Anyone else wish Brock!Venom would go back to just being a Spidey villain?

[Spidercide]

What it says up top.

[Frontier]

I finally read the first trade of the Donny Cates Venom trade and while I enjoyed it...his characterization of Eddie just didn't do anything for me. He just felt kind of bland and going through the motions (I guess Knull and the medication helped on that front, but still).

It felt like he was missing that obsessive and hard edge he used to have as a Spider-Man villain now that he has to be an "Anti-Hero" and a published Marvel character with tons of events and Superhero team-ups to his name.

All that being said, he's probably still going to be depicted as a Spider-Man villain in media, outside the movies (where Spider-Man isn't relevant to his character).

[Revolutionary_Jack]

I wish someone found a way to restore David Michelinie's concept of a pregnant woman hosting the symbiote or Venom jumping from host to host. Eventually when Michelinie heard they wanted to make Venom an anti-hero, he created Carnage as a replacement.

I remember watching The Spectacular Spider-Man cartoon and it had my favorite version of the Symbiote saga, where Spider-Man finds the symbiote gets the black suit and the symbiote develops a personality and obsessive attachment on Peter and becomes a jilted host. To me the Symbiote was the villain, and a much better one than Eddie Brock. At least in that version there.

Having said that I liked the Venom 2018 movie tremendously and I finally got the appeal of Brock and Venom in that. And I am absolutely unironically anticipating Carnage in the sequel.

Venom hasn't really been as impressive a villain after Michelinie left, and he's maybe not been that impressive as an anti-hero until Donny Cates arrived.

The real problem is that Brock isn't much as a character. He never was.

[your_name_here]

Eddie and the Symbiotea character are really getting explored in this second ark of Cates’ Venom. Stick it out. I imagine the first one just went big to grip us before we took a deeper personal look.

[TheCape]

I prefer him as a villain that serve as a dark reflection of Peter. Cates Venom is entertaining, but it really the symbiote is the one recieving the bulk of charactherization here, the second arc has been giving Brock more to do, but is still a bit lacking for me.

[Snoop Dogg]

His original motivation is gone, and bringing it back would be unfair character regression. You could come up with a new reason for him being more villainous, but it wouldn't ring true. I like the direction and effort being made into having him be his own part of the Marvel Universe to explore with his own grander lore. I also like his current dynamic with Peter as kind of uncomfortable allies. But I also say this not finding most of his stories as a villain from the Michelinie days very compelling. I don't want Venom to kind of go back to one guy's foe after they've done such an excellent job this decade specifically of convincing me he can be so much more with all the good books they've been doing since Agent Venom. So I'm hoping for a Punisher situation.

[Celgress]

OP Question -

For what it's worth I do either that or make Eddie Anti-Venom again. I've never been a big fan of Eddie as anti-hero Venom. IMO Eddie is too dark a character with too hateful an (initial) motivation to make an effective anti-hero. The guy might see himself as a hero but he is in no way a real hero. I think the best solution would be Eddie back as Anti-Venom with his "divine healing mission" while the Venom Symbiote goes off and resurrects Flash.

[Inversed]

His original motivation is gone, and bringing it back would be unfair character regression. You could come up with a new reason for him being more villainous, but it wouldn't ring true. I like the direction and effort being made into having him be his own part of the Marvel Universe to explore with his own grander lore. I also like his current dynamic with Peter as kind of uncomfortable allies. But I also say this not finding most of his stories as a villain from the Michelinie days very compelling. I don't want Venom to kind of go back to one guy's foe after they've done such an excellent job this decade specifically of convincing me he can be so much more with all the good books they've been doing since Agent Venom. So I'm hoping for a Punisher situation.

Like you mentioned, the only reason he was a villain to begin with was because of his hatred for Peter/Spider-Man. Without that, there's no reason for them to go fully bad. As someone who's never completely cared about Eddie alot, Cates' run is the most I've been invested with him in a long time.

Also I think him working as an anti-hero is alot more interesting, especially for someone as unhinged as Venom, seeing them try to do good, but their own tendencies push them in badder directions. (And I'm on Team Agent Venom so any other portrayal of the character will always feel lesser to me anyway )

[Frontier]

Like you mentioned, the only reason he was a villain to begin with was because of his hatred for Peter/Spider-Man. Without that, there's no reason for them to go fully bad. As someone who's never completely cared about Eddie alot, Cates' run is the most I've been invested with him in a long time.

Also I think him working as an anti-hero is alot more interesting, especially for someone as unhinged as Venom, seeing them try to do good, but their own tendencies push them in badder directions. (And I'm on Team Agent Venom so any other portrayal of the character will always feel lesser to me anyway )

You said it yourself though, Eddie Brock is a very unhinged individual with a very warped sense of justice and priorities. Depending on how you play that he could still very easily be a villain beyond his hatred of Spider-Man.

I don't know. I've only read the first few issues of Cates' Venom but the Symbiote mythology seems more interesting then his Eddie, who just feels like a bit of a generic dude attached to a Symbiote sometimes rather then the original Venom that he's supposed to be.

OP Question -

For what it's worth I do either that or make Eddie Anti-Venom again. I've never been a big fan of Eddie as anti-hero Venom. IMO Eddie is too dark a character with too hateful an (initial) motivation to make an effective anti-hero. The guy might see himself as a hero but he is in no way a real hero. I think the best solution would be Eddie back as Anti-Venom with his "divine healing mission" while the Venom Symbiote goes off and resurrects Flash.

Flash makes more sense as Anti-Venom at this point.

[Agent Z]

I wish someone found a way to restore David Michelinie's concept of a pregnant woman hosting the symbiote or Venom jumping from host to host. Eventually when Michelinie heard they wanted to make Venom an anti-hero, he created Carnage as a replacement.

I remember watching The Spectacular Spider-Man cartoon and it had my favorite version of the Symbiote saga, where Spider-Man finds the symbiote gets the black suit and the symbiote develops a personality and obsessive attachment on Peter and becomes a jilted host. To me the Symbiote was the villain, and a much better one than Eddie Brock. At least in that version there.

Having said that I liked the Venom 2018 movie tremendously and I finally got the appeal of Brock and Venom in that. And I am absolutely unironically anticipating Carnage in the sequel.

Venom hasn't really been as impressive a villain after Michelinie left, and he's maybe not been that impressive as an anti-hero until Donny Cates arrived.

The real problem is that Brock isn't much as a character. He never was.

Even if the Eddie Brock Venom weren't the most popular version no one would touch Michelinie's idea of a pregnant woman being the Venom host with a ten foot pole because of the potential backlash. And not just because Eddie is the iconic Venom.

As for the symbiote jumping from host to host, the comics have been doing that for decades. At least four other people have been Venom.

[Ursalink]

Please, no. Venom left that role or being "just another Spider-Man's villain" long ago. Besides, Carnage would deserve that place at Spider-Man's Rogue gallery way more than Venom.

[Frontier]

Please, no. Venom left that role or being "just another Spider-Man's villain" long ago. Besides, Carnage would deserve that place at Spider-Man's Rogue gallery way more than Venom.

Carnage's whole deal is being "worse then Venom" so I think Venom still has a role as far as being a Spider-Man Rogue .

[Snoop Dogg]

Even if the Eddie Brock Venom weren't the most popular version no one would touch Michelinie's idea of a pregnant woman being the Venom host with a ten foot pole because of the potential backlash.

David Michelinie and his Stand, [B A B Y F A C E]!

[Frontier]

David Michelinie and his Stand, [B A B Y F A C E]!

Di Molto .

[Celgress]

..I don't know. I've only read the first few issues of Cates' Venom but the Symbiote mythology seems more interesting then his Eddie, who just feels like a bit of a generic dude attached to a Symbiote sometimes rather then the original Venom that he's supposed to be...

I agree, in fact, other than when Eddie gave up the Symbiote and later became Anti-Venom he has always been bland IMO. Honestly, there isn't really much to Eddie beyond his past dislike of Spider-Man and his warped sense of morality.