member superduperman's Avatar
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    To some degree, that's what the pre-Flashpoint era was trying to be. With mixed results. I don't know that an "everything counts" model would work with Superman. For one thing, every time it's tried, stuff gets left out regardless and nobody can figure out how certain stories went. Take the death and return story line. There's no way it could have happened the way it did in the books now. The Kents are dead (at least for the moment), Lois figures out that the cyborg Superman is a fake because he claimed to be a Superboy when the real Superman wasn't (he was by the time Flashpoint happened and they imply that even the current version had Superboy level powers as a teen), and the birthing matrix played a huge role in how the cyborg Superman was created. The birthing matrix doesn't even exist anymore and hasn't since about 2002. For all intents and purposes, that story just plain couldn't have happened. That's just one example. God only knows what the hell his current origin is. Was he a costumed Superboy? Do we even know? I don't follow mainstream continuity anymore. I can't. I don't even know what it is. That's ridiculous. Maybe I still have sour grapes over losing the New 52 but I don't see how some of this stuff can be reconciled.
    Now listen to me, Clark! This great strength of yours--you've got to hide it from people or they'll be scared of you!

  4. #49

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    Quote Originally Posted by superduperman View Post
    To some degree, that's what the pre-Flashpoint era was trying to be. With mixed results. I don't know that an "everything counts" model would work with Superman. For one thing, every time it's tried, stuff gets left out regardless and nobody can figure out how certain stories went. Take the death and return story line. There's no way it could have happened the way it did in the books now. The Kents are dead (at least for the moment), Lois figures out that the cyborg Superman is a fake because he claimed to be a Superboy when the real Superman wasn't (he was by the time Flashpoint happened and they imply that even the current version had Superboy level powers as a teen), and the birthing matrix played a huge role in how the cyborg Superman was created. The birthing matrix doesn't even exist anymore and hasn't since about 2002. For all intents and purposes, that story just plain couldn't have happened. That's just one example. God only knows what the hell his current origin is. Was he a costumed Superboy? Do we even know? I don't follow mainstream continuity anymore. I can't. I don't even know what it is. That's ridiculous. Maybe I still have sour grapes over losing the New 52 but I don't see how some of this stuff can be reconciled.
    It can be reconciled by the longstanding idea that Superman & Lois Lane exist in a world of time-travel, paradoxes, 5th dimensional imps and various baddies who are constantly mucking with is own history. This kind of stuff has been happening to Lois & Clark for longer than most readers have been alive. Superman's backstory is constantly being tweaked and changed by himself, The Anti-Monitor, The Time Trapper, Dominus, Parallax, Superboy-Prime, Dr. Manhattan, Vyndktvx, and probably a few more that I'm forgetting.

    If you'd had your own history altered that many times, would you really expect it all to fit together nicely anymore?

    Every story within Superman's over eight decade long history can be read and enjoyed for what it is, because each story exists within the established history the characters had at the time, while also existing within the larger context of a guy whose very importance to the DCU has led to his own life constantly being rewritten over and over.

  5. #50
    Astonishing Member superduperman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bored at 3:00AM View Post
    It can be reconciled by the longstanding idea that Superman & Lois Lane exist in a world of time-travel, paradoxes, 5th dimensional imps and various baddies who are constantly mucking with is own history. This kind of stuff has been happening to Lois & Clark for longer than most readers have been alive. Superman's backstory is constantly being tweaked and changed by himself, The Anti-Monitor, The Time Trapper, Dominus, Parallax, Superboy-Prime, Dr. Manhattan, Vyndktvx, and probably a few more that I'm forgetting.

    If you'd had your own history altered that many times, would you really expect it all to fit together nicely anymore?

    Every story within Superman's over eight decade long history can be read and enjoyed for what it is, because each story exists within the established history the characters had at the time, while also existing within the larger context of a guy whose very importance to the DCU has led to his own life constantly being rewritten over and over.
    That's one way of looking at it. Another is this: Let's say you had a TV show that rebooted every five years. They kept some elements from previous seasons and got rid of others but you don't know for sure what. Would you keep watching it? How many reboots is too many before you gave up on that TV show?
    Now listen to me, Clark! This great strength of yours--you've got to hide it from people or they'll be scared of you!

  6. #51
    Mighty Member Yoda's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by superduperman View Post
    That's one way of looking at it. Another is this: Let's say you had a TV show that rebooted every five years. They kept some elements from previous seasons and got rid of others but you don't know for sure what. Would you keep watching it? How many reboots is too many before you gave up on that TV show?
    This is literally the formula that has kept Doctor Who going for 50+ years, albeit not continuously. But its been running strong for the last 14 years on this formula.

    Man, now I want a Superman tv show that reboots with a "Crisis" every 5 years the way Doctor Who regenerates. That'd be amazing. Start in the 1930's with a Morrison-esq version, then modernize him with a "Crisis" up to the modern day.
    Last edited by Yoda; 05-23-2019 at 10:06 AM.

  7. #52

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    Quote Originally Posted by superduperman View Post
    That's one way of looking at it. Another is this: Let's say you had a TV show that rebooted every five years. They kept some elements from previous seasons and got rid of others but you don't know for sure what. Would you keep watching it? How many reboots is too many before you gave up on that TV show?
    If that show had been airing continuously since 1938 and these changes had been occurring regularly for decades, and were incorporated into the narrative in interesting ways, then yes, I'd absolutely keep watching that show as long as it was still entertaining.

    If uncertainty over continuity prevents you from enjoying something, just pick the continuity that you enjoy the most and use that. If it doesn't quite fit, you can explain it away with any of the various cosmic time shenanigans that are regularly occurring incidents in the DCU.
    Last edited by Bored at 3:00AM; 05-23-2019 at 07:00 PM.

  8. #53

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    Quote Originally Posted by Yoda View Post
    This is literally the formula that has kept Doctor Who going for 50+ years, albeit not continuously. But its been running strong for the last 14 years on this formula.

    Man, now I want a Superman tv show that reboots with a "Crisis" every 5 years the way Doctor Who regenerates. That'd be amazing. Start in the 1930's with a Morrison-esq version, then modernize him with a "Crisis" up to the modern day.
    Yeah, sign me up!

  9. #54
    Phantom Zone Escapee manofsteel1979's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bored at 3:00AM View Post
    I took a crack at a Superman of All Eras version of his history in the view of Morrison's Everything Happened Batman.

    I think it works pretty well, because timey-whimey shenanigans have been a part of his history for decades.

    https://docs.google.com/document/d/1...it?usp=sharing
    That's pretty dang good. I buy it!
    When it comes to comics,one person's "fan-service" is another persons personal cannon. So by definition it's ALL fan service. Aren't we ALL fans?
    SUPERMAN is the greatest fictional character ever created.

  10. #55
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    Isn't this thread confirmed in Doomsday Clock#10?
    From Dr Manhattan's perspective, everything in DC is canon and what really happened.

  11. #56

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    Quote Originally Posted by catman View Post
    Isn't this thread confirmed in Doomsday Clock#10?
    From Dr Manhattan's perspective, everything in DC is canon and what really happened.
    It's also been confirmed by Bendis himself in interviews, no doubt because he's been aware of what Johns had planned for a while now.

  12. #57

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    Quote Originally Posted by manofsteel1979 View Post
    That's pretty dang good. I buy it!
    Thanks a lot! I have something similar that covers the entire DCU if you are interested.

  13. #58
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    Everything in DC come from prime universe and Superman.And Everything can be canon.
    This is metafictional reference about the history of DC universe.Grant Morrison and Geoff Johns have told it since at least 2000's.
    But, Is there someone who have told this without Morrison and Geoff?

  14. #59
    Father Son Kamehameha < Kuwagaton's Avatar
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    In Superman Forever, a villain called Dominus splits him into the different continuities.

    Recently, in Superman Reborn and Action Comics 1000, we're given glimpses of acknowledgment to his place across time and media.
    Welcome or welcome back! Please check out the updated
    CBR Community STANDARDS & RULES

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