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  1. #736
    My Face Is Up Here Powerboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pinsir View Post
    I don't even know what you are saying. Of course these people thought the movie was going to be bad.
    I think the point is, how can you think a movie that neither you nor, at the time, anyone else has seen, is going to be bad- or good for that matter?

    Flip a coin. You have a 50/ 50 chance of being right. Well, since the MCU has a pretty decent track record, maybe not but, theoretically, 50/ 50.

    So the only reason these people could have for thinking the movie would be bad would be for reasons that have nothing to do with the movie itself or simply that any movie that they think will present a message or point of view they don't like is bad.

    Granted that tends to be par for the course. On a scale of zero to a hundred, personally dislike the idea equals zero and personally liked equals one hundred with no in between.
    Power with Girl is better.

  2. #737
    Original CBR member Jabare's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pinsir View Post
    Only the most deluded thought this film was going to flop, so citing Captain Marvel's box office tally doesn't really amount to much. Superhero films make big money, this isn't new.

    What mattered most was the quality of the film and its mediocre trash. Any one who was critical of the film prior to its release has essentially been vindicated.
    not all Superhero films make big money, when you consider the economics of movies. The risk and gamble involved. If you're spending let's say $250M production budget than millions on marketing and splitting revenue with the theaters you may need $500M+ to break even. So if a film tanks like Justice League or underperforms the return on investment isn't nearly as well. But if a film has a low budget like $90M to $100M the risk is a little less and the reward is potentially all the greater. So I don't think you can say all superhero movies make big money because that actually hasn't been the case across the board unless we are just talking about marvel and even than the success of those films has risen dramatically from the Pre-Avengers movies.

    Anyone who was critical in what way? I think the criticism for this film has been all over the place. Also the film is sitting at a fresh rating from critics and audience members at the moment, correct me if I'm mistaken.
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  3. #738
    Extraordinary Member Jokerz79's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Powerboy View Post
    I think the point is, how can you think a movie that neither you nor, at the time, anyone else has seen, is going to be bad- or good for that matter?

    Flip a coin. You have a 50/ 50 chance of being right. Well, since the MCU has a pretty decent track record, maybe not but, theoretically, 50/ 50.

    So the only reason these people could have for thinking the movie would be bad would be for reasons that have nothing to do with the movie itself or simply that any movie that they think will present a message or point of view they don't like is bad.

    Granted that tends to be par for the course. On a scale of zero to a hundred, personally dislike the idea equals zero and personally liked equals one hundred with no in between.
    You asked in another thread to rank MCU films I ranked Captain Marvel at 16 of 21 films and note I don't hate or not enjoy a single MCU film I like them all but Captain Marvel was low on my list I didn't love it or hate it, it was just a fun entertaining film. But I went into the film expecting that it seems people who really hated the film I don't mean those who disliked as a mediocre marvel movie but those who HATED it went in wanting to hate it and looked for every flaw here are some a arguments.

    She has no hero's journey or character arc true but neither did Steve Rogers in First Avenger he started patriotic boyscout willing to sacrifice himself and ended that way.

    They revealed her origin on earth in the beginning losing any mystery also true but it was more about us watching her discover like a Columbo story and also if someone hated this then they also should hate every Superman story when he discovers his Kryptonian heritage.

    She's a Mary Sue well the film showed she had training by both the Air Force and Kree so if she's a Mary Sue so is every Action Hero of the 80's and 90's.

    She never smiles and wooden. Bull she smiled a lot she smiled at Jude Law on the train, the security guard who showed her radio shack, Stan Lee, Nick and the Rambeau's a bunch of times. As for chemistry with actors that's subjective.

    Her big stand up moment was an attack on men as she stood up to patriarchy well yes and no. True she used all the men who told her no growing up as motivation to get up and defeat the Supreme Intelligence but the Supreme Intelligence was represented by a Woman and if Annette Bening represents patriarchy that's news to me.

    Plot holes like how did Mar-Vell get the Tesserect from Howard Stark? Well Howard gave it to Shield and we know Shield was using it to develop technology and as for the vetting of Wendy Lawson/Mar-Vell well Shield was half Hydra their vetting kind of sucked. Also why need Light speed when they had light speed no they had jump technology which took you too one spot in space and if not your final destination you had to travel to it by normal space engines so this was like going from propellers to jet engines for the travel between jump points.

    Real world mistakes like songs not being released when the movie is set well Captain America led a multicultural Howling Commandos when our real military was segregated.

    My point is people will always find mistakes they're usually willing to forgive or forget if they want to hate something.
    Last edited by Jokerz79; 03-19-2019 at 09:50 PM.

  4. #739
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pinsir View Post
    Only the most deluded thought this film was going to flop, so citing Captain Marvel's box office tally doesn't really amount to much. Superhero films make big money, this isn't new.

    What mattered most was the quality of the film and its mediocre trash. Any one who was critical of the film prior to its release has essentially been vindicated.
    Can you elaborate on what mediocre trash is? I know a film like Twilight is trash, and something like Thor 2 is mediocre, but what exactly constitutes mediocre trash? Captain Marvel is certainly not trash. Many here have made good faith arguments as to why they believed it was mediocre or sub-par, and these are thoughts I don't agree with but I can see that they are not insincere. That is their opinion. The general opinion is that the film is above average, with Larson doing a good job as Carol Danvers. It's your opinion that the film is trash, and that, like all others, is a subjective one.

    If you're arguing that people on the Internet had a subjective, prejudiced opinion on a movie they had not seen then I cannot really argue against that. You are correct. Congratulations. It, however, in this context, is certainly a very strange and distorted use of the word "vindicated."

    And as Jabare says, not all superhero films make big money.

    If you haven't been paying attention, what a lot of the other posters have been saying is that many YouTubers and manbabies did say Captain Marvel was going to flop, and now they are being called out on their dud predictions. They also claimed that the opening tracking numbers were wrong (not), the weekday drop-off was totally outside the norm (not) and that Disney was/is padding box office numbers (no evidence, so just blatant lies). They have been proven wrong in every single argument they have tried to manufacture because they have an agenda against this film.

    Now you're even making unsubstantiated claims that Disney forced Rotten Tomatoes to change how it operates. As another poster highlighted, Warner Bros. has a stake in RT, and all this time they've been allowing users to downvote DC films whilst in the blink of an eye and at the beck and call of Disney they'll do anything to help Captain Marvel.
    Last edited by Conn Seanery; 03-20-2019 at 02:50 PM.

  5. #740
    BANNED Killerbee911's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sammy_hansen View Post
    Now you're even making unsubstantiated claims that Disney forced Rotten Tomatoes to change how it operates. As another poster highlighted, Warner Bros. has a stake in RT, and all this time they've been allowing users to downvote DC films whilst in the blink of an eye and at the beck and call of Disney they'll do anything to help Captain Marvel.
    Slight Correction Comcast/Universal(70%) and WB(30%) own Rotten Tomatoes. So two of biggest media companies have been letting fans downvote their movies.

    While we are on conspiracies this old article is great.

    DC: 67.7% Average Tomatometer Score
    Marvel: 64.1% Average Tomatometer Score
    Last edited by Conn Seanery; 03-20-2019 at 02:50 PM.

  6. #741
    Ultimate Member WebLurker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pinsir View Post
    I don't even know what you are saying. Of course these people thought the movie was going to be bad.
    That's the case every time one is made. I'm not sure what the point is. Captain Marvel is, no matter how you slice it, an unqualified success, and the fact that there were a few people who didn't like it doesn't change that.
    Doctor Strange: "You are the right person to replace Logan."
    X-23: "I know there are people who disapprove... Guys on the Internet mainly."
    (All-New Wolverine #4)

  7. #742
    Extraordinary Member Divine Spark's Avatar
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    I wonder if this is going to happen with every Brie Larson movie.

  8. #743
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Shape View Post
    I wonder if this is going to happen with every Brie Larson movie.
    No but it might happen with every Carol Danvers movie.

  9. #744
    My Face Is Up Here Powerboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Shape View Post
    I wonder if this is going to happen with every Brie Larson movie.
    Probably only ones that would have appeal to a comic book crowd which besides the obvious superhero movies would include sci fi, action and possibly fantasy if it is something that would have huge appeal to a male crowd and a particular kind of male crowd at that. Unless it's a genre that would be considered mostly "macho" or a boy's club, there would be little use in doing hateful youtube videos and articles because the target audience for those things would not have enough interest in a lot of other types of movies to even bother watching the videos or reading the articles. The reason it has such an impact with "Captain Marvel" is because it's in a genre they are interested in.

    But I cannot emphasize enough how much I think it's an Internet phenomenon that most people in real life either have no awareness of or no interest in.
    Power with Girl is better.

  10. #745
    Original CBR member Jabare's Avatar
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    breaking down another insane conspiracy theory

    The J-man

  11. #746
    Ultimate Member JKtheMac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jabare View Post
    breaking down another insane conspiracy theory
    This video highlights one thing that the conspiracy ignores. Cinema managers are not usually shy in coming forward. They will happily talk about anything to anyone who will listen, because they are at the end of the industry that usually gets ignored. The fact that we only got an anonymous correspondent who was only providing anecdotal evidence was always suspect. If every other manager started to say ‘huh... my theatre too’ then maybe there could have been something going on.

    However, as the guy said so many times I lost count ‘this doesn’t make any sense’. There would be no logical reason at all to do this. And on the flip side it would be potentially damaging to the reputation of either the distributors, or Disney generally. Not likely and the numbers would be too low to make any difference. The Risk v reward ratio is too high. If someone did this without the board’s express permission they would never work in the industry again. If the board did it they could be prosecuted for fraud in high profile and share price damaging litigation. All over a relatively cheap superhero movie that is not their most high profile movie this year.
    Last edited by JKtheMac; 03-22-2019 at 03:43 AM.

  12. #747
    My Face Is Up Here Powerboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JKtheMac View Post
    This video highlights one thing that the conspiracy ignores. Cinema managers are not usually shy in coming forward. They will happily talk about anything to anyone who will listen, because they are at the end of the industry that usually gets ignored. The fact that we only got an anonymous correspondent who was only providing anecdotal evidence was always suspect. If every other manager started to say ‘huh... my theatre too’ then maybe there could have been something going on.

    However, as the guy said so many times I lost count ‘this doesn’t make any sense’. There would be no logical reason at all to do this. And on the flip side it would be potentially damaging to the reputation of either the distributors, or Disney generally. Not likely and the numbers would be too low to make any difference. The Risk v reward ratio is too high. If someone did this without the board’s express permission they would never work in the industry again. If the board did it they could be prosecuted for fraud in high profile and share price damaging litigation. All over a relatively cheap superhero movie that is not their most high profile movie this year.
    And yet, when you scroll down to the comments, most of the people responding are ignoring everything he said including how easy it would be to produce this evidence if there was any and going right back to their baseless conspiracy theories because that's what they want to believe.
    Power with Girl is better.

  13. #748
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    Where do people find the energy to be this insane? It looks exhausting from here.

  14. #749
    Chad Jar Jar Pinsir's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sammy_hansen View Post
    Now you're even making unsubstantiated claims that Disney forced Rotten Tomatoes to change how it operates. As another poster highlighted, Warner Bros. has a stake in RT, and all this time they've been allowing users to downvote DC films whilst in the blink of an eye and at the beck and call of Disney they'll do anything to help Captain Marvel.
    This talking point that RT is owned by WB and therefore is authentic/reliable/trustworthy when it addresses WB films has never been valid. RT makes money off of the MCU, in fact the popularity of the site is partially attributed to the success of the MCU. RT doesn't have to be controlled by Disney for them to take strides to protect a Disney property simply because they are such cash cow.

    My criticism of RT has always been more nuanced than, 'lel, Disney bought them!' anyway. I have no doubt when RT reviewers click the the 'Fresh' button when they submit a film review they mean it. Its just the roster of critics that RT hosts now consist of 'nerd/pop' reviewers that lack the lack the knowledge to critic cinema. For example, the MCU is notorious for its poor cinematography, yet, reviewers will rarely bring this subject up, as they are focusing mostly on character, plot and how progressive the film is.
    #InGunnITrust, #ZackSnyderistheBlueprint, #ReleasetheAyerCut

  15. #750
    Death becomes you Osiris-Rex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pinsir View Post
    This talking point that RT is owned by WB and therefore is authentic/reliable/trustworthy when it addresses WB films has never been valid. RT makes money off of the MCU, in fact the popularity of the site is partially attributed to the success of the MCU. RT doesn't have to be controlled by Disney for them to take strides to protect a Disney property simply because they are such cash cow.

    My criticism of RT has always been more nuanced than, 'lel, Disney bought them!' anyway. I have no doubt when RT reviewers click the the 'Fresh' button when they submit a film review they mean it. Its just the roster of critics that RT hosts now consist of 'nerd/pop' reviewers that lack the lack the knowledge to critic cinema. For example, the MCU is notorious for its poor cinematography, yet, reviewers will rarely bring this subject up, as they are focusing mostly on character, plot and how progressive the film is.
    Another thing to keep in mind is most of the top executives of Fandango, the owner of Rotten Tomatoes, have previously worked for Disney. So it probably isn't too far fetched to think they might still have some loyalty to Disney.
    Even if no one from Disney picked up the phone, they might still be protective of the brand more than they would for other studios.

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