Why I think Jean Grey is cool/underrated

[Spidercide]

I’m a novice when it comes to X-Men comic lore. As such if I get any info or interpretations here wrong please set me straight.

This is how I’ve come to gradually perceive Jean Grey and think she’s a good and perhaps misunderstood character.


To me, I can sum up Jean as someone who’s experienced great pain and hurt but who is in spite of that a very nice, nurturing and fundamentally empathic person; a little like Sue Storm, though I dunno if I’d call her the ‘Mother’ of the X-Men. Perhaps it is even that pain she experienced so early in her life through her friend’s death that MADE her so empathetic. Through that empathy and her immense power she has this duality of being possibly a great force for destruction or of healing.

She wants to help and heal, but understands that sometimes she has to fight and be destructive (e.g. against evil mutants, Sentinels, etc) and knows to use restraint in pursuit of that. But being both an empathic person and also SO incredibly powerful (at times to a cosmic degree) her capacity for being destructive (even to herself) can be set loose. E.g. she could be profoundly dangerous if you hurt her friends, precisely because her empathy forges such love for them.


In a sense her first major arc as Phoenix and as Dark Phoenix sum up this duality about her; let's put a pin in any retcons later on for a moment.

As originally presented in Uncanny #100-101, when Jean became Phoenix it was explicitly to save her friends. She didn't want to die but was willing to give her life for them, desiring just enough strength to pull that stunt off. And she got that strength and then some. So you had this powerful yet kind person (who was still relatively young and inexperienced) abruptly handed way more power than maybe anyone should have but she still used it (at first) to help. The climax of the 'Phoenix Saga' with the M'kraan crystal (sp?) was fundamentally about Jean using her newly acquired cosmic powers to fix, to heal, something. And she could only do it by being empathic, by reaching out and drawing upon a human emotional connection (to her friend Storm) and forging a connection with a relative stranger (Corsair, the father of the person she loved so there was in a sense an emotional connection there she drew upon). The narration of that moment (visualized beautifully in X-Men the Animated Series ‘The Phoenix Saga Part V) painted the idea of Jean imagining her friends as a tree, a symbol for life and growth and kind of...healing. Appropriate for a Phoenix which represents rebirth and renewal.


But then you get the Dark Phoenix Saga and this very empathic person, is corrupted by someone in a sense taking advantage of her emotions, by tricking her into making emotional connections through which he can then corrupt her and open the floodgates to the awesome power that might be beyond pretty much any mortal to control. And so Jean became a force of explicit destruction. Which is also appropriate because a Phoenix represents death and destruction as well.


I do not know if this is canon to 616, but in X-Men: Grand Design, when Jean's powers first manifest she tried using them to essentially keep her dying friend alive. In X-Men vol 2 #71 the issue starts with Jean using her telepathy to cleanse the X-Men’s home of the negative psychometric impressions left by Bastion and his Zero Tolerance operation. Jean Grey was trying to remove some of the pain and hurt inflicted upon her home and friends, but doing it quite literally. Both of which would go some way in supporting what I'm trying to say about who Jean is, as far as her having great power which she can and wants to use as a force for healing.


Appropriately for Xavier's first student (arguably the first X-Man), she in a sense is a microcosm of mutantkind and of the X-Men specifically. The X-Men can be destructive, sometimes HAVE to be destructive in defence of themselves, their people and of wider humanity. But Xavier also wanted them to be a force for healing and growth between mutants and humans and in truth that was their bigger endgame goal. So Jean being his first student, a founding X-Man, at times a team leader and the most powerful X-Man (usually) is symbolically appropriate.


Maybe I am stretching here, but I also think that Jean’s pain and the duality of her being a force of potentially great destruction or healing plays into what to my limited experience are some of her most significant relationships.

Professor X: Obviously she believes in his dream and wants to see it through, I outlined the connection above.

Wolverine: A stretch perhaps because it wasn’t established off the bat, but the idea of Jean being a healer to others (noticeably her first interaction with Logan is as his doctor in X-Men 2000) connects her to Logan who is a literal self-healer due to his powers. You also have someone who has been through immense pain similar to her and possesses incredible potential for destruction he practices to (not always successfully) control. In a sense they both have dark and terrible ‘alter egos’, for Jean Dark Phoenix and Logan his berserker rage where animal imagery is used to personify their states of being. The Phoenix is after all presented as a raptor bird of prey and Logan is literally named after an aggressive predatory animal. Yet Logan can also be a positive force for others as a teacher, protector or even as a someone capable of taking life to ‘balance the scales’. I recall Mark Millar’s run where he murders Gorgon and his Hand/HYDRA gang in part to provide some measure of closure for the parents of a boy they murdered to get to him.

Storm: At least during Claremont’s early tenure on X-Men he was presenting Storm as a pseudo Mother Nature style Goddess who even maintained plants in the mansion. The plants themselves demonstrate Storm as capable of care and nurture (her motherly relationship with Kitty bears this out) like Jean; so she’s connected with a form of healing and growth. Through her powers though, she and Jean also (in different ways) possess an immense capacity for destruction and healing, Storm’s being perhaps more direct and physical and Jean’s more subtle and ethereal. Both are also connected to primordial forces though, Storm the elements of the weather and Jean, obviously, with fire.

Cyclops: They both experienced great pain and loss in their youth. They both possess immense destructive power. Cyclops however is tormented because his powers are in a sense broken, he is supposed to be able to control his optic blasts but that same youthful pain and loss led to him being unable to. And by extension he is himself a person with a lot of mental issues (not necessarily outright mental illnesses though).

He is someone who can be emotionally distant because of these issues as well as his broken abilities, at least to some extent, leading him to be distant in terms of physical intimacy too. They say the eyes are the window into the soul and Cyclops’ powers mean he can neither look upon anyone’s eyes/soul without a red filter nor can anyone see into his. He can feel but in a sense is reluctant of doing so (which leads to at times more detached yet pragmatic leadership).

Jean Grey however is a great counterbalance to Cyclops.

Her powerset in a sense ‘fixes’ (or heals) Scott or else bypasses his handicaps. Her telekinesis is so powerful she can hold back his otherwise typically destructive power.* Even without that, her telepathy allows her a window into Cyclops’ mind/soul in a way she couldn’t have if she wasn’t a telepath and he had complete control of his powers. Her empathy and mutual experiences of loss, pain, of bearing the burden of being potentially destructive allow her to emotionally connect to this man who finds it understandably difficult to open up and gives them both an avenue to share their baggage. Hopefully this, at least at times, can make Cyclops more well rounded and able to emotionally connect to others.**

If nothing else Cyclops ability to be somewhat detached and thus more pragmatic and Jean’s ability to emotionally connect and be empathetic mean that as far as leadership is concerned, they are at their best united than apart.

Having said all that stuff about Jean, the reason why I think I and perhaps other people like her is because in a sense she represents a different more subtle form of heroism and is herself an unconventional example of it.


*I’ve heard she can even temporarily fix Scott’s mental injury so he just sees normally but have never seen this in a comic, only (specifically from the Dark Phoenix Saga) her literally controlling the blasts so they don’t shoot out at all. Love to know if she can do more than that.

**Not saying Scott was ever and unfeeling monster, just that he seemed to have a certain distance to everyone else in my reading experience, partially due to the burden of leadership.

Also as far as making Scott more well rounded, this is perhaps a stretch but skipping around a lot of 1990s comics where Cyclops and Jean are together prior to ‘The Twelve’ he seemed more open and comparatively upbeat (I recall him and Beast goofing off in the wake of ‘Onslaught’ or something right?) next to his attitude after he and Apocalypse were separated (by Jean, so again she was acting as a healing force) and he and Jean drew more distant, their marriage fell apart and then later she died and he began dating Emma.

I’m not even trying to diss the Scott/Emma relationship. I’m just observing...he was less upbeat and more stoic and seemingly distant than he was in the 1990s. Maybe one or both of those are OOC and I just don’t realize so again please tell me.

[Spidercide]

Often in superhero fiction the protagonists and fan favs are the characters who’re well...bad ass.

Bad ass in a more ‘traditional’ and obvious ways. Wolverine, Batman, Punisher, even the quippy acrobatic and super strong Spider-Man.

And there is NOTHING wrong with that. I adore all that stuff I suspect the vast, vast, vast majority of people reading this do too. It is in fact my preference for the kinds of superhero fiction I enjoy.

However there are other forms of strength and heroism too.

There is heroism in removing or preventing destructive forces like say Superman typically does. But there is also heroism in being the healer, or the person who tries to help people achieve their potential or prevent them from falling apart.

Abstract example, but if you were to say the Wolverines and Batmen represent the heroism of fire fighters then the Jean Greys would be the paramedics, doctors and therepists who attend the victims. But imagine they also had fire hoses and axes too but less flashy and attention grabbing ones.

Jean is far from the only example of this type of her, Sue Storm would be another example in my view. But what gives Jean a certain uniqueness to these other types of heroes (who for whatever reason do tend to be female, make of that whatever you want) is the fact that she also has the double edged sword of her power to heal being capable of immense destruction and at times she needs to fight hard to ensure it leans towards the former and not the latter. Sue Storm after all couldn’t be a casual city buster if she really slips up. Add onto that an extra layer of the mutant metaphor and Jean fighting for Xavier’s dream and Jean stands relatively apart from both these particular types of superheroes and many superheroes in general.

That doesn’t make her or similar heroes better than the Wolverines or Batmen of the genre. Just a different flavour. But a more uncommon and at first glance less bright and shiny flavour so it gets overlooked.***

Or worse, as Jay and Miles X-Plain the X-Men imo ignorantly summed up in their first podcast episode, gets them dismissed as a stereotype.

Jean in that podcast and I think too many people is dismissed as just being ‘the girl’ or in all the stuff I’ve spoken about as a stereotypical female superhero.

Which I disagree and take issue with. To begin with there is nothing wrong with a female character having these traits, the problem lies in the overabundance (if there even is any) and exaggeration which creates the stereotype.

When Jean debuted in the 1960s, protagonists or not, yeah there were a fair number of female characters who were written as caring, nurturing and empathetic. And they were written that way just BECAUSE they were female characters and that was one of the few and limiting boxes to put female characters into.

But I think Claremont and other writers basically (partially to be consistent perhaps) EMBRACED those traits within Jean and built upon them so she wasn’t like that because she was a female character but because that was just her particular personality, much as Rogue, Storm, Emma Frost, Shadowcat, Psylocke, Dazzler Polaris, and the other X-Ladies had their own personalities however many traits in common they shared or not.

It doesn’t make Jean lesser, or weak or even boring. At that point you are almost equating good/strong with stereotypical male superhero traits.

It just means she’s different and offers a different shade of strength and heroism.

And unless I’ve been super off the mark with most of this stuff, that’s why I think Jean Grey is cool and underrated.

***Flashy and obvious btw doesn’t mean bad or lesser, again just different.

[Del torro]

Great posts. You make some really good points about Jean (and Scott). Not sure if we're allowed to make separate threads like this, instead of posting in appreciation threads, anyways.

I agree that apocalypse possession regressed Scott from the developments he had made since Early Xmen and X-Factor (where he became more open with others and Jean by the end). I think Astonishing X-Men showed Emma helping him to open up to others again. He made a lot of progress from where he was in New Xmen.
You have to admit that in new Xmen, Jean became a bit less "interpersonal empathic" and more "big picture empathic" in a way, which didn't help matters with Scott.


Anyway. What makes Jean interesting to me is the different struggles that she has internally, her anger, Jealousy, selfishness/Bias, grudges (and the way she is unable to hold unto them when you apologize), the conflict between being what everyone from her and being what she wants, and knowing if they are even the same thing. Her stubbornness and refusal to follow on paths that have already been predestined for her, even when those paths are what she wants, until she comes to it on her own terms.
Her big heart and empathic nature are a big draw for me, her penchant for self sacrifice and the depression/self hate or blame that has been hinted, which could in a way interpret some of her actions as suicidal.


She's not a "badass" I in the typical way, but she has her own ways of making jaws drop. Like when someone underestimates her every day girl next door demeanor and possessed her off enough for her to unleash her famous anger (which she seems to have gotten some control over, I'll miss it).

Also, I love the way she is with Bobby, hank, Warren and Ororo

[Grey]

I agree in regards to her empathy being a strong defining asset but also the cause of the upper ceiling of her power levels.

Take away (dark) phoenix for the sake of discussion . I like imagining of what jean is truly capable of without moral restraint and empathy. With empathy she is well aware the consequences of her actions on people and thus likely holds back.

I’m not saying I don’t want jean to have her empathy and morality. It’s what makes her her. But I think she could approach Phoenix level powers in SOME capacities if she could learn to curb her empathy in times of necessity.

This is why I loved teen jean. She still showed a flare for empathy and compassion but damn was she a force to be reckoned with when she was able to put those feelings aside in times of need.

I like to believe that’s why teen jean was able to access a level of her powers that her adult self never has - because she was beter at being able to put empathy aside more easily when the time was needed. Perhaps now that adult jean has unlocked those memories we will see that change.

[Grey]

Great posts. You make some really good points about Jean (and Scott). Not sure if we're allowed to make separate threads like this, instead of posting in appreciation threads, anyways.

I agree that apocalypse possession regressed Scott from the developments he had made since Early Xmen and X-Factor (where he became more open with others and Jean by the end). I think Astonishing X-Men showed Emma helping him to open up to others again. He made a lot of progress from where he was in New Xmen.
You have to admit that in new Xmen, Jean became a bit less "interpersonal empathic" and more "big picture empathic" in a way, which didn't help matters with Scott.


Anyway. What makes Jean interesting to me is the different struggles that she has internally, her anger, Jealousy, selfishness/Bias, grudges (and the way she is unable to hold unto them when you apologize), the conflict between being what everyone from her and being what she wants, and knowing if they are even the same thing. Her stubbornness and refusal to follow on paths that have already been predestined for her, even when those paths are what she wants, until she comes to it on her own terms.
Her big heart and empathic nature are a big draw for me, her penchant for self sacrifice and the depression/self hate or blame that has been hinted, which could in a way interpret some of her actions as suicidal.


She's not a "badass" I in the typical way, but she has her own ways of making jaws drop. Like when someone underestimates her every day girl next door demeanor and possessed her off enough for her to unleash her famous anger (which she seems to have gotten some control over, I'll miss it).

Also, I love the way she is with Bobby, hank, Warren and Ororo

Id prefer posts like this stay in the appreciation thread too, but if the number of other posts for
Specific characters who shall not be named exist, I’m sure this is ok too. It just tends to attract a lot more negative attention when a fan creates a thread for a particular character they like.

[Spidercide]

Great posts. You make some really good points about Jean (and Scott). Not sure if we're allowed to make separate threads like this, instead of posting in appreciation threads, anyways.

I agree that apocalypse possession regressed Scott from the developments he had made since Early Xmen and X-Factor (where he became more open with others and Jean by the end). I think Astonishing X-Men showed Emma helping him to open up to others again. He made a lot of progress from where he was in New Xmen.
You have to admit that in new Xmen, Jean became a bit less "interpersonal empathic" and more "big picture empathic" in a way, which didn't help matters with Scott.


Anyway. What makes Jean interesting to me is the different struggles that she has internally, her anger, Jealousy, selfishness/Bias, grudges (and the way she is unable to hold unto them when you apologize), the conflict between being what everyone from her and being what she wants, and knowing if they are even the same thing. Her stubbornness and refusal to follow on paths that have already been predestined for her, even when those paths are what she wants, until she comes to it on her own terms.
Her big heart and empathic nature are a big draw for me, her penchant for self sacrifice and the depression/self hate or blame that has been hinted, which could in a way interpret some of her actions as suicidal.


She's not a "badass" I in the typical way, but she has her own ways of making jaws drop. Like when someone underestimates her every day girl next door demeanor and possessed her off enough for her to unleash her famous anger (which she seems to have gotten some control over, I'll miss it).

Also, I love the way she is with Bobby, hank, Warren and Ororo

I felt given it's length and the fact that its not just an aprpeciation post but me attempting to explain stuff (from my understanding) about Jean and why she's looked upon the way she is it warranted a seperate thread.

TBH I would go so far as to say that Morrisson's run over all was problematic as far as characterization of Cyclops and Jean were concerned so it wasn't Jean being big picture empathetic but just being OOC because Morrisson wanted cheap drama of an affair and also to work through his personal issues cos he was going through or had had a bad break up back then. He did the same nonsense in Batman where he messed up Talia to work through his own issues with his mother.

"her anger, Jealousy, selfishness/Bias, grudges (and the way she is unable to hold unto them when you apologize), the conflict between being what everyone from her and being what she wants, and knowing if they are even the same thing. Her stubbornness and refusal to follow on paths that have already been predestined for her, even when those paths are what she wants, until she comes to it on her own terms.
Her big heart and empathic nature are a big draw for me, her penchant for self sacrifice and the depression/self hate or blame that has been hinted, which could in a way interpret some of her actions as suicidal. "

could you elaborate/give examples of these? when has jean been suicidal for intance?

[Snoop Dogg]

who is jean grey

[AHRNIHAL]

who is jean grey

She's the girl loki impersonated to fool wolverine

[Snoop Dogg]

She's the girl loki impersonated to fool wolverine

sounds pretty hot

[Marvelboy1974]

LOVE this! Jean Grey forever!!!

[kevlon]

I don't know if underrated is the right word for Jean.

[Spidercide]

I don't know if underrated is the right word for Jean.

I feel she is. I've rarely ever seen her regarded in any medium or version as anyone's fav. Even if you ignore Wolverine who is kind of in a class of his own as far as popularity goes, Magneto honestly seems to have more people talking him up as the shizzle as does Rogue. Jean I've often found has either been dismissed, forgotten or outright punched down on as being boring when I feel part of that is people either looking to her for one thing when she's a character about something else. It's a bit like Cipher being dismissed as lame because he has little over and obvious combat abilities.

Which is a reasonable rationale for someone to not be into him but it doesn't render him a lame character.

[TheCape]

Nice piece, mostly agreed with how you describe, especially in her relationships with other X-Men, i personally always saw her bond with Logan as a kinda weird variation of the Florence Nightingale effect, but maybe i was reading too much into it personally.

[RachelGrey]

What I want to see is Jean embracing that she is Rachel's mother and doing a long term story with the two of them on the same book together. I feel like Marvel is afraid of putting Jean and Rachel together beyond one or two panels from time to time. If Rachel can interact with Scott on a regular basis then she can definitely interact with Jean too. I get that they have the same powersets, but I don't think that means you can't explore their relationship and personality differences in an X-book.

I liked X-Men Red, and I thought Jean was a good leader for the X-Men, so when AoXM is over I hope she gets to lead her own book again.

[Snoop Dogg]

does jean grey evade her taxes