Hobgoblin (Roderick Kingsley) Appreciation (2019)

[MajorHoy]

First appearance (with real identity unrevealed):

Amazing Spider-Man #238 (March 1983)

and from
The Official Handbook of the Marvel Universe Vol. 1 No. 5 (May 1983):

[Celgress]

Hail to the second best Goblin (after only Green Goblin) of them all, the others aren't even close.

[Venomous Mask]

Hail to the second best Goblin (after only Green Goblin) of them all, the others aren't even close.

I agree, he was a mastermind back in the 80s and I'm glad that Marvel retconned his 'death' as just being a brainwashed Ned. I am sad that he was out of the picture for almost twenty years (and the Hobgoblin in general made very little appearances in that time either).

[Mistah K88]

I'm very curious to know how Stern was originally planning to reveal Kingsley as Hobgoblin before he decided to just let others decide who it was behind the mask.


It's funny, despite being one of the higher tiered villains Hobgoblin has made it into animation twice, and Roderick Kingsley only made it into animation once... Even both Cletus and Carnage have gotten more than that!





I'd say Hobgoblin is one of the few "Copycat" villains to do it right.

[Jimmy The Crabbo]

Ah, the Hobgoblin. I actually prefer him to Norman. It's just something about how mysterious he was initially combined with his design. Would definitely not mind the MCU using him instead of Greenie.

[JGC]

Ah, the Hobgoblin. I actually prefer him to Norman. It's just something about how mysterious he was initially combined with his design. Would definitely not mind the MCU using him instead of Greenie.

I would love if the MCU did the whole Rose/Hobgoblin storyline in the 3rd Spidey film. Spidey needs to tackle organized crime in NYC and with Kingpin introduced in Daredevil, they could easily tie Richard Fisk to Wilson somehow and bring in Hobgoblin as the big, bad nemesis thisfilms deserves.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

I'm very curious to know how Stern was originally planning to reveal Kingsley as Hobgoblin before he decided to just let others decide who it was behind the mask.

In interviews Stern said he was very much an iterative writer. He had plans and ideas but not a fully plotted out roadmap. So no he never had a full plan for how that reveal would have happened. He said once that his plan was to set-up the Hobgoblin mystery like the Green Goblin one, only to reveal it for one issue later. Green Goblin showed up in ASM #14, and then got revealed in ASM #40. So that's 27 issues of buildup and payoff. So since Hobgoblin first appeared in ASM #238, that means he should ideally be revealed 28 issues later in ASM #266.

That was one reason why Defalco decided to go against it. Stern in his run had not set up the identical twin thing adequately, Roderick Kingsley also wasn't close enough or connected to Peter enough that it could work. And so the idea was to spin wheels around the character since the mystery became more compelling than the payoff.

I actually wonder if that might not be for the best. Make Hobgoblin the unknown unsolved and unsolvable mystery. The Spider-Man version of the Zodiac or since this is New York, Son of Sam. A lot of people wonder if the Son of Sam really was David Berkowitz, or if the murders were ultimately taken credit for by a glory hound. The Joker for instance is a character whose origins are unknown and unknowable and that could be one way you could do it.

For me Hobgoblin is a case of a character whose purpose and intent is totally obsolete. He was created as a permanent replacement for Norman Osborn and to be Spider-Man's great archnemesis. That ended when his mystery ran its well dry and got defused and then Venom came and usurped the role of Arch-Enemy, and then Carnage after that also became a bigger deal. Then Norman Osborn got resurrected and established himself as top goblin, so now Kingsley can't play the role he was originally created for.

My advice is to shuffle Kingsley to Miles Morales and make him a villain for Miles. Or send him to face down Spider-Gwen. Right now he's a tinkerer type character who makes costumes for other B and C listers.

[MajorHoy]

From back when Ned Leeds was apparently the Hobgoblin:


originally in
The Official Handbook of the Marvel Universe Deluxe Edition Vol. 2 No. 17
(August 1987)

[Mistah K88]

In interviews Stern said he was very much an iterative writer. He had plans and ideas but not a fully plotted out roadmap. So no he never had a full plan for how that reveal would have happened. He said once that his plan was to set-up the Hobgoblin mystery like the Green Goblin one, only to reveal it for one issue later. Green Goblin showed up in ASM #14, and then got revealed in ASM #40. So that's 27 issues of buildup and payoff. So since Hobgoblin first appeared in ASM #238, that means he should ideally be revealed 28 issues later in ASM #266.

That was one reason why Defalco decided to go against it. Stern in his run had not set up the identical twin thing adequately, Roderick Kingsley also wasn't close enough or connected to Peter enough that it could work. And so the idea was to spin wheels around the character since the mystery became more compelling than the payoff.

I actually wonder if that might not be for the best. Make Hobgoblin the unknown unsolved and unsolvable mystery. The Spider-Man version of the Zodiac or since this is New York, Son of Sam. A lot of people wonder if the Son of Sam really was David Berkowitz, or if the murders were ultimately taken credit for by a glory hound. The Joker for instance is a character whose origins are unknown and unknowable and that could be one way you could do it.

For me Hobgoblin is a case of a character whose purpose and intent is totally obsolete. He was created as a permanent replacement for Norman Osborn and to be Spider-Man's great archnemesis. That ended when his mystery ran its well dry and got defused and then Venom came and usurped the role of Arch-Enemy, and then Carnage after that also became a bigger deal. Then Norman Osborn got resurrected and established himself as top goblin, so now Kingsley can't play the role he was originally created for.

My advice is to shuffle Kingsley to Miles Morales and make him a villain for Miles. Or send him to face down Spider-Gwen. Right now he's a tinkerer type character who makes costumes for other B and C listers.

Despite Hobgoblin being one of my favorite Spidey villains, I will say that he's definitely a character where the mask matters more than the man, which is why when Kinsgley did finally get animated Marvel was cool with changing his race in the adaption, yet wouldn't budge with someone like Rhino in the same adaption.

One of Kingsley's greatest achievements aside from altering the Green Goblin's costume was re creating Norman's Goblin formula with less explosive results. I'm curious to know why he hasn't been mass producing THAT? Is it because Norman's journals were destroyed and Kingsley didn't even decide to make notes of his own? (which I'm SURE I remember him taking notes...but whatever).