Agents of SHIELD (SPOILERS)

[Elegant Dreamer]

I'm thinking we'll get some scenes in the real world before the end of this arc, since we've still got Aida Prime, Yo-Yo and Russian Dude With His Head in a Bucket.

Russian Dude With His Head in a Bucket . I love this! This should be his code name from now on!

I'm hoping that Ghost Rider comes back and helps freeing Daisy and Jenna from the Framework; my deranged logic is that since the Framework is based off the evil book, Ghost Rider's powers might work.

For some strange reason, the more I saw Burnell (the kid who stray painted the car) I wondered if we're seeing SHIELD's version of Warlock (from the New Mutants); I was really convinced when Jenna called him a 'rouge code,' but maybe it's me.

[Saturius]

The only people we know in the framework who aren't correct is Aida and Jemma, because Jemma
I agree it's possible the framework is an actual reality due to the Darkhold instead of just being a simulation. It might be rather matrix'y but it would be cool if they kept the framework for training after this arc ends since I don't think they can really justfy pulling the plug as it'll kill the original aida and radcliffe.

Well Radcliffe is pretty much dead in the real world anyway since Aida slit his wrists before throwing him into the simulation.

[AndrewCrossett]

For some strange reason, the more I saw Burnell (the kid who stray painted the car) I wondered if we're seeing SHIELD's version of Warlock (from the New Mutants); I was really convinced when Jenna called him a 'rouge code,' but maybe it's me.

That would depend on the Framework being a real alternate world and not a computer simulation, of course. Or not just a computer simulation.

[The Cool Thatguy]

So basically this entire world is predicated on justifying May killing a kid.

Well...that is 'What If' level WTFness

[AndrewCrossett]

So basically this entire world is predicated on justifying May killing a kid.

Well...that is 'What If' level WTFness

At first I thought maybe this whole world butterflied out from that one incident... May saves kid, kid causes catastrophe, Hydra takes advantage... but that wouldn't explain why Coulson was never an agent in this reality, since he was with SHIELD long before that incident.

[Tracer Bullet]

Isn't it also a kind of wish fulfillment machine? So undoing all their regrets resulted resulted in this Hydrafied universe.

This show is superunderrated. Most consistently good compared to the other comic shows.

[Kirby101]

This show is superunderrated. Most consistently good compared to the other comic shows.

That's not really a word. But at the same time so true and so apt.

[Donald]

So basically this entire world is predicated on justifying May killing a kid.

May was the first one in the machine. She changed one thing and the world evolved around that. Everyone else was inserted into her changed world.

[Kirby101]

May was the first one in the machine. She changed one thing and the world evolved around that. Everyone else was inserted into her changed world.

She also seemed to be the most difficult to contain in the world. So this scenario was built for her.

[remydat]

May was the first one in the machine. She changed one thing and the world evolved around that. Everyone else was inserted into her changed world.

Yes I believe this is correct. The problem they were having with May was that she never believed the simulation because her life was too easy. So they fulfilled her greatest regret by not killing the kid and perhaps initially her not doing so was an idyllic world which May ultimately rejected. So the parameters were changed where May gets her wish of never killing the kid but then the Cambridge incident happened to create the conflict/strife that May needed to give her life purpose in the framework and prevent her from rejecting it.

The rest of the characters save Fitz (will get to him later) gets their wish fulfilled in the world that stemmed from May's wish. Mac gets his daughter, Coulson lives a quiet life, and I presume the Director is completely running Shield as a real leader and not just Coulson's puppet and perhaps with real powers rather than having to take the serum.

That brings us to Fitz. I think as others have suggested that Aida has some weird fascination or cares about him and so rather than grant his wish, she made him her consort of sorts in this world she created. The other alternative is that his secret wish was to be seen as a leader or powerful and so that wish was granted. Simmons was not a requirement for that wish to come true and since she and Daisy were never captured by the framework, there is no need for Aida to consider their feelings since they were essentially just computer code until the real Simmons and Daisy hacked into the framework.

There are two mysteries for me. The first is the Kid as he seemed awfully unafraid to bash Hydra given the world he lives in. So it gave the impression that he might be important in some way.

The second and more interesting is Ward. Daisy was never captured and put in the framework so he couldn't be her wish so there really is no reason for this world to have been created with him in it. In addition, it almost feels like in this world Ward's wish was being granted because he got to be a double agent but this time for the guys we consider to be the good guys. Maybe it's just an outgrowth of May's wish but given how Ward never seems to be completely dead, I wonder if somehow a part of the real Ward made it into this framework. I can't imagine how aside from maybe the Darkhold pulled him from some alternate dimension/reality. Of course, it could just be the creators like the actor and just wanted to find a way to put him back in the show but I wouldn't be surprised if this version of Ward someone emerges from the framework that very reason ie the creators simply always find a reason to keep the actor around on the show.

[Iron Fist]

Yes I believe this is correct. The problem they were having with May was that she never believed the simulation because her life was too easy. So they fulfilled her greatest regret by not killing the kid and perhaps initially her not doing so was an idyllic world which May ultimately rejected. So the parameters were changed where May gets her wish of never killing the kid but then the Cambridge incident happened to create the conflict/strife that May needed to give her life purpose in the framework and prevent her from rejecting it.

The rest of the characters save Fitz (will get to him later) gets their wish fulfilled in the world that stemmed from May's wish. Mac gets his daughter, Coulson lives a quiet life, and I presume the Director is completely running Shield as a real leader and not just Coulson's puppet and perhaps with real powers rather than having to take the serum.

That brings us to Fitz. I think as others have suggested that Aida has some weird fascination or cares about him and so rather than grant his wish, she made him her consort of sorts in this world she created. The other alternative is that his secret wish was to be seen as a leader or powerful and so that wish was granted. Simmons was not a requirement for that wish to come true and since she and Daisy were never captured by the framework, there is no need for Aida to consider their feelings since they were essentially just computer code until the real Simmons and Daisy hacked into the framework.

There are two mysteries for me. The first is the Kid as he seemed awfully unafraid to bash Hydra given the world he lives in. So it gave the impression that he might be important in some way.

The second and more interesting is Ward. Daisy was never captured and put in the framework so he couldn't be her wish so there really is no reason for this world to have been created with him in it. In addition, it almost feels like in this world Ward's wish was being granted because he got to be a double agent but this time for the guys we consider to be the good guys. Maybe it's just an outgrowth of May's wish but given how Ward never seems to be completely dead, I wonder if somehow a part of the real Ward made it into this framework. I can't imagine how aside from maybe the Darkhold pulled him from some alternate dimension/reality. Of course, it could just be the creators like the actor and just wanted to find a way to put him back in the show but I wouldn't be surprised if this version of Ward someone emerges from the framework that very reason ie the creators simply always find a reason to keep the actor around on the show.

Didn't the episode imply Fitz got what he wanted by his father never leaving him as a child? He quotes his father a few times, which he never does in the main universe cuz his dad left.

[AndrewCrossett]

There are two mysteries for me. The first is the Kid as he seemed awfully unafraid to bash Hydra given the world he lives in. So it gave the impression that he might be important in some way.

An authoritarian government like Hydra can't thrive without opposition. The population is kept frightened and in line by fear of an enemy, either internal or external. And we saw what happened when May didn't have an enemy to fight. The Framework allows the Resistance to exist in order to give Hydra a reason to exist.

The second and more interesting is Ward. Daisy was never captured and put in the framework so he couldn't be her wish so there really is no reason for this world to have been created with him in it.

I can't quite dismiss the suspicion that there's some connection between the Darkhold and Hydra/Hive.

[remydat]

Didn't the episode imply Fitz got what he wanted by his father never leaving him as a child? He quotes his father a few times, which he never does in the main universe cuz his dad left.

Yeah you're right. I missed those references.

[remydat]

An authoritarian government like Hydra can't thrive without opposition. The population is kept frightened and in line by fear of an enemy, either internal or external. And we saw what happened when May didn't have an enemy to fight. The Framework allows the Resistance to exist in order to give Hydra a reason to exist.

I can't quite dismiss the suspicion that there's some connection between the Darkhold and Hydra/Hive.

Oh I get that's why the Resistance exists but they are less open about their opposition. It's not like Ward walks around advertising he's Resistance. So it just seem odd that this kid wasnt scurried away given how open he was with his views. I thought maybe they were trying to go with Coulson being secretly sympathetic but then he had no real hesitation when the kid was removed from class and when he ratted out Simmons. So the openness of this kids opposition seemed odd but I guess we will see if he plays any role going forward.

As for the Hydra connection, it is not necessary for this would to exist given Mays wish but that doesn't mean they aren't involved somehow.

[AndrewCrossett]

Oh I get that's why the Resistance exists but they are less open about their opposition. It's not like Ward walks around advertising he's Resistance. So it just seem odd that this kid wasnt scurried away given how open he was with his views. I thought maybe they were trying to go with Coulson being secretly sympathetic but then he had no real hesitation when the kid was removed from class and when he ratted out Simmons. So the openness of this kids opposition seemed odd but I guess we will see if he plays any role going forward.

It's an interesting possibility that there are other real people within the Framework aside from the ones we know about. It's also possible that Aida and Radcliffe didn't create the Framework, but just gained access to one that already existed. Giving further evidence to the possibility that the Darkhold is our world's key to the multiverse. And also meaning that the Framework won't go away at the end of the season.